Discussion in 'Civ3 - Succession Games' started by jarred!, Apr 25, 2019.
Kill 'em all!!!
We have no good crossing points, though we haven't looked east too much. However, the Byzantines haven't come to us, and they have the GLH. If 5-move dromon and safe on sea tiles isn't enough to reach us, there isn't any easy crossing.
I'd prefer to research navigation than ship chain with lots of galley sinkings. Two techs after education won't take too long.
It sounds like everyone is okay with making contact, so I'll try to do that in my turnset.
How to win:
SuedecivIII: Domination or Space
Judminder: Space or whatever
There's a galley near Tiwanaku, and one on the east coast of the unsettled island to the north, ready to suicide.
I think space will take a while, and have many 'just hit enter' turnsets, but would probably suit this map well.
I'd rather play for Dom at this point. Colonize our outer islands while we try to find a reliable crossing, and then head overseas to grab the rest of the needed territory.
And there we have it.
Since this is @jarred!'s game, I think @jarred!'s choice should carry more/ the most weight. I'm happy to settle for genociding just the Incans and the Dutch, if that's cool with everyone else...?
(But please, please, pleeease can we avoid ICS-farming...?)
Shouldn't have to ICS, just switch to Feudalism so we can rush some quick culture in our new towns, for the expansions.
I'm ok with being Dictator, maybe we'll play a science game next? we'll play a science game next.
Hmm, I thought we were planning on Conquest as our victory condition. OTOH, Domination certainly simplifies the endgame.
All right, I'll plan to try to make contact with some more tribes, eliminate the Inca (perhaps waiting until after we make contact with the purple people in hopes of getting chivalry from the GL, but not if we are dealing with sinking galleys), and build some settlers for the nearby islands. I'll start playing tonight, but I may not finish until tomorrow night.
Do the Inca even have Chivalry for us to learn? I thought they (like the Dutch) lacked even Monotheism...
The Inca know chivalry - they are building Knights Templar in one of their two towns. I wasn't planning on letting them finish it for us.
We'll learn monotheism this turn from the GL, as both the Dutch and the Inca know it.
Oh, somehow I missed that
In that case, I'd say make contact with another tribe or two before killing the Incas.
I sank about 20 boats, but we finally made contact with the Byzantines and the Indians, and the Inca are gone. I've started settling the nearby islands, and I stupidly dropped a settler in the middle of the marsh that hasn't yet been cleared. (He isn't where he should make a town, either; it should go one tile southwest.) We now have chivalry. The Byzantines are up Theology, and we'll learn Engineering this IBT.
Spoiler Boring turn log: :
Turn 0 – unload MDIs, rush Vilcas settler, stop worker that is mining the tile Vilcas is moving to.
IBT: Learn monotheism from GL, Byzantines finish Leonardo's Workshop, settler-disband Vilcas, lose a boat.
Turn 1 – 860
Send boats out. Take Ica – lose 1 MDI, kill 2 spears, 1 MDI promotes to elite.
IBT: Lose 3 galleys.
Turn 2 – 870
Worker actions and boat moving. Settle so we can irrigate the Tepexpan peninsula.
IBT: Byzantines build Knights Templar, we lose a boat. Start more boat builds and settlers.
Turn 3 – 880
Short-rush some galleys.
IBT: Vitcos flips.
Turn 4 – 890
Move to retake Vitcos. Lose an MDI killing an esword, 2nd MDI promotes to elite.
Turn 5 – 900
IBT: Lose a galley.
Turn 6 – 910
Retake Vitcos. Build Zitlaltepec.
IBT: Lose some galleys.
Turn 7 – 920
IBT: Learn Chivalry from GL. Lose some galleys
Turn 8 – 930
Move on Incan capital, since they no longer have any techs.
IBT: Lose boats
Turn 9 – 940
Take Arequipa, Inca are gone. Upgrade a few horses.
Turn 10 – 950
Boat makes it across! Meet Byzantines and Indians, declare on them. We'll learn engineering on the IBT.
2. CKS (just played)
3. tjs (up)
4. judminder (on deck)
Make any progress heading to the east?
Nope, those boats all sank. I think only four boats made it past their first IBT in the water, and none of them were in the east. Most of the boats went west, though, since that is where they were.
