JFD and Janboruta's Civilisations

[Zantonius Hamm]

Considering that we are almost halfway into August, almost certainly August or September, I'm betting.

Summer vacations really do mess up one's head...

 

[Wantas]

I wish that you would make Latvia and Estonia (nobody haven't done that..) in the future (Baltic power!) + and some nowadays countries/civilizations/countries.

 

[zwei833]

YEEES!!! Two of the civs I have been looking the most forward to!

ME TOOOO !!!!!!

I can't say for sure, but probably the update to the Holy Roman Empire (which, given that is is unavailable at the moment, makes it sort of new). Otherwise, Denmark-Norway, I expect. Nothing will come (or, at least, will be begun) until around the end of the month, though; University matters are pressing, I'm afraid.

I hope I can play at least one of them before I back to university in Sep 9th.

 

[Zantonius Hamm]

I wish that you would make Latvia and Estonia (nobody haven't done that..) in the future (Baltic power!) + and some nowadays countries/civilizations/countries.

Unless they are monarchistic I do not expect he will be interested, though.

 

[lp_04]

I have some new ideas really well fundamented. You see, I don't have the skills of JFD nor Janboruta to create such great mods, therfore I shall give you my ideas for new civs, which are consonant with the philosophy of this thread, and you might (or not) use them.

The idea of an Iberia Reworked, featuring a divided Portugal (internal focused civ VS exploration civ) and a divided Spain (religious civ VS colonial civ), is due to the inhability of playing with a spanish empire focused on Reconquista and Inquisition (which has been talked previously in this thread) and to the strange choice of Firaxis for the portuguese leader. Below you can see my ideas:

Spanish Empire

Spoiler :

Felipe II
Madrid/Toledo (if Isabel I is in the game)
Starting Bias: Coast/Plains
((((((O))))))(Sandy Brown & White)
Symbol: The Lion in Spanish coat of arms (Lyon of the kingdom of León)
Non sufficit orbis - Double yeld from natural wonders.
Conquistador - Chivalry (Knight); 135 prod.; 20 strenght; 4 movement; +2 extra sight; no defensive bonus; double movement on ocean; may found a puppet city on a continent other than the capital after the discovery of astronomy.
Galleón- Astronomy (Firgate); 185 prod; 3 movement; 25 strenght; 24 ranged strenght; +20% strenght VS Caravel; May perform Rota Americana action, loosing its ability to fight.

Spoiler :

Rota Americana: Once per puppet state you may convert a galleon into a trade unit with the ability to defend (25 strenght), increasing by 1 your trade rote slots. It can only perform a domestic trade rote to a non-pupeted city. This action is performed inside the pupet state and it must have more than 5 citizens. The galleón is associated to the city and and can never be rellocated or reconverted into a military unit. It is destroyed by battle or if the city is conquered, as well as the trade rote that was generated.

Each Rota Americana generates gold and increases naval production by 10% in the destination city.

Castilan Empire

Spoiler :

Isabel I
Madrid
Starting Bias: Hills
((((((O)))))) (Current Spain)
Symbol: Current spain
Under one Crwon - Increased strenght while attacking cities that does not follow your religion. Inquisitors cost 10% less to build for each city you control that do not folow your religion. May purchase naval units with faith, providing them +1 movement and +1 sight.
Tercio - Gunpowder (Musketman); 160 production/ 320 faith; 26 strenght; 2 movement; +50% VS Mounted units.
Santuario - Theology (Garden); 120 production; Requires your religion to be dominant in the city. +1 faith for each 2 followers of your religion in the city. While there are no enemy religions in the city, may spend a great prophet for Peregrinación.

Spoiler :

Peregrinación: While your religion is the majority religion recieve +1% tourism for each follower of your religion worldwide and +20% religious pressure emanating from this city .

