Isabella and the Chamber of Secrets

[jack merchant]

@Puppeteer It's probably anywhere between 5-15 pages back . Anyway, our reputation got trashed early on, which meant we were only capable of buying tech in peace treaties from then on out. I think the trades here were fair mostly - refining would most likely have been more expensive otherwise, but I have no idea how much more. And refining is a more expensive tech than Sci Meth AFAIK.
Anyway, all lurker comments are welcome .

I did make all the deals while negotiating peace - since we didn't fight the other continent much I think there wasn't any real disount involved.

What turns would you prefer playing Aggie, peace, war or both ? I don't think the next 10 turns will be all that heavy, but it does seem as if we will have at least one more war after the next one - we'll trash the Mongols with artillery, but starting a second front at the same time on the other island probably won't work - at best we'll take over the Celt island too and thus grab silks too. India will require a genuine D-Day invasion most likely.

 

[Aggie]

I suggest the following:

- Nad is up now, playing 10 turns
- I'm up next, playing 20. 10 turns of peace and 10 turns of war

I agree with you that the war after this one is the invasion of India

And I agree with you on the peace treaty too. It was fair and you gave more to the AI than they gave you The only civ that would pay us for peace was the Mongols, so you can be sure that the other deals are normal prices.

 

[Aggie]

"Got it!!!

I'm gonna try to play tonight...10 peace turns shouldn't take too long. After that, I think it would be best if you played 20 turns. Then, either Mad-Bax should play (as per normal roster) or if Meli can play soon, he can slip in there. We can discuss that when we come to it.

So:

Nad...UP NOW
Aggie...ON DECK (for 20, 10 peace, 10 war)
(Meli - if he can play soonish at this stage)
Mad-Bax
ControlFreak
Meli
Jack Merchant"

 

[ControlFreak]

Great! Go get 'em Nad (if you can hear this.)

 

[Aggie]

Nad wanted to make it as brief as possible :

"Chamber Of Secrets, 1700-1750AD

Early

Moved troops around. I removed the bulk of our cannon and cavalry out of the frontline cities, instead fortifying them just outside (they're still there). I feel that in this situation where these cities are miles from our capital but right next to Karakorum, the Mongol culture is 5x ours, so I do not wish to run the risk of losing the bulk of our offensive in a bad flip.

Looking at the Mongol empire, I reckon we can knock them off in 10 turns in the next war, which means we can go after India if we want, or perhaps mop up the Celt island and wait for the war after for one huge push. Thinking ahead, I think a space victory is possible if we want to grind it out and slow the tech pace by warring; alternatively, we could acheive a conquest victory during a war period by shipping over a massive force and going on a razing spree. What does everyone else think we should aim for?

At the moment the Indian military is twice the size of ours, which is no big deal at all considering our superior tactics.

With regard to building, I'm pushing infra again, with a view to leaving Aggie in a position where he can build up cavalry/artillery for 10 turns and use it to smash the Mongols. I'm not sure whether we need a navy just yet or if we should wait for the next set of peace turns to push the ships. I choose not to build any ships but Aggie can build some to take on the Celts/Indians if he wishes.

I cancelled the granaries and courthouses in far-off 3rd ring cities, as I don't think they will play any sort of significant role in the rest of the game. Instead, I used them to train workers and settlers. I did, however, rush some culture in the new front line cities. I also agree with Jack, that we don't need to bother with hospitals.

Middle

Did some trading, selling resources in pure gpt deals; no matter they're going to get broken, it's pure per turn on both sides so no-one's being ripped off. Besides, Isabella doesn't know she's going to go psycho again soon...

Tried to use workers to maximize production in core size 12 cities by changing irrigation to mines. Kept fiddling with sliders. Founded half a dozen new cities to plug gaps...not that big a deal in democracy but when we next go to monarchy they increase our free support.

Something strange happened in 1725. For some reason our major cities all rioted?! I wasn't given any sort of message about losing a lux so I don't know what happened, since these cities had all been perfectly content for the previous turns. I should have scrolled ahead to prevent further riots after the first couple but I was so surprised at the riots that I forgot to. So we lost one turn of production. Upped lux to 10% to rectify.

Late

One of those AAARRGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!! moments as the Indians discovered Atomic Theory one turn before we had it due

Traded atomic theory to the Mongols to pick up replacable parts and change. Signed some more resource deals as civs came up with cash (though not with India). Set research to electronics.

Wall Street was started in Madrid in 1745. As it appraoches completion we should lower science to get to the 1000gp threshold.

A couple of cities reached the stage where they will not need to build anything for the rest of the game, and can go for full-blown military training. A few more cities are approaching this stage. Police stations are desirable to help against war weariness so I am building them, although if we plan to revolt to monarchy each time, they can be vetoed. We might also want to look to save cash for a big arty upgrade.

