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JAR03: Portugal, DG, Space Race

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Succession Games' started by jarred!, Aug 14, 2019.

  1. CKS

    CKS Deity

    Feb 9, 2004
    Thanks for the update. Sounds like the core has been transformed.:)
  2. tjs282

    tjs282 Disillusionist

    May 19, 2009
    ...just here for the job/ handouts/ woman
    Yeah, pretty much :)

    Here's the turnlog:
    Spoiler 1100-1150 AD :
    T 0, 1100 AD
    We have >1500 gold in the Treasury, why not spend it?
    Upping the SCI%-slider to 80% gets us down to 5T on Industry, at -56g (so, if I can than reduce SCI% on Turn 5, it should actually only cost us about 225 gold, minus whatever we get back on the last turn)
    Check around the core-towns:
    Where a Cav is due in 1T, I leave it (Luanda's Cav-build switched to an Inf, to reduce shield-overrun; we could also use a decent Cannon-defender -- or two)
    Elsewhere, where Bank (pre)builds won't finish before Industry comes in, I change current builds accordingly
    And Emerita's not building Hoovers yet! I fix that too!
    Novgorod switched (back) to Workers (to disband it)
    Other Greek/Russian conquests scanned for current builds and potential Specialist MM-(re)assignments
    Settler in Pederneira fortified for now
    Don't understand why our Workers are scattered and chopping Jungle + Marsh, when there are still rails to build...
    Our intrepid Curragh is presumably docked in Coimbra as a joke... ;)
    injured Cav near Eritria dies to Summie Horse
    2 more injured Cavs killed by Germans near Adrianople
    Avis --> Court (Market queued; this is a Pop12-er)
    Evora --> Bank
    Luanda --> Settler (massive food excess; need more mines here)

    T 1, 1110 AD
    Cannon bomb German Cav NE of A'ple
    Frigs auto-bomb Dyrrachium
    Cannon redline v+rMusket, revealing rSpear! eKnight dies, vCav kills Spear, vCav kills vMusket, Army kills rMusket, and we now own Leos!
    Cannon+Trebs bomb hostiles, Cavs attack: 2 German Cavs killed, Crusader redlined; Byz LBM redlined
    Cannon knock 1 HP off each of 2 rMuskets; Mace-Army kills both; new vCav kills exposed LBM, capturing town
    New vInf covers Cannon near Atoleiros, allowing injured v+eCavs to retreat to new conquests
    Slave-stack goes to road to coastal Hill NW of Atol, Peder's Settler sent to found coastal town
    German Cav-stack appears near Amorim, Cav kills redlined Cav in A'ple
    Summie Caravel appears near Herakleia!
    Pharsalos riots (Market queued)!
    Khabarovsk --> Lib

    T 2, 1120 AD
    Cannon pulled back inside A'ple's borders, bomb German Cav: eCav kills him, and Magellan appears!
    Army formed, injured v+e*Cavs loaded, sent to guard fired Cannon
    Healthy Army kills vLBM, goes to guard A'ple's western approach; 6 Cannon fail to dent nearby vMusket on Mountain; need to do some Arty-upgrades! (Will upgrade foreign bombard-units, disband natives)
    Cannons bomb German Cavs, Mace-Army + vCavs kill 4 v+rCavs, 1 vCav lost
    Hope it doesn't flip...
    WW is really hurting in former Greek/Russian towns: LUX% raised to 40%
    (SCI% to 60%, Industry now in 4T; earliest prebuild done in 5T)
    Still-problematic towns MM'd for faster Court/Market builds via Domestic Advisor; Court rushed in Herak (148 g)
    Ozzie wants to renew our PT. OK. He'll also buy our WMap, for his WMap + 50g
    German Cav captures A'ple (+11g)! S'OK, I'll get it back next turn...
    vCav dies attacking Amorim
    StPete's riots! Damn, must've overlooked that one...
    Thermo, Ourique --> Worker
    SaoM --> Settler (massive food excess; need more mines here!)
    Hera, CasteloB --> Market
    Rio --> Bank (switched it back to Cav last turn)
    Luanda --> Inf
    Bada riots!

    T 3, 1130 AD
    Alcácer do Sal founded SW of Tomar --> Walls
    Cannon bomb rMusket near Alcacer; eMace kills him
    Native Cannon bomb, Cav Army kills vCav and rMusket: redlined, but Leos is ours again!
    Workers (nearly) complete rail-link to A'ple, Inf moved to guard fired Cannon
    I notice that Wang has money and no Iron: he'll pay 18 GPT + WMap + 30g
    8 Cannon(Foreign) upgraded in A'ple (480g)
    New Lisbon founded NE of Co'ple's ruins --> Court
    New Oporto founded SW of Co'ple's ruins --> Court
    We lost our Incense! I have to pay Ozzie Wines + 26 GPT to get it back! (He wanted Wines+Electricity, but I don't trust him...)
    Athens riots! I realise I just screwed up big-time, and forgot to reset LUX% after making the Incense-deal. Governators switched on (all towns) until I can get to the F1-screen again...
    LBM dies attacking Cav in A'ple
    Cav dies attacking Mace-Army + Cannon

    T 4, 1140 AD
    Cycle through the towns again, re-assign the Governators' Clowns, and amend builds where 'needed' to minimise shield-waste
    Then finish railing 1st ring flatland (will need to double-stack for the Hills)
    Byz + German foot-units bombed and killed near A'ple, Inf moved to guard town
    Industry now in 2T...
    2 Cannon from Peder move to A'ple stack, 2 more Cannon disbanded into Settler-build, which is cash-rushed (12g) for Settler-disband
    Germans know Nationalism! Need to move on them fast now...
    Cav on Cannon-stack near A'ple repels German Crusader, but injured Mace-Army near Amorim succumbs to a Cav
    A'ple --> Court
    Novgorod, Trebiz --> Worker
    Sagres --> Frig (Byz + Summie Caravels incoming near NTISparta...)
    Bissau --> Market
    Bada --> Cav
    Peder abandoned

