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Is this funding terrorism?

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by MobBoss, Jun 2, 2007.

?

Is this funding terrorism?

  1. Yes - this money will find its way to fund terrorism

    41.5%
  2. No - this money wont be used for terrorism

    30.8%
  3. Maybe - I just dont know and have no real opinion.

    27.7%
  1. brennan

    brennan Argumentative Brit

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    So, none then?

    Given how dire the need for aid in Palestine is, i'm not inclined to care much that some of the money will undoubtedly go to militant groups. If aid had not been cut off I doubt we would have seen the upsurge in violence that followed the election of HAMAS; and diplomacy and good relations could have brought the breakthrough everyone needs: HAMAS' recognition of Israel.
     
  2. MobBoss

    MobBoss Off-Topic Overlord

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    Huh? Didnt I link enough for you?
     
  3. brennan

    brennan Argumentative Brit

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    None of your links were relating to HAMAS, the organisation you spent 4 pages ranting about, and who aren't getting the money.

    Hyperbole getting the better of you?
     
  4. MobBoss

    MobBoss Off-Topic Overlord

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    Dude...you asked, and I quote:
    The organizations I listed are sub-units of Fatah and the PLO. The terrorist acts I listed is "terrorism blamed" on parts of Fatah and the PLO.

    Thus I answered your question. :crazyeye:

    /sheeeh. Why in the hell would I link to HAMAS when your own question was in regards to FATAH?

    My Goodness.:lol:

    Reading comprehension is your friend.
     
  5. brennan

    brennan Argumentative Brit

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    I was just wondering why you were convinced HAMAS were going to get the money... could it be that you lack the ability to think on this matter with clarity? :mischief:
     
  6. MobBoss

    MobBoss Off-Topic Overlord

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    Why? Because the money is targeted to pay for the government, and Hamas rules the majority of that government. I dont think that is an unreasonable assumption at all.

    But as I have shown its immaterial, as Fatah is of itself just as big a terrorist organization as hamas is.
     
  7. ArneHD

    ArneHD Just a little bit mad

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    It's another Why they fight article, but I really liked this one. Perhaps a bit more informative than others.
     
  8. Ecofarm

    Ecofarm Chieftain

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    Isreal withdrew from settlements. The world offers to acknowledge the PLO as a legitimate organization if they will abandon their terrorist agendas. Christians do not train their children to use suicide bombs. Isreal does not target civilians (they are not "guilty as charged" just like Hamas).


    .02
     
  9. Fugitive Sisyphus

    Fugitive Sisyphus Escape Artist

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    I hope you are not trying to rationalize Palestinian actions with this. But I guess you're right. If the Israelis did nothing and then the Palestinians killed all the Israelis, the Palestinians would wipe out Israel and get the land they want.
     
  10. Lockesdonkey

    Lockesdonkey Liberal Jihadist

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    Why do you care?
    In a way I am, in a way I'm not. In the strictest sense, I am "rationalizing" the Palestinian actions by saying that they are rational (they are, if you define "rational" as "acting in your faction's material best interests").

    However--and this is the most important point--I am not rationalizing in the traditional sense. To "rationalize" someone's actions, the way it is used day to day, is to "justify" the action--to say that they are morally right or correct. And in that sense I definitely am not rationalizing Palestinian agression: I don't think that it's right for the Palestinians to be so mistrustful and take their current course of action.
     
  11. Mott1

    Mott1 Chieftain

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    C~G: The first paragraph on your previous post makes it obvious that you are very confused on the subject of morality.
    If you do not presume to take a position of right or wrong, then how do you know for certain that I am wrong? You surrender your postion of moral neutrality by saying I am wrong and in the very next sentence you contradict yourself by claiming moral neutrality. How can you not see this?
    The remainder of your post amounts to you flip-flopping between a postion of moral objectivism and relativism, all the while rejecting moral absolutes. You seem to think that moral laws pop in to existance only in certain situations, then they disappear again. I have no problem addressing the rest of your post (even though I doubt you will grasp anything I say), but not at the expense of hijacking this thread. Create another thread if you are interested in debating this subject any further, maybe you will be able to convince me that you are right...er...I mean neutral on your position of neutral morality?:dunno:
     
  12. HannibalBarka

    HannibalBarka We are Free

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    Hamas will be more than happy by the transfer of the Israelis to "Nevada or Bavaria", as you'll be if Israel just "deport the whole lot of them, just march them to the Jordian or Egyptian border and dump em off there" to quote you.

    http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=5483644&postcount=11

    I noticed the use of the verb "dump", English is not my native language, but I had the impression that "to dump" is used for trash not human, Is that correct? I mean would some one say "I dumped my kids at school before heading to office"?
     