Electronics is due in 10 turns at 60% science. As there is no cascade, we'll almost certainly get Hoover's (unless India gets the tech first and has a spare leader, but we can monitor that since we have a spy). We can probably take up to 15 turns if we want to lower science to get more cash and still be reasonably sure to get Hoovers.

Some cities have been perfected to maximize shields at size 12, several others still need irrigation changing to mines. We've now got a decent number of workers, plenty more being trained.

Good luck Aggie!!:"

I will first play 10 turns and then post the turnlog including save. After a few hours of discussion I will play the WAR part

EDIT: I hope that I make Nad proud of me by posting the save as well : 1750 AD save

 

[Aggie]

Nad suggest either Space or Conquest. I'd say: let's go for Space while at Peace and for Conquest/Domination while at war. In the spirit of Isabella

That last war was truly awesome We got rid of the Egyptians, crippled the Mongols and almost closed the technology gap! India is still communist and we lead in all important demographic stats. We will also get Hoover (almost certainly).

I suspect that we can kill the Mongols in the next war. I see us attacking the Indians in the war after that, with help of the airports and tanks. 75 artillery, a couple of infantry armies and 30 tanks should be enough to seriously hurt the Indians.

For the first time I dare to say that we are in a winning position! The AI will probably continue to be at war with each other, which obviously is a very good thing.

I also expect that war weariness is almost history. We won't allow others to conquer any cities anymore. The AI has trouble to fight overseas and the Mongols aren't a threat anymore

EDIT: I have a lot of troubles with my e-mail provider. I will play the peaceturns tomorrow and the war turns probably a few hours later, after comments from your side

EDIT2: Jack's tech steal allowed us to get back in the tech race. It was a masterful move and we should all think of that option the next time we are one turn before peace

 

[jack merchant]

Sounds good ! I wasn't sure where I left the cannon - got them out of the city of Guardia Civil next to Karakorum (a city to 'police' the Mongol capital ) but outside was safer. After expansion though it would have had only 2 tiles of overlap, which I think can easily be compensated by military presence there.

My vote would be to just wipe out the other continent - that might be quicker than waiting for the techs to come in. But 1750 AD ? Been a long time since I got that far in a game .


edit: and 75 artillery ? How about 120 ?

 

[jack merchant]

BTW, I checked and the cannon were in a totally flip-proof city - no cultural pressure in its native 21 and no memory of Mongol culture (which is the nice thing about raze & replace .

We'll likely need the ships in the West first as the Mongols have 2 cities on an island and we'll want the Celtic silks too. The quicker the Mongols are killed off, the bigger the chance we can stay at war as a republic.

 

[Aggie]

Originally posted by jack merchant
But 1750 AD ? Been a long time since I got that far in a game .

edit: and 75 artillery ? How about 120 ?

I just finished LK54, which also took a long time 75 arty, yes. We are playing 'only' emperor (Yes, I am starting to get confident )

 

[jack merchant]

Not to say cocky . 75 will do the trick too, but I just prefer to completely pummel the AI into submission .

 

[Aggie]

I was able to finish my ten peace turns yesterday evening.
India got Electronics 4 turns before we could research it. However, we have Hoover [dance].

I upgraded 15 cannons for a lot of money and we now have 35 artillery, 18 cavalry, 17 infantry, 2 settlers. Enough to take over the Mongol mainland with the good old 'plant settler - bombard the city to rubble with artillery - raze with cavalry, topped with pillaging by our conquistadors'. I am also building up galleons, but with only a few non-corrupted coastal cities this took a lot of time. We now have 1 of them and two in the queue.

I expect that I can keep on building up military while at war. I expect only a few losses. Leader that I may generate will be used to create a couple of infantry armies.

After the research of Electronics I decided to research Radio with a lone scientist.

I plan to post the save of the current situation for those interested.

 

[ControlFreak]

Just when the going gets good, I get going.

I am very, very sorry to do this to you, but I will no longer be participating in this game. I hope you can find another player or survive with four.

I posted my reasons in this thread.

Thanks for a great time. This was probably my most interesting SG I played while here at CFC. And you people were also great to post with. I wish you all well. Good luck with this game and with life.

I hope we may cross paths again.

 

[Aggie]

Sad to see CF go

This is the save at the start of the next war:

1772 AD save

I forgot to mention that the Mongols declared war on the Celts and that I planted a spy in the Mongolian capital:

This is the current world map:

Right now my plan is to conquer Mongolia and then the Celtish lands, like Jack suggested.

 

[Aggie]

I just finished my turns, but still have to create a decent turnlog. So here is MY quiz

What happened? :

a. We own our home continent

b. We have 60 artillery

c. The Mongols are history

d. We managed to settle on the Indian continent

e. The Indians have Battleships

f. The Indians have Tanks

g. The Indians entered the Modern Age

h. All of the above

 

[jack merchant]

a,b,c,e and possibly f......