    T 5, 1150 AD
    Slaves road core-Hills
    Peder's Settler+Warrior moves 1S to river Hill
    3/4 Cav avenges Mace-Army, Inf + Cannon move to defend Amorim
    3/5 Cav kills redlined Mace near A'ple
    2/14 Army evac'd to Atoleiros
    4/13 Army + Arty-stack move to Hills NNW of Brusa (prospective Pop12 farm-site), where they redline visible units and Brusa's defenders, and kill a German vMusket
    Spare units from the interchoke-zone and southern Russia added to the Arty-stack
    SCI% to 40% for Industry in 1T and +183 GPT...
    Evora switched to Bank
    Dora wants to talk... Nope.
    LBM dies to Cav, LBM retreats Cav. Oh s***, Dora has Cavs now, too! Redlined Cav killed, Warrior killed, Settler captured
    German vCav kills vPike and destroys 2 Arty!
    We learn Industrialization --> Corporation
    Go to WTBP? and raise SCI% to 60% (Corp in 7T at ~+50GPT), convert Bank-builds (and Faro's Uni-build) to Factories, and rush Factory in Faro (172g)
    Athens, Faro --> Market
    Alcobaca --> Lib
    Amorim defects, DAMMIT (we lose 1 Inf, 4 Cannon, 1 Cav)
    Spoiler 1160-1200 AD :
    T 6, 1160 AD
    eCav fells 1/4 Cav that spiked our guns near A'ple
    vCav kills Worker-kidnapping Cav near New Oporto
    Arty + Trebs bomb everything they can reach
    Now-healed Cav-Army mops up Byz Cav near Atol, Byz Spear + German Cav near A'ple, fortified on injured Cav + Worker near Atol
    eKnight kills Byz LBM, vCav kills German Cav near A'ple
    Slaves begin railing (and mining) core-Mountains
    Redlined Cav-Army retreats to New Lisbon to heal
    Out of curiosity, I ask Dora what we can get for a PT, but we can only get 1 town at most: She'd hand over Dyrrachium or Nicomedia, and is 'close' to handing over Amorim; but every other town is 'doubtful' or 'insulting'
    Hera's vPike sent to New Lisbon, Athens' rPike to Atol, both upgraded (180g -- ouch), and the new Infs backed up with 4 Cannon each -- because with Amorim back in her hands, Dora's Cavs can now hit us from her side of the border
    We might still lose a Slave, but I can live with that...
    A'ple's Inv defeats German Cav, but that doesn't stop the town from flipping back to Dora again (dammit)...
    SaoP, SaoMam, Lagos --> Cav
    Alcac --> Wealth
    Cacela --> Lib
    Orique, Diu --> Worker

    T 7, 1170 AD
    Arty bombs A'ple (and Brusa, and nearby LBM + Musket), vCav recaptures town
    Cav-Army rides down LBM, recaptures runaway Slaves on Hills near Dyrrachium; v+eCav shelter under it
    vCav kills redlined rSpear near Atol, eKnight kills redlined LBM near A'ple
    Notice that Hammi's saved up some money in his piggy-bank, so I offer him AtomTheory: he'll pay Nationalism + WMap + 136 GPT + 370g -- pretty much all he has! OK then!
    We can now employ Policemen, so I do
    SCI% back to 70% (we still need 30% LUX%) for Corp now in 5T, +74 GPT
    Pederneira (re)founded between A'ple and Brusa, 4/14 Cav-Army moved (on rails) to heal here, vMusket upgraded (45g) to defend it
    German Cav kills eKnight in A'ple
    Tavira, Obidos --> Duct
    We build Hoovers! :woohoo:
    Emerita --> Factory
    Luanda --> Cav

    T 8, 1180 AD
    Frigates (bomb +) sink Byz Caravels near Lisbon and Bryansk; 1 Frigate lost
    Cav-Army kills 2 vMuskets in Dyrrach, showing redlined LBM, but when e+vCav attack, they kill 2 healthy vLBMs (in boats?); Army kills last LBM, razes the town (1 Slave captured), leaving a huge hole in the Byzzie's Culture :evil:
    Slaves re-road Dyrrach's ruins, eCav kills nearby Byz rLBM
    Brusa bombed (it has a Rifle!), Cav-Army moves onto Mountains which Germans have been using to reach A'ple, kills vCav in Brusa
    Settler-builds cash-rushed in StPetes, Rostov, Moscow, Ohrid (about 50g per head)
    4 vCavs scrounged up from around our shores, and sent to join Army above Brusa
    It occurs to me that I have seen no Byzzie Cavs recently: I wonder if those few were Knight- (or Horse-)upgrades from Dyrrach's boats?
    Whoah! Just noticed that CAII is warning about imminent riots... pretty much everywhere! Must have just incurred a jump in WW...
    LUX% to 40% still gets us Corp in 4T, Market rushed in Guarda (80g)
    Byz Cav attacks New Oporto (unsuccessfully)! Guess I spoke too soon...
    Summies drop Enk+Mace near Ohrid
    German Cavs bypass Peder, taking ZoC-damage
    Moscow --> Settler
    Athens riots (drat)
    StPetes, Rostov, Smyrna, Ohrid --> Worker
    Guarda --> Cav

    T 9, 1190 AD
    Peder's Arty redlines 3 vRifles in Brusa, showing vCav
    Slaves add mines near (food-rich) Guarda and NTISparta
    vCav redlines killing vCav in Brusa, Cav-Army kills 3 Rifles, razes town (6 Slaves captured), mows down rCav on Mountain
    Slaves road + irrigate (Settler will plant on Rubber)
    vCavs kill Byz Musket near Atol + vCav near Aple, 2nd Cav promoted (5/5)
    v+eCav kill Summie landing-party
    Slaves finish road, eCav kills rLBM near Dyrrach's ruins
    New Settlers sent to play fill-in-the-gaps...
    vPike from Khab sent to Lisbon, upgraded (90g) to defend against possible landers; no Cav-builds currently close to finishing (i.e. cheap to rush)
    Byz + Summie ships sail away from Lisbon
    German cavs get ZoC'd near Peder
    Yaroslav --> Settler
    Vladi --> Lib
    Cacela riots!
    Leiria --> Inf (2T). Yeah, baby, yeah -- now that's more like it!
    Faro riots instead of finishing its Market (which would have prevented the riot!)
    Tomar --> Wealth