OK I gottit. Looks pretty good
We have multiple boats sailing west? Now we've met the Indians and Byzzies, seems to me that we might as well (continue to) explore their coasts as far as they will 'let' us?
I assume the Settlers in boats near the former Mongol/Inca islands are intended to be dropped off ASAP to found Domination-towns? i.e. settle at roughly CxxC around the coasts, to grab all the Coastal tiles using the minimum number of Settlers (and ideally without needing Culture-buildings in 1-shield areas)?
Spoiler Something like this...? :
For all of the following, I aimed to plant on the islands' extremities, while also maximising food by avoiding settlement on Cows/Wheat, and prioritising Hills and Tundra sites (1 FPT --> 3 FPT) over Grass...
Inca NE island:
Here my Settlement rules left the Fish unused, hence the question-marked dot.
Mongol Tundra island:
Two towns get us all 5 4/5 food resources without building Culture...
(EDIT for derp)
Here, the Forest would (eventually) get us more Domination-tiles, but this spot can use 2 irrigated Grass on the mainland...
Spoiler Not so sure about this dotmap, though... :
Inca NW island:
This assumes that we leave Ica and Arequipa where they are. I'm not sure I like that idea much. I'd rather move both towns 1SE from their current positions (to the Horse-Hill and the Tundra, respectively). Then we could plant another CxxC town on the Tobacco (and the southernmost Tundra-town in that screenie could be moved 1NW)
Do we (also) want to Settle the Incan interior? Though it wouldn't add to our tile-total, I figure we could fit a couple more Pop12-ers on the rivers in between MaPi and Cuzco, and (once they have Courthouses) they might even become semi-useful, given their relative proximity to Tenoch...
Spoiler Incan re-Settlement plan? :
The Galleys in the SE sector can suicide-run east after dropping off their Settlers.
We also have several e*Horses kicking around our mainland. Do we want these upgraded (it's not like we're short of cash...), or should they simply be left to die glorious deaths against potential AI Cav-landings? Likewise, many towns are still defended by Spears. I guess we can leave them their bronze weapons, unless/until an AI lands outside their town -- and then upgrade (or reinforce) as needed?
I'll keep us at zero-SCI% unless/until Edu comes in, then crank up to max. (deficit spending?) for Astro --> Navi, while also building (more) Galleys for upgrading (because for sure we're going to lose the ones we have out there, one way or another).
May not be able to start playing tomorrow (younger son's birthday), but will do my best to be done by the end of the weekend.
Hey, I just looked at the Space-Race screen out of curiosity, and found that the Ottos aren't on it anymore! I went back through the end-of-set-saves, and the last one I have where they're still alive is dated 550 AD (@Judminder's last set). So we now have contact with everyone...
IMO, the import of the first three islands is in expanding our culture borders, not in their food tiles. TBH, I think we could ignore all of the outlying islands in favor of going on the warpath on the other continent, except that the settlement project gives us some intermediate goals before we can cross the ocean
With that in mind, the ? spot on the Inca island is good. I don't care about resettling Ica or Arequipa, but I'm fine with the new towns you've outlined in Old Incan lands.
I'd go ahead and upgrade the horsemen.
I don't care about food on the islands, just domination tiles. We need another town on the tundra island, and we might get all the tiles more easily with a couple of towns moved on the other islands, but it isn't a big deal either way.
If you want to move some towns around, I'm okay with that, but I also would be happy to leave them alone.
I'd upgrade the e*horses - we have lots of money and can use more knights as an invasion force. I don't expect that we'll have to worry about invaders much. Once the great library expires, I think we'll get to navigation more quickly than the AI, and we'll hit domination shortly after we can reach them, especially if we take all the available tiles while we wait.
I'm with the consensus. Also, Astro and Nav should cost 1680 breakers (first civ costs), so 420/turn to 4-turn either of them. With 4 civs left (India, Byz, Ned, Us), cost decreases by a factor of 1/7 (~14%) for each civ that learns a tech before us, if anyone is interested
Do coast/sea tiles work towards a domination victory? I thought it was just land area.
Coast counts towards dom limit, sea doesn't, ocean is irrelevant.
Oh wow, I didn't know. No wonder it's kind of hard on archi maps sometimes!
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