  13. C~G

    C~G Untouchable

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    Thank you for this nugget.
    Wrong about what?
    You didn't understand that for me the solution I offer doesn't have any morale qualities in it just simple TRUE/FALSE-question whether it helps to give money to palestinian government which aids them and might help resolve the conflict in long run even though part of the money to people with intensions to continue the conflict. This is the moral sceptic part of mine.

    If you asking the same question in moral sense for me it's kind of hard to answer since it depends from what perspective we're looking at the question. Example how much value we do put to the lives of murdered children by terrorists (not known number) compared to possible lives of murdered children (not known number) if the conflict continues. And this is just one part of the question. So in terms of RIGHT/WRONG, I might easily choose WRONG but still believe it's worth the shot give the money.
    I say again.
    I believe it's TRUE that it helps to give money while it can be morally WRONG from certain perspective. Maybe for you it also changes the overall tune of the question towards being WRONG and therefore FALSE, don't know as you haven't explained it.
    I believe moral laws pop in to existance indeed only as optional choices not as optimal choices. People may or may not count into them. And I do believe the part of moral sceptism (as I believe humans have only weak conscience) of humans will choose rather the TRUE/FALSE choice than the RIGHT/WRONG option when under stress.
    I believe it's impossible to make absolutely right, correct and complete moral decisions unless you choose specific system of morals and additionally morals ain't existing outside human imagination and you see the effects only after everything has happened.

    But OK, let's not threadjack, answer me with pm, if you still have trouble following, otherwise thanks for the discussion and have a nice day. :)
     
  14. King Alexander

    King Alexander Universe explorer

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    I don't support attrocities done by either side(both sides have commited/commit crimes, not imho but a fact, period). I support law justice/punishment for those who do those crimes, plain and simple.

    I sympathise Israelis that get bombed randomly, because they're simple civilians.
    I sympathise Palestinians who get rocketed/bombarded randomly, because they're simple civilians.

    Now, as for the simple Palestinian civilians for the situation of this topic, that need immediate help or else they'll die, what one should suggest that it should be done, not send them money? Maybe we should send them to Ausvitz(or whatever is written) to get rid of them?
     
  15. LordRahl

    LordRahl The Objectivist

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    There is a difference between purposely launching rockets at civilians (like Palis do), and shooting back at the guys that are launching the rockets.

    It's not Israel's fault, that Hamas murderers are using Pali kids as human shields:
     
  16. Ziggy Stardust

    Ziggy Stardust New Englander

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    All the 'palestinian civilians' are either human shields or combatants with their guns removed after they have been shot anyway. Other scenarios are propaganda and should be ridiculed. Good night.

     
  17. HannibalBarka

    HannibalBarka We are Free

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    You mean when Israel launch missiles on a Gaza neigbourhood and kills civilians it is OK but when Palestinians launch Katiocha on Sderot and do kill civilians it is not?:crazyeye:
     
  18. skadistic

    skadistic Caomhanach

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    For the umpteenth million time the Israelis are targeting the rocket launchers who hide amongst civilians to get them killed. The rocket launchers are simply letting fly rockets in hopes of killing civilians. I know you refuse to see the difference but its there.
     
  19. C~G

    C~G Untouchable

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    All I can say that "Hell is paved with good intentions".

    Civilians or terrorists, you are still targeting the opponent and don't care a **** if someone gets hurt. That's the way it is.

    But I guess if other side is "hoping" to hit something else makes it all morally correct.
     
  20. HannibalBarka

    HannibalBarka We are Free

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    Oh and Israeli should not let their kids plays with rockets even when it's just to write love messages to "would be collateral damage" lebanese kids. It is shamefull brainwashing and hatred breading and letting kids at such risky places is criminal to say the least and shows how much those people love and care about their kids.
    As Golda Meir said "We'll have peace when the Israeli will love their kids more than they hate us".

    But, we can say the same thing about the Palestinians, can't we? Sure we can and that's why this "we are humans, they are beasts" "We are right, they are wrong" "we are good, they are evil" is not going to take us any where.
     

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