    T 10, 1200 AD
    Cav-Army redlines killing 1 measly vCav on Peder's Mountain
    New Guimarães founded NE of Dyrrach's site
    New Lagos founded near New Oporto, closing our SW border
    Trebs redline German Musket, vMace kills him for promotion! (5/5)
    Arty bombs vCav, vCav kills Cav
    Unfired Arty moved to Mountain across lake from Chalcedon
    Settler sent to Hill 2NW of A'ple
    Settler + 2 vCavs + Cannon sent to Hill ESE of A'ple
    Here's the worldmap as of 1200 AD:

    jar03 Worldmap 1200 AD.png

    Here's where I think we should plant our next Forward Operations Bases/ potential Pop10-12 farms (hence the slightly wide spacing, to get more flat tiles in the BFC:
    Spoiler Southwest front :

    jar03 Combat Settlement SW 1200 AD.png
    Spoiler Southeast front :

    jar03 Combat Settlement SE 1200 AD.png
    Just in case it's not obvious ;) purple spot with an 'S' marks a town-site with a Settler already in place, white spots with an 'S' mark the current positions of Settlers (not on a Goto! ;) ) with the arrow showing their intended destination, purple spots with a '?' mark sites for which a Settler does not yet exist (but IIRC there are several being built which could be rushed -- although it would probably be better to have a healthy Army and/or some Infs + Cannons to guard them as they move into hostile territory... :hide:

    And here's the save...

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Nov 11, 2019
  3. CKS

    CKS Deity

    Feb 9, 2004
    Looks good. I shall try to finish the war with the Byzantines.
  4. CKS

    CKS Deity

    Feb 9, 2004
    So, 5 turns in, the Byzantines have been mostly kicked off the continent. They'll give us their last continental town for peace, but Germany surrounds it. However, Germany is willing to give us a town for peace, too. We have 3 cav armies, and the Germans have nationalism. War weariness is somewhat of a problem - the lux rate is at 50%. Flip risks in Byzantine towns are significant but not huge - Chalcedon, which I just took, is the highest at 3-6%, with 8 resistors.

    I'm inclined to make peace with both of them and work on setting up our science farms and get back to researching quickly. Thoughts?
  5. tjs282

    tjs282 Disillusionist

    May 19, 2009
    ...just here for the job/ handouts/ woman
    Oh wow, that was fast work! :goodjob:

    I thought it would take much longer to finish wiping the Byzzies (it would almost certainly have taken me much longer! ;) ). But yeah, we've been fighting them for >40T now (the war started during @jarred!'s 700-800 AD set, IIRC?), so I agree it's definitely time to call it quits.

    But if signing a PT with Dora sorts most of the WW, would it be worth pushing on a little further against Germany? Yes, they have Rifles, but we have Arty (don't we...?). If we were to raze their bigger border-towns, that should also relieve the pressure on e.g. Chalcedon: Munich and Salzburg's Cultural impingement is probably responsible for a lot of that flip-risk...
  6. CKS

    CKS Deity

    Feb 9, 2004
    I doubt if much of Chalcedon's flip risk is from Germany. If we make peace, I'll stuff it with units to quell resistance and then mostly pull out of it. If we stay at war with Germany, which we certainly can, we can't keep the Byzantine town that we'd get in a peace treaty, so I'd probably want to wait a couple of turns until we can attack Bremen before making peace with the Byzantines, or plan on abandoning the town.
  7. CKS

    CKS Deity

    Feb 9, 2004
    Banks and stock exchanges are so we can build Wall Street.
    I've made peace with the Byzantines, much of the resistance is quelled, and flip risks are not too high.
    Germany is on the ropes, and jarred! should be able to kick them off the continent in the next turn set.
    We are learning refining, due in 8 turns. This could doubtless be reduced by hiring some scientists.
    The settler SE of New Luanda can settle in place or move 1 SE for ease of reaching Frankfurt.

    Turn 0 – 1200 AD
    Swap a citizen to a CE in Evora to get factory this turn. Scientists in Guarda, Goa, Krasnoyarsk, Bissau, Badajoz, Ourique, Ohrid, No This is Sparta to get Corp in 2 turns.
    IBT: German Cav kills cav. Oporto factory > cav, Avis riots, Coimbra factory > cav, Evora factory > bank, Faro market > university, Ourique worker > worker

    Turn 1, 1210
    Build New Emerita. Rail. Upgrade some cannons and trebs, while we hold Adrianople. Kill pike and cavalry, get an MGL. Kill musket and longbow with army, taking Bryansk and some boats. Bomb some boats. Draft in Goa (disband to finish marketplace), Lisbon (fort, send vet infantry to cover wounded army), Sagres and Evora (send to front). At Nicaea: kill musket, retreat, kill musket, kill musket, kill pike, raze city – 5 workers.
    IBT: Renew deal with Babylon, but with less money. German cavs advance. Learn Corp. Start Steel. Lisbon factory > Inf., No This is Sparta factory > cav, Novgorod worker > worker, Sagres frigate > settler, Leiria inf > bank, Braga factory > cav, Goa market > library, Ourique worker > worker.

    Turn 2, 1220 AD
    Build New Sagres. Bomb and kill German cavs, losing a cav and promoting a cav. Make new army, take Nicomedia, killing musket, pike, spear.
    IBT: Germans attack New Oporto, losing a cav, then taking the town. Cav kills our cav, more cavs come around the south. Many towns finish cavs and start new ones. Mina and Ataleiros settler > settler.