Portuguese Empire

Spoiler :

Manuel I
Lisboa
Starting Bias: Coast/Grassland
((((((O)))))) (Current Portugal)
Symbol: 5 Quinas (Current Portugal) OR Armillary sphere
Seas Never Sailed Before - Resurce diversity provides double gold on sea trade rotes. Naval units have +1 movement and +1 sight.
Nau - Astronomy (Caravel); 120 production; 20 strenght; 5 movement; withraw before melee; once in a game each Nau may Sell Exotic Goods next to a city state.
Feitoria - May only be built in a coastal tile next to a friendly city or to a city state. While in a city state it provides a copy of a luxury resurce owned by the cty. This resource can not be traded away nor provide happiness. While in friendly lands a feitoria increases the range of sea trade rotes originating from the adjacent city by 33%. It also provides +50% strenght to friendly units standing on it, like the for, and 25% strenght to naval units standing next to it.

Spoiler :

Sell Exotic Goods: unit recieves experience and gold based on the distance from the capital. If the city-state has a feitoria the Nau does not recieves experience.

Portuguese Empire (Under the House of Braganza)

Spoiler :

Maria I
Lisboa/Sintra (if Manuel I is in the game)
Starting Bias: Grassland
((((((O)))))) (Pale Turquoise & Royal Blue. Somehow, the Inverse of current Babylon)
Symbol: The Dragoon in the coat of arms of the House of Braganza
Fifth Empire - During a Golden Age, Academies provide double science, culture buildings provide +2 Faith and Port incresases the spawning rate of Great Musicians. May reallocate your capital once per game starting a golden age.
Cassador - Riffling (Rifleman); 250 production / 500 faith; 34 strenght; 2 movement; +20% strenght VS melee and gunpowder units; +50% strenght while fortifying within 3 tiles from the capital.
Port Vineyard - Unique Improvement for Portugal. Requires Civil Service and can only be bult in grassland hill river tiles. This improvement provides a base of 2 gold, +1 gold with Economy and 1 production with Biology. When it is connected to a city via road, it provides a source of Port, a luxury resurce. If the vineyard is destroyed, the resource is also destroyed.

If you did not like some of the ideas... here are the alternatives:

Spoiler :

ALternative Spanish Empire

Spoiler :

Felipe II
Madrid/Toledo (if Castile is in the game)
Starting Bias: Coast/Plains
Non sufficit orbis - While connected to the capital, each puppet sate generates gold and increases naval production by 10% in all cities (max 100%). Cargo Ships may defend themselves.
Conquistador- Chivalry (Knight); 135 prod.; 20 strenght; 4 movement; +2 extra sight; no defensive bonus; may defend while embarked; may found a puppet city on a continent other than the capital.
Tercio - Gunpowder (Musketman); 160 production/ 320 faith; 26 strenght; 2 movement; +100% VS Knight; May be spent in a puppet state to increase the defense and ranged strenght of the city while reducing the culture cost for aquiring new tiles.

Alternative Castilan Empire

Spoiler :

Reyes Catolicos (Double headed leader, simmilar to the Trung Sisters of Vietnam in CL)
Madrid
Starting Bias: Hills
Under one Crwon - Increased strenght while attacking cities that do not follow your religion and free inquisitors upon conquering them. May purchase naval units with faith, providing them +1 movement and +1 sight.
Spanish Carrak - Astronomy (Caravel); 120 production; 18 strenght; 4 movement; Withraw before melee; Double movement on ocean; Upon contact with the shore of a new continent provides a Scout, a Settler and an up to date cavalry unit on adjacent land tiles.
Santuario - Theology (Garden); 120 production; 25% Great People Generation; +1 gold and +1 faith for each 2 followers of your religion. Reduces Inquisitors' cost by 25%.

Alternative Portuguese Empire

Spoiler :

João II
Lisboa
Mare Clausum - Resource diversity grants twice as much Gold for Portugal in Trade Routes.
Nau - Astronomy (Caravel); 120 production; 20 strenght; 5 movement; can perform a one-time ability next to foreign lands to earn gold Gold and XP.
Feitoria - Can only be built in a City-State's lands, on a coastal tile without a resource. It provides one copy of each Luxury Resource type that the City-State has connected, regardless of your status with that City-State, but that copy cannot be traded. It also provides the same +50% defense bonus as a Fort.

