I've built myself a box, crawled in, and nailed it shut.

[Core Imposter]

So, I am playing with a combination of seldom used in-game rules and self-imposed house rules and came across a wonderful situation.

Using vassals and colonies (with little experience with them) and tech brokering on. I've got 2 cap vassals and 2 colonies, all behind on tech to one degree or another and I traded for Democracy. So, while I haven't switched to emancipation, six of 18 civs have. But I can't trade my minions the democracy tech! Oh no, they'll be so unhappy they will never get Democracy researched! My empire is beginning to crumble! Help!

 

[NickGabben]

So, I am playing with a combination of seldom used in-game rules and self-imposed house rules and came across a wonderful situation.

Using vassals and colonies (with little experience with them) and tech brokering on. I've got 2 cap vassals and 2 colonies, all behind on tech to one degree or another and I traded for Democracy. So, while I haven't switched to emancipation, six of 18 civs have. But I can't trade my minions the democracy tech! Oh no, they'll be so unhappy they will never get Democracy researched! My empire is beginning to crumble! Help!

Can't you just gift them all the way up? Nationalism, Constitution, Printing press and whatever else they need? Eventually, you'll be able to give them Democtacy.

(Or is there a typo and tech brokering is off?)

 

[AcaMetis]

I'm assuming the "No Tech Brokering" custom option is on, meaning he cannot trade/give away Democracy as he obtained it in a trade rather than research it himself.

As for options, you could theoretically use spies to force other civs out of Emancipation, but they'll just switch right back at first opportunity. I can't see a solution bar making sure your vassals have a good supply of various happy resources, and just weather the storm either until they are able to research/trade for Democracy with someone else, or the UN is build and (eventually) forces everyone into the civic regardless of whether they've got the research to do so or not.

 

[Core Imposter]

Pardon me. No tech brokering. I cannot help them.

I guess I'll just stay in caste system a little longer and ride it out. There isn't much to be gained by switching myself. I can perhaps flip the tech leader out for a few turns, I have the points. Which I think will at least slow her down a bit.

Live and learn or learn and forget which these days seems to be the theme. This probably won't be so bad. Thanks for the comments.

 

[Core Imposter]

The advantage of being stupid is that you can get a good laugh at yourself. I indeed did spend over 5k espionage points to flip Hatty's civics.

A spiritual leader. Brilliant.

 

[AcaMetis]

Honestly, even if she wasn't spiritual she'd swap back into Emancipation immediately after the five turn cooldown is over. That's just Civ IV AIs for you.

 

[Core Imposter]

Yeah, but. She is 4 or 5 techs ahead and I was hoping to slow her up a bit by putting her in anarchy. I play these self-limiting rules...long story, the point is that she is going to be a chore. So many questions I have coming back and playing a new style. Why is she teching around flight? She got airships first and has radio and tanks. I can build, er, anti-tank units. Not good. Already had a war with her and she is plotting.

She is teching artillery and has a ton of transport in a city with a big stack of cannon, looks like she has a plan. So, this brings up another question. Does the
AI load up transports and leave them in port waiting to finish its build and then launch? I can almost smell a load of tanks in those transports and a raid seems so spicy.

 

[AcaMetis]

If watching AI Survivor has taught me anything it's that AIs have very little to no clue what they are doing most of the time RE: Tech choices .

 

[Core Imposter]

I haven't followed any of that series, but I know it. It does take a little of the immersion away knowing that you can leave cities totally unprotected and the AI doesn't even take it into account when determining war plans. Humans would notice, even the dumb ones.

 

[0urBall]

If watching AI Survivor has taught me anything it's that AIs have very little to no clue what they are doing most of the time RE: Tech choices .

Or that Hatty is hopless at war...

 

[Plains-Cow]

Why not just force them free and DOW them for their land? You can make better use of their cities than they can. How are you trying to win?

 

[Core Imposter]

Why not just force them free and DOW them for their land? You can make better use of their cities than they can. How are you trying to win?

Oh, yes, I am playing a set of house rules that does not allow it. The unhappiness hasn't been a problem yet, for me. I was looking for a different sort of game experience and I am getting it. Nothing to write home about but I am relearning and learning new things about this old game.

 

[Core Imposter]

I just need to remember not to trade for democracy if I play with these rules again.

 

[Lennier]

Why not trade for Democracy? You get Emancipation unhappiness even if you don’t know Democracy.

 

[Plains-Cow]

Why not trade for Democracy? You get Emancipation unhappiness even if you don’t know Democracy.

Which is unfair, btw, to get that penalty when you don't even know what emancipation is as a philosophical concept. Otherwise there should be a default penalty just for being in the "slavery" civic.

 

[Core Imposter]

So, it ended up not being a factor so far as I can tell. Emancipation was forced by the UN. The happiness from having many vassals and colonies canceled out any problems I might have had. I have no way of knowing to what degree if any the pacified Civs were hamstrung by the penalty.