    Turn 3, 1230 AD
    Kill redlined cav to retake New Oporto. Build New Coimbra. Build New Leiria. Kill pike to take Vidin.
    IBT: Byzantine cav comes out of nowhere, takes a bunch of workers, retreats 1 and kills the rest. Germans move. Cities build units & start building more of the same.

    Turn 4, 1240 AD
    Build New Evora. Destroy ??, take 11 workers. Kill 3 muskets, take Sardica, lose 1 cav. Kill musket, take Amorium.
    IBT: Landings, cav movement, pollution. Quell some resistance, unit builds continue.

    Turn 5, 1250 AD
    Kill 2 muskets, a pike, and a cav, take Chalcedon. Byzantine capital is now on the island. They will give us Ancyra for peace. Kill enkidu warrior. Kill invading longbow.
    IBT: Cavs attack – 2 die, 1 retreats, 1 kills MDI. Athens market > cav, Lisbon cav > cav, Nazare courthouse > marketplace, Guim factory > cav, Emerita factory > cav, Sagres settler > factory, Leiria bank > stock exchange, Faro university > cav, Rio Janeiro cav > cav.

    Turn 6, 1255
    Kill 2 exposed cavs, get MGL. Send it to Sagres to rush the Pentagon. Kill rifle, two muskets, cav to raze Bremen, gaining 3 workers. Sink German frigate and caravel. Bomb Munich. Cavs kill 3 muskets, raze Munich gaining 10 workers. Build New Braga. Rush some settlers. Cav dies redlining cav on hill.
    IBT: Germans lose 2 cavs killing an MDI. Oporto cav > cav, Sao Mamede cav > cav, Sagres pentagon > factory, Coimbra cav > bank, Braga bank > stock exchange, Bissau library > marketplace, Rhodes settler > settler, Badajoz settler > artillery, Diu settler > marketplace,

    Turn 7, 1260 AD
    Add cav to each army. Kill 3 muskets, 1 longbow, take Ancyra. Kill 2 muskets, raze Salzburg, gain 2 workers. Kill 2 muskets in the field, get an MGL. Send to Oporto to rush Military Academy. Build New Faro. Make peace with Byzantines. Raise science spending and drop lux rate.
    IBT: Renegotiate spice deals with Ottomans (we get more gpt) and Babs (they give dyes, we give more gpt). Germans kill a cav. No This is Sparta cav > cav, Oporto Mil acad > bank, Yaroslav' settler > settler, Sao Paulo cav > cav, Emerita cav > cav, Cacela library > marketplace, Evora stock market > inf., Faro cav > cav, Rio Janeiro cav > cav, Luanda cav > cav, Castelo Branco marketplace > settler. Quell resistance.

    Turn 8, 1265 AD
    Build New Rio Janeiro, New Sao Paolo. Advance on some German towns.
    IBT: Germans take Ancyra. :sad: Smyrna worker > worker, Goa library > university, Krasnoyarsk courthouse > aquaduct, Laurenco Marques factory > marketplace, Ohrid worker > worker.

    Turn 9, 1270 AD
    Retake Ancyra. Raze Brandenburg, Nurenberg. Build Luanda. Kill a cav. Move on Leipzig and Hannover.
    IBT: Lose a cav. Learn steel, start refining. Moscow settler > settler, St. Petes settler > settler, Emerita cav > cav, Leiria stock exchange > infantry, Evora inf > inf, Faro cav > cav, Rio Janeiro cav > cav, .

    Turn 10, 1275 AD
    Kill 2 rifles and a cav, raze Hannover, get 3 workers. Move.

    Attached Files:

    tjs282 likes this.
  8. jarred!

    jarred! Prince

    Jun 26, 2017
    W-S, NC
    Sorry guys, I'm really busy, I'll need a skip this time around.
  9. tjs282

    tjs282 Disillusionist

    May 19, 2009
    ...just here for the job/ handouts/ woman
    If it's likely to be a week or more before you'll have time to play again, then to keep things moving, I'd be quite happy to play another set over the coming weekend (Operation: Sink the Bismarck!).

    But if the wait's only likely to be a couple of days, then that would also be OK by me.

    Or ... maybe we could invite a Lurker (if we still have any!) to play a set?

    After all, this is your SG, so deciding the roster/schedule is really your call.
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2019
  10. Dwarven Zerker

    Dwarven Zerker Just one more turn Honey!

    Feb 18, 2003
    Yep! Youse guyses has lurkers. I wouldn't be able to jump in coz I don't have a copy I can play and even if I did my monarch to beginning emperor skills would set you back significantly. But I appreciate the comment! :goodjob:

    P.S. Lurkers like pictures. :mischief:
  11. CKS

    CKS Deity

    Feb 9, 2004
    If you were able to play, you would be welcome to. At this point in the game, it would be hard to accidentally set us back much in 10 turns even if you were a real beginner. However, monarch/beginning emperor in single-player games works just fine for playing DG succession games. You should fix your can't-play issues and join one. :)

    I'll see if I can upload some pictures later, if no-one else gets to it first.
    Dwarven Zerker likes this.
  12. tjs282

    tjs282 Disillusionist

    May 19, 2009
    ...just here for the job/ handouts/ woman
    Right, no word from @jarred!, so call this a gottit. For DZ's benefit, here's the worldmap at 1275 AD:

    jar03 Minimap 1275 AD.png

    I think I should be able to finish the German war within the next 5-6T or so.

    We have a nice big stack directly outside Leipzig, so it should fall next turn, opening up the road to Konigsberg, which I'll hit (and raze) on the same turn, assuming I still have sufficient Army + Cavalry HP available. With Leipzig ours, I might be able to move that Settler SE of New Luanda 1S, so it can use the Cow straight off the bat (also opens up another coastal CxC Hill-farm site between New Luanda and the Cow-town).