(Basically changed leader.... Portugal kinda works very well in BNW, IMO)

Alternative Portuguese Empire (Under the House of Braganza)

Spoiler :

Maria I
Lisboa/Sintra (If João II is in the Game)
The Fifth Empire - Starting the medieval era Wine and Sugar resources provide double quantity and generate a gold basis on international trade rotes. Academies provide double science and landmarks double culture during golden ages. May reallocate the capital once per game starting a golden age.
Cassador - Replaces riffleman. Weaker than that unit, with only 28 , the cassador recieves a bonus of +100% strenght on a fort or fortlike improvement and has +33% strenght against melee units.
Linhas de Torres - Unique Improvement that can only be built within two tiles of your capital or of another equal improvement. It provides +100% strenght to units standing on it but enemy units may use it as well.

Hope you enjoy. Hope you do something like this when you have time and the art appears. Spain and Portugal would really be great additions to your civs

 

[GeneralSecura]

How does Lincoln work? Whenever I'm playing against Lincoln, I occasionally get a notification that a Caravansary/Market/whatever has been constructed in one of his cities, but I can't for the life of me figure out how to get the free buildings when I'm playing as Lincoln. Could you explain, JFD?

 

[JFD]

How does Lincoln work? Whenever I'm playing against Lincoln, I occasionally get a notification that a Caravansary/Market/whatever has been constructed in one of his cities, but I can't for the life of me figure out how to get the free buildings when I'm playing as Lincoln. Could you explain, JFD?

Ah, you shouldn't be getting those notifications when playing against him - though I thought I'd encountered and then fixed this issue. Basically, any gold buildings available are built simultaneously as your regular building project.

On a separate issue, I'd appreciate to hear everyone's thoughts on the Austrian UA. Do you like it? Do you think it a bit of a gimmick? Does it serve a practical strategy in your gameplay? etc. I would like the option to consider using it in a limited capacity for the Holy Roman Empire, but there are a lot of specific notifications about it being a "Diplomatic Marriage" that I would like to change, and I'm wondering if removing the function from Austria entirely would be too radical.

 

[GeneralSecura]

Ah, you shouldn't be getting those notifications when playing against him - though I thought I'd encountered and then fixed this issue. Basically, any gold buildings available are built simultaneously as your regular building project.

I might be using an outdated version. The one in my MODS folder says it's v1, but I just downloaded it again to check what version it's currently at and that one also says v1. So I'm not sure.

So I don't have to do anything to get the buildings? Don't have to click on them in the build menu or anything?

 

[JFD]

Nope, you don't have to do anything. I'm pretty sure I dealt with the original issue of you having to manually build the last turn, so re-download the mod just in case.

 

[Viregel]

For Ausria, the current UA is so amazingly perfect for them I'd hate to see it gone. However, there's a serious problem with synergy in the civ, which really nullifies the UA. I don't suppose the rest if the civ could be changed to fit the UA? (Perhaps even +25% GP generation in former City States, that makes the civ a whole lot more about CSs and expansion.)

 

[janboruta]

For Ausria, the current UA is so amazingly perfect for them I'd hate to see it gone. However, there's a serious problem with synergy in the civ, which really nullifies the UA. I don't suppose the rest if the civ could be changed to fit the UA? (Perhaps even +25% GP generation in former City States, that makes the civ a whole lot more about CSs and expansion.)

I agree with Viregel that Diplomatic Marriage is really, really good and historically relevant for Austria (come on, you can't erase any mechanical reference to the Habsburgs, just because one of them rules another civ and due to those marriages, the HRE in the 18th century basically meant Austria and not the rest of Germany). I can see and feel the discrepancy between the UA and other uniques, so maybe something can be done about them - but the UA.