I imagine the battleships are a royal PITA |?

 

[Aggie]

The answer is: a, b, e, f, g !!

Turn 1 (1772 AD)

Two infantry in Ta-Tu are redlined and the city is razed. Five workers are slaughtered.
Karakorum bombarded to size 12. A couple of elite units kill the odd cavalry. This gives us leader Nad. The leader is used for an army.

Lux rate still at 10%. We make 465 gpt.

IT: 3 cavs attack Valladolid. They manage to kill an infantry, but two of them are killed

Turn 2 (1774 AD) Ciudad Control Freak founded on the ruins of Ta-Tu.

Revolting to Republic...

We now have 45 artillery.

Karakorum bombarded to size 4, but not all defense is wounded. So I'll wait.

IT: The Mongols send in 4 cavalry. One kills a rifle in Valladolid.

Turn 3 (1776 AD) We are republic, lux is at 20% and we make 362 gpt

Our 48 artillery redline all the infantry in Karakorum. 4 cavs get killed, but we raze the city. The Pyramids, Hanging Gardens, Sistine, Shakespeare are razed with it Ciudad Nad founded on the rubble.

4 cavalry mop up 3 cavalry of Mongolia.

Turn 4 (1778 AD)

Darhan reduced to size 5 and three infantry plus one rifle red-lined. A knight army and three elite cavs raze the place.

The remaining arty redlines an infantry near our border. Two cavs are needed to kill him.

Turn 5 (1780 AD)

India has tanks! They'll be finished with the Ottomans soon and then switch back to Democracy.

Two infantry and two rifles redlined in Ulaanbataar.
3 elite cavs killed , but we raze Ulaanbataar. Ciudad Mad-Bax founded east of the ruins.

Two infantry redlined in Dalagna...something. It is razed by two vet cavs. Ciudad Jack Merchant founded on the same spot.

Almarikh's two infantry redlined. But not enough cavs to raze the place.

IT: Korea and India get a MA vs the Otto's The Mongols want to talk...

Turn 6 (1782 AD)

Almarikh is razed easily. Ciudad Aggie replaces it. Barun-Uurt razed.

Next Target, Kazan, can't be reached this turn. War Weariness gets worse. I have to up the lux to 30%. We make 310 gpt.

Turn 7 (1784 AD)

Two infantry and a rifle in Kazan redlined. Two elite and one vet cav raze the place. Ciudad Melifluous founded west of the ruins. Edrenet razed the same way. Armada founded to the south.

The war vs the Mongols progresses very fast. I urgently need ships now!!!

Turn 8 (1786 AD)

Mandalgovi razed. Logrono founded SW of it. Batshireet razed. We now have our continent for ourselves [dance].

Now to get those boats in place.

IT: The Koreans tried to plant a spy

Turn 9 (1788 AD) Rushing Galleons. This means no money for a tech steal...

Turn 10 (1790 AD) We now have 15 cavalry, 10 Galleons, 60 artillery. Just south of Logrono are four Galleons filled with units. Protect those Galleons, because India has battleships around! West of Logrono I have all our troops parked.

Looking at the diplo screen, I see that India is modern They have almost killed the Ottomans and Korea and the Celts also don't play a big role anymore. So it's more obvious than ever: it's us vs India. I figure that the next war is crucial. India might be launching their Space ship after that.

1790 AD save

The map:

The military. Note India's tanks and marines!!

 

[jack merchant]

Yuck ! They got modern faster than I expected........ this could get *very* ugly - nukes anyone ?

Most likely we'll have to nuke the crap out of the Indians too if they don't get all SS parts within the next 40 turns. Down to the wire !

One thing that occurred to me - is our jungle area developed enough to think about moving the palace north after all ? Competing economically with the Indians is going to be a major pain with our current Palace/FP setup........

And, of course, nice work Aggie

I just noticed....... A very happy birthday to Mad-bax ! [dance]

 

[Melifluous]

OK,

I got it.

10 turns of war right? Great all warred up and no-one to fight

Great work on clearing the Mongols off OUR island, I will try and get enough stuff together for Mad-Bax to make a mess of some Indian cities in his 5 turns of war

Happy B-Day Mad-Bax!

How old are you again

Melifluous

 

[Aggie]

@Mad-bax:

The schedule:
Meli.........UP NOW 10 turns of war
Mad-Bax...ON DECK 5 turns of war/5 turns of peace
ControlFreak.........no longer playing
Meli......................10 turns of peace
Jack Merchant.......10 turns of peace
Nad........................5 turns of peace/5 turns of war
Aggie....................10 turns of war - out from november 2nd to december 5th

 

[mad-bax]

I'm 40 Thanks a lot for reminding me.
I've been away from the boards for a while. What happened to CF?