    I'll then use additional forward-Settlement (need to rush some that are in progress, including in Novgorod, so we can finally get rid of it!), and get a rail-link in place to bring all the Arty far enough forward to bomb Berlin in 2-3 T. When it falls, Bismark will run to Frankfurt, but Cologne should become accessible, and from Cologne our Cavs can also reach Frankfurt in 1T. Hamburg should also be reachable (and raze-able!) from Berlin.

    Stuttgart and Heidelberg can stay, though. Once Bismark's Palace is relocated to Bonn, I'll sign a PT with him, so WW will disappear and we can start quelling resistance, and cash-rushing Workers and farm-Settlers out of the captured German towns. Cavs being built in our core can finish, but if we don't need them to fight with, then they can be shield-disbanded into Courthouses and Markets, in the potential Pop12 farms.

    Research-wise, Combustion has to be the next project, and then I'd like MassProd for CommDocks in the coastal core-towns: Lisbon, Guim, Sagres (and eventually Khabarovsk) for sure, maybe also Evora, Lagos, and SaoPaulo.

    May also be worth trying to acquire Sani (traded -- or stolen -- from the Babs or Ottos) to put up Hospitals in 5 of those towns as well? (Not that we should need BattlefieldMed once we own our Continent, but it would give us another potential prebuild)
    What happened? Maybe we could help, or at least point you to a potentially helpful thread...?
  13. tjs282

    tjs282 Disillusionist

    May 19, 2009
    ...just here for the job/ handouts/ woman
    Mid-set spoiler: Peace at last, war is over...

    jar03 Minimap 1295 AD.png

    Isn't this a beautiful sight? Portuguese purple, over almost our entire Continent -- and I'm still only 4 turns into my set, because I managed to take Berlin on Turn 1 after all. Settlers (and Workers) are now being built + rushed to fill in the gaps along our coasts, because there have already been a few speculative landings during my set (not counting the Summies sending the dregs of their military to invade us).

    I trapped a Bab Settler-pair before they could found a town, but unfortunately the Ottos managed to sneak one in down in the southern Tundra. Ozzie is currently paying us nearly 230 GPT net on various deals, though, so I didn't/don't really want to DoW him (yet! Let's at least collect our due 3000-odd gold first!). I will Settle on the nearby Hills and Tundra regardless; you never know, maybe we'll even get it to flip (after we build Internet)!

    Mind you, I'm not sure how well we'll be able to avoid back-flips in former Germany. OTOH, Bismark is down to his last town (Bonn, on the island), and his borders won't impinge on any of our conquests for a while yet. And he's also currently MA'd with Ozzie vs. Hammi, so I wouldn't bet much on his long-term survival...
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2019
    Dwarven Zerker likes this.
  14. CKS

    CKS Deity

    Feb 9, 2004
    That looks lovely!
  15. tjs282

    tjs282 Disillusionist

    May 19, 2009
    ...just here for the job/ handouts/ woman
    Quick update:

    Now partway though Turn 10. I'm pretty sure there's still a fair bit of Settler- and Worker-shuffling to do, but there are (now) Worker-stacks doing various jobs all over the map, and Civ3's bad habit of yanking the map-view from one end of the continent to the other -- often mid-stack -- has been making it just a little difficult to keep track of who's doing what and where!

    So I've kind of run out of the patience needed to finish off this evening. I'll try and get things wrapped up tomorrow, and upload the turnlog, handover and save, along with some dot- and CAII-derived chop-maps if they're wanted.

    We should be on course for a reasonably good launch-date, though: even without the farmlands being fully developed, we are now down to 5T-research at SCI%=100%, with Combustion (and a substantial pile of TAX%-gold!) due this IBT...
  16. Dwarven Zerker

    Dwarven Zerker Just one more turn Honey!

    Feb 18, 2003
    Problem #1: lack of time. I live about 2 hours from work, currently and get sporadic game time on weekends. Definitely not something conducive to SG playing. Problem #2: The discs with my civ3 are Windoze and family has gone Mac since I played Civ3 last. Nothing I can't fix, but it circles back to problem #1; plus the kids are more growed up and life has changed. Games aren't as important anymore.

    Thank you for asking. It's fun living vicariously through youse guyses. :D
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2019
    jarred! and tjs282 like this.
  17. tjs282

    tjs282 Disillusionist

    May 19, 2009
    ...just here for the job/ handouts/ woman
    Aaaannd, I'm spent! :cooool:

    Spoiler 1275-1300 AD :
    T 0, 1275 AD
    Rush Settler in Novgorod (88g) and Workers in Rostov and StPetes (12+12g)
    Switch Emer to UniSuff (prebuild for WallSt)
    Ozzie has Sani and >800g, so I offer him SciMethod: we collect Sani + WMap + 790g
    Since deficit-spending is no longer an issue, SCI% raised to 80%, shaving 1T off Refining (now in 7T, income = -48 GPT)
    We lose a Cav down in the southern Tundra, more German Cavs head for our borders
    Ottos send Frigs+Galleon along our southern coast
    Summie convoy appears near Ohrid
    Lisbon, Sparta --> Hospital
    Novgorod Settler-abandoned
    Rostov --> Worker
    Oporto --> StockEx
    Guarda, Braga --> Inf
    Viseau --> Harbour
    Orique --> Settler

    T 1, 1280 AD
    Frigates begin bombing Frankfurt, Stuttgart
    Ottomans have somehow acquired 260g on the IBT, so I offer AtomTheory: he'll pay WMap + 223 GPT (his entire income) + 260g. OK then!
    Arty bombs vRifle (2 hits), showing rRifle
    vCav retreats, Army kills 2/3 Rifle (7/15), showing rRifle.
    Remaining vCavs activated:
    vCav retreats, vCav kills Rifle, showing 2/4 Rifle
    vCav kills Rifle, promoted (3/5), showing vCav
    vCav kills Cav, showing 2/4 Cav
    eCav kills Cav, and Leipzig is ours! Rax sold (10g) --> Worker
    All tired/injured Cavs moved in and fortified
    Inf+Settler move 1S to Cow-Town site: future-borders show that we will be able to bomb + attack Frankfurt from here!
    Rail-line built from New Luanda to Cow-Town site
    Rail-line built from New Faro to Leipzig
    Worker-stacks guarded by Infs
    German Cavs bombed and killed
    Berlin is showing a vMusket as top defender, so decide to attack:
    Cav-Army kills 2x vMuskets
    vCav retreats, e*Cav retreats, vCav retreats
    vCavs kill 2x 2/3 Musket, showing rCav
    vCav kills Cav, and Berlin (4 Trebs, 1 Slave) is ours! --> Worker
    Army moved in and fortified, Trebs upgraded (300g)
    vCav kills 1/4 Cav in Tundra near Stuttgart
    Settler rushed in Praia (8g)
    Enk + Archer + LBM dropped near Ohrid (how in Hell did the Summies annex half Korea?!)
    Rifle, 2x Sipahi, Settler dropped in southern Tundra
    Praia, Smyrna --> Settler
    Tavira --> Lib
    Guim --> Palace (for CommDock)
    Emer --> UniSuff
    Coimbra --> StockEx
    Leiria, Evora, Faro --> Inf
    RioJan --> Cav

    T 2, 1285 AD
    Colina das Vacas founded --> Settler
    Rail-lines built from Leipzig to Berlin, and onto Cow-tile
    Leipzig + Berlin evac'd, injured Cavs fortified in Col.d.Vac
    Healthy Cavs and Arty moved to Cow and fortifed for now
    New vCavs slaughter Summies without slowing down (much)
    Arty redlines 4 Rifles, kills 2 citz (to Pop6)
    vCavs kill all 4 Rifles without loss, and the town (1 Cannon) is ours! --> Slave
    Bismark flees to Cologne
    Rax + Bank sold (50g), Cannon upgraded (60g) --> Slave
    Rail-line continued towards Cologne
    Arty bombs, showing only v+rRifle(?)
    vCavs kill both Rifles, and Cologne (+1g) is ours!
    Bismark flees to Hamburg
    Colina de Salitre founded on Saltpeter-Hill south of Cologne --> Walls
    Rail-line continued towards Col.d.Sal.
    Tired vCavs fortified in Cologne
    Yellow Cav-Army fortified in Frankfurt
    Inf + 3 unused vCavs + Cav-Army fortified in CdS
    Settlers rushed in Sardica (84g) and Atoleiros (88g); we're making +156 GPT...
    Ottos build Riza, and units fortified in Greece wake up and head south
    German Cav recaptures Berlin (+3g)! Damn, thought he'd run out of those...
    German Frigs sail west from Heidelburg
    Athens --> Cav
    Thermo --> Worker
    Alcobaca --> Factory
    Cacela riots!
    Sardica, Atol --> Settler
    Braga --> Inf

    T 3, 1290 AD
    Arty moved round to C.d.Sal
    Arty redlines cRifle + vCav
    vCav kills Rifle
    vCav dies to Cav
    eCav kills Cav, and Berlin (+2g) is ours again --> Slave
    Lagoa Congelada founded on coastal Tundra NW of Stuttgart --> Walls
    Settler discovers sneaky Bab Inf+Settler-pair landed SW of Evora!
    New Guarda founded next to them, and Slave-wall formed to trap them
    Workers working...
    Frigates bomb, leaving rRifle on top
    Cav-Armys kill a Rifle apiece, and the town (+1g) is captured and razed
    Cow Forested, chopped, and irrigated
    Cav-Army kills rRifle, but no-one else can reach it this turn
    Cav-stack arrives outside Hamburg
    Wang coninues his Iron-import deal (18 GPT for us); but why is he Furious? I offer Electricity, and he pays WMap + 37 GPT + 11g. I gift him some Wines, but it doesn't make him any friendlier.
    We lose our Incense! Uh-oh... It takes Wines + 71GPT to get it back!
    (Ozzie wanted Salt, but I don't want to help him build more Sipahi)
    Instead I throw him RepParts for 56 GPT + 70g
    Lagos, Leiria, Evora, Faro --> Inf
    RioJan, Bada, --> Cav
    Amorium --> Slave
    Lourenco, New Evora --> Settler
    Obidos --> Market

    T 4, 1295 AD
    Cav-Army kills last Rifle, taking the town --> Walls
    Montanha do Tabaco founded on Hill WSW of Berlin --> Settler
    Frigate bombs rRifle, showing vMusket
    vCavs kill Musket and Rifle, and the town (+2g) is ours! --> Slave
    (I kept it, to get us to Heidelburg quicker)
    Bismark sails to Bonn
    Rail-line built towards Hamburg, Forest chopped to finish Slave
    Arty redlines 2x rRifles
    eCav kills Rifle, and Viriato appears!
    1st Heidelberg Cavalry formed in Hamburg, 3 vCavs loaded
    vCav kills Rifle, and Heidelburg (+3g) is ours!
    Army + vInf moved in, name corrected ('Heidelberg'!) --> Walls
    Frigates bomb German Frig + Galleon, sink Galleon, retreat to H'berg
    Yellow Cav-Army kills German LBM near K'berg's ruins
    PT signed with Bismark, for everything he has (WMap + 9g!)
    With diplomatic relations restored, we see that he's also fighting the Babs (MA with Ozzie!), so likely not long for this world...
    With the war finally over, we can raise SCI% to 90% and cut another turn off Refining (now in 2T, income still +194 GPT)
    Cavs redistributed to German towns, 1 unit per resistor
    Arty sent to Praia, Summie ships bombed to 1HP
    With so much cashflow and space to fill, Workers + Settlers rushed in ex-Russian + Greek towns (didn't count the costs)
    Another useless Summie landing
    Hammi demands Spices for peace!
    WTH, CAII says we still have another 13T on our Spice-Dyes import-export deal, and our Trade Advisor says we still have excess Spices to export, so we haven't broken it!
    We're also still getting Furs + Silks from Babylon, so I hand over the Spices...
    Ah, crap, we have lost the Dyes (that is, the Babs must have lost theirs -- to Otto/Summie pillagers?) Just to check, I sell Hammi our WMap, for his + 20g.
    Then check quickly through our core-towns, to check for excess Unhappy. Only Lisbon (draft-unhappy) and Cacela (insufficient Commerce, no Market) need adjustment
    Berlin, Hamburg, Frankfurt, Cologne quelled
    StPetes, Thermo, Rostov, Nicomedia --> Slave
    Oporto, Braga --> Inf
    Avis --> Market
    Chalc, Mina --> Settler
    Brynask --> Walls

    T 5, 1300 AD
    Frigate sinks redlined Summie Caravel
    Arty bombs Summie units to 1HP
    New Castelo Branco founded on HIll NNE of Sardica
    New Badajoz founded SE of Ancyra, NW of Riza
    New Lourenço Marques founded on coast NNW of New Guarda
    SCI% reduced from 100% (when did I do that?) to 50% for Refining in 1T (+551GPT)
    2x vCavs disbanded into New Lisbon's Courthouse (1T, with CivEngs)
    Wang wants to talk: he'll give us WMap + 14g for our WMap. He can't afford anything else
    Otto boats sail back past Heidelberg -- looks like Ozzie's after that free Tundra to the NW...
    Bab boats arrive near Riza -- too late, Hammi!
    We learn Refining --> Combustion (5T at SCI% = 100%, +207 GPT)
    NTISparta, RioJan --> Cav
    Hamburg --> Worker
    Delphi, LourencoM, --> Uni
    Vladi, Khab, New Lisbon --> Market
    Leiria, Evora, Faro --> Inf
    Niocomedia --> Settler (for disband, to make room for more farms)
    Stuttgart --> Lib (to grab the Fish)
    Ancyra --> Settler
    Lagoa --> Wealth
    Spoiler 1305-1325 AD :
    T 6, 1305 AD
    NTISparta renamed ("Nao, ESTE é Sparta")
    Wall'o'Frigates set out NW of H'berg, to prevent landings
    5x vCavs disbanded into Khab's Market
    Óleo de Peixe founded 2E of StPetes --> Harbour
    Hammi has 130g, so I offer Corp: he suggests Commie + 10 GPT + 130g , and right now he can only afford max. 29GPT -- but the last payment (136 GPT) for his previous tech-purchase is due this IBT...
    The Jerk wants to talk. Nope.
    Moscow --> Worker (last one!)
    Hamburg --> Settler (to disband)
    Oporto, Lagos, Braga, --> Inf
    Trebizond --> Worker
    Guarda, CasteloB, --> Settler
    Khab --> Uni

    T 7, 1310 AD
    rFrig sinks escaping Summie 1/4 Frig, for promotion!
    New Viseau founded on Hill 2N of Riza --> Wealth
    Montanha de Ferro founded on Iron-Hill NE of Stuttgart --> Settler
    Start Slaves Foresting all over the farmlands
    Sell Corp to Hammi for 185g + 168GPT (his entire current income)
    Forest chopped, vCav disbanded to fill H'burg's shield-box
    CAII predicts highest flip risk in Leipzig, Cologne, Frankfurt and New Badajoz: Settler rushed in Leipzig (88g), others switched to Settlers
    Babs land a lone vInf near Riza
    Lisbon, Coimbra, Leiria, Evora, Faro --> Inf
    Leipzig --> Settler
    NEESparta, RioJan --> Cav
    Hamburg + Vidin abandoned
    We can now build WallSt!
    H'berg --> Wealth
    Diu --> Lib

    T 8, 1315 AD
    Lago das Vacas founded 1E of Vidin's ruins --> Settler
    Nova Ambergia founded 1NE of Hamburg's ruins --> Walls
    New São Mamede founded 2E of Chalcedon --> Walls
    Nova Vidina founded on the river 1SW of Vidin's ruins --> Settler
    Emerita switched to WallSt (72 shields wasted)
    Settlers + Workers rushed in various places
    Moscow, New RioJan --> Courthouse
    Oporto, Emerita, Braga --> Inf
    Yaroslav, Cologne --> Settler
    Pharsalos --> Lib
    Cacela, Bissau --> Uni
    Guarda, CasteloB, --> Cav
    New Guim --> Wealth
    Orique abandoned
    3x Palace expansion!

    T 9, 1320 AD
    New Ourique founded 2SW of Frankfurt --> Wealth
    New Goa founded near New Luanda --> Walls
    New Diu founded near Atoleiros --> Walls
    New Tavira founded near StPetes --> Courthouse
    New Cacela founded in the Culture-hole south of Adrianople --> Courthouse
    New Alcobaça founded near Smyrna --> Wealth
    More Settlers cash-rushed, making sure to keep our Treasury >1000g
    Bismark and Hammi sign PT
    Athens, NEESparta, RioJan --> Cav
    StPetes, Thermo, Rostov --> Worker
    Leipzig starves(?!?), Frankfurt, Trebiz, Amorium --> Settler
    Yekat, New Coimbra --> Market
    Lagos, Leiria, Evora, Faro, Luanda --> Inf
    NewBraga, Oleo.d.P. --> Courthouse
    New Faro abandoned (to make room for Hill-farms)
    Viseu --> Lib

    T 10, 1325 AD
    Plantação de Banana founded on Jungle near Ohrid --> Walls
    New Faro (re)founded in the nearby Hills --> Courthouse
    More farms founded elsewhere --> Walls (if coastal), Wealth (if max.pop. < Pop6), or Courthouse (if max.pop. > Pop6)
    More Settlers cash-rushed
    SCI% reduced to 60% for Combustion in 1T and +780g

    We now own our Continent (apart from that nearly-inconsequential Ottoman splodge!), and are at peace with everyone who was giving us WW. We still have a semi-phony war going on with Industrial Sumeria, and a completely phony war with Ancient(!) Persia. Gilgamesh seems to have developed a fixation on Ohrid/ Praia: during this set he's dropped off 2 or 3 Caravel-loads of Ancient/Medieval units (which I immediately killed!). Not sure if that will continue, but that's why our Arty and a Cav-Army are stationed in the interchoke area. I also sank one Caravel, and the Frigs are floating there to guard the approach

    We're tech-leader (Babs are 2nd, but we are siphoning Hammi's income), and once Combustion comes in on this IBT, we will be only 3 techs (~15T?) from the Modern Age -- lacking only MassProd (do this next, for CommDocks?), Flight, and MotorTrans. With the wars over, though, we don't really need the latter two urgently for anything, so it doesn't really matter which order we do them (cheaper first?).

    Guimares is slowly building UniSuff as a prebuild for either CommDocks (would probably waste a lot of shields, though), or we could keep it going to grab the UN after we get Fission (nothing worse than losing to a UN-vote!). I've built Hospitals only in Lisbon and Sparta so far, with Sagres in progress, but SaoPaulo could also use one once its factory is finished, as can Argos: then e.g. Emerita could get started on BattlefieldMed as a prebuild for SETI.

    For want of something better to do in our other fully infra'd core-towns, I have been building Cavs + Infs. We are nowhere near exceeding our free-unit allowance, and our Factory-towns are throwing out 40-55 SPT, so there seemed little point in drafting units (which I generally prefer to use only as an emergency measure anyway). Also, right now we have 'only' 5 Luxes available (the Babs' Dyes got pillaged, and the Summies appear to own all the Gems and Ivory), so it seemed better not to make our core-towns more unhappy than 'necessary'.

    New vInfs have been sent to guard coastal towns: the northern part of the Continent is now almost completely surrounded by a Thin Purple Line, with the few Infs down south mostly left over from our victorious German campaign. I have used some vCavs for shield-disbands (and vInfs could be used like this as well), but we currently have a few Bab Infs on our turf (no RoP), and those Ancient Otto units are still in Greece (now nearly surrounded!), so it seemed sensible to keep some units where we could hit them quickly if they sneak-attacked us.

    The nearer towns in former Greece and Russia which don't already have Factories could build those if we wanted them (I don't think we really need them though), and even the more distant towns look like they'll only be around 50% corrupt after a Courthouse, so can usefully build a [Courthouse,] [Duct,] Lib, Market and Uni (but nothing else?) and run at Pop12 with all citizens working tiles. Once past the interchoke area though, I'd minimise infra: I've been putting up Courts + Markets in the watered towns (to keep the Pop6-12 Geeks happy even if we lose another Lux), Walls in the Pop1-6 coastal towns (because why not?!), and Harbours where our citz can Go Fish to feed their Geeks (Stuttgart and Colina de Salitre could use a Lib, then a Harbour, and work 3 Fish).

    Worker-shuffling has become a royal pain, though; might be better to just start consolidating the stacks and fully improving (plant, chop, irrigate, rail) all the tiles for 1-2 farms at a time. Here are some chop-maps, if you want them:
    Spoiler North to south... :
    jar03 greece chops 1295 AD.png
    jar03 russia chops 1295 AD.png
    jar03 interchoke chops 1295 AD.png
    jar03 byzantium chops 1295 AD.png
    jar03 germany chops 1295 AD.png
    Multiple Settlers will be built this IBT, and a couple of Pop1 towns are due to be Settler-abandoned. Trashing Nicomedia will make room for 3-4 Pop1-6 farms in that corner, and moving New Evora to the adjacent Hill (where the Army is) frees up more Grassland/food, and another couple of farm-sites.

    Other than that, I haven't spent much thought on dot-mapping the south in any detail: there is a lot of fresh water though, so I think aiming to give (fewer) freshwater-farms enough food to reach Pop10-12 (i.e. CxxC = 4-6 watered + railed food-tiles per town) would be preferable to planting (more) Pop1-7 towns in strict ICS (i.e. CxC, 2-3 food-tiles per town). The latter may eventually produce more beakers, but also makes the Specialist-MM (even more of) a chore.

    Save, as always, is below...

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Nov 19, 2019
    Dwarven Zerker likes this.
  18. CKS

    CKS Deity

    Feb 9, 2004
    Looking good. Thanks for the chop maps.
    I'll work on planting (and growing) farming towns (first priority - fill in the empty spaces, so no-one else comes to plant towns, then plant on hills by water if possible) and getting infrastructure in moderately corrupt towns finished off. I don't think we need more factories - we don't need our moderately corrupt towns building anything, really, so they'll only cause pollution.
    I do like to draft in pop-12 cities (that don't get a hospital) with full food boxes when we have infrastructure still to build, but this will be fairly corrupt towns, not core towns.
    I hope to look at the save tonight.
  19. tjs282

    tjs282 Disillusionist

    May 19, 2009
    ...just here for the job/ handouts/ woman
    You'll see when you open the current save, that there are (now) far fewer Culture-holes than shown in the screenies, because the save that I used for the CAII chop-maps was made just before I founded towns in former Germany during my last turn. I wanted to consult the maps myself, to avoid founding on still-choppable tiles where possible; I then resaved afterwards.

    Our coastline is now almost fully blocked off by towns (apart from where the line of Frigates is parked in the SE German Tundra), and there is really only 1 substantial inland hole left, in SW Byzantium — but that can be filled by the next crop of Settlers, once Nicomedia is gone.
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2019
  20. CKS

    CKS Deity

    Feb 9, 2004
    Quick update: I'm plugging along and nothing interesting has happened. I probably won't finish until Saturday, though.

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