Those historical reasons, at least for me, outweigh the need to change Austria. At the very least, the Coffee House could be tweaked a little bit. I'm a bit torn, because I'd like Austria to become a full Great Person civ, but I can't part with the diplo marriage for some reason. However, a compelling design will probably change my mind. (just like it happened with another neighbouring civ )

 

[Smartguy725]

Can I propose an idea? If I can, I think that an Ottoman split could be cool: Mehmet, focusing on conquest and has a Galleas replacement with Prize ships, and Suleiman focuses on the cultural focus of the Ottomans. Thoughts, comments, critic?

 

[Urdnot_Scott]

I agree with Viregel that Diplomatic Marriage is really, really good and historically relevant for Austria (come on, you can't erase any mechanical reference to the Habsburgs, just because one of them rules another civ and due to those marriages, the HRE in the 18th century basically meant Austria and not the rest of Germany). I can see and feel the discrepancy between the UA and other uniques, so maybe something can be done about them - but the UA.

Those historical reasons, at least for me, outweigh the need to change Austria. At the very least, the Coffee House could be tweaked a little bit. I'm a bit torn, because I'd like Austria to become a full Great Person civ, but I can't part with the diplo marriage for some reason. However, a compelling design will probably change my mind. (just like it happened with another neighbouring civ )

How about slightly tweaking the UA: 'May inherit city states by expending a great person in their borders. Each inherited city state adds +1 of a random great person point in the capital.' Then you could tweak the UU if needed but already the UA and UB would have great synergy.

Also, while I'm here,

More Civs has set a precedent for a four-way split (with India, Polynesia and Greece), so a Chinese split will consist of the four most impactful dynasties - the Han, the Ming, the Qing and the Tang (the latter mostly for Wu Zetian), with the Shu and Mao's China ideally developed alongside them.

Though I imagine this split is going to be a long time coming, I for one would be really excited to see it, something about splitting an existing civilisation is just more exciting than creating all new ones, probably because its amazing how much the community can improve on Firaxis' designs!

Do you have any idea what each of the dynasties will focus on? I'd personally say Han should focus on science, Ming on culture, with an isolationist twist, Qing on maintaining a very wide empire, with bonuses for growing to huge sizes maybe? The Tang were ridiculously successful though, and performed well in just about every category, so I wouldn't really know what angle to go for there, possibly military, given its not been taken by another dynasty. Trade would also be a good angle, given they worked hard to really capitalise on the silk road.

And why develop the Shu, I can't find anything about them being particularly relevant, if its because they were relatively early in terms of Chinese civilisation, why not use the Xia, who predated them massively? I suppose it depends which Shu you mean, but then, few of them seem particularly important anyway.

 

[JFD]

Can I propose an idea? If I can, I think that an Ottoman split could be cool: Mehmet, focusing on conquest and has a Galleas replacement with Prize ships, and Suleiman focuses on the cultural focus of the Ottomans. Thoughts, comments, critic?

It would make a lot of sense; although I'm not sure whether either would be able to take on the alternate Ottoman trait I have in the OP (and Vandals mod). Still, can't go wrong with Great Bombards.

Also, while I'm here,



Though I imagine this split is going to be a long time coming, I for one would be really excited to see it, something about splitting an existing civilisation is just more exciting than creating all new ones, probably because its amazing how much the community can improve on Firaxis' designs!

Do you have any idea what each of the dynasties will focus on? I'd personally say Han should focus on science, Ming on culture, with an isolationist twist, Qing on maintaining a very wide empire, with bonuses for growing to huge sizes maybe? The Tang were ridiculously successful though, and performed well in just about every category, so I wouldn't really know what angle to go for there, possibly military, given its not been taken by another dynasty. Trade would also be a good angle, given they worked hard to really capitalise on the silk road.

And why develop the Shu, I can't find anything about them being particularly relevant, if its because they were relatively early in terms of Chinese civilisation, why not use the Xia, who predated them massively? I suppose it depends which Shu you mean, but then, few of them seem particularly important anyway.

I have basic outline on the focus for each of the Dynasties: Tang == Golden Ages, Ming == Wonders+Exploration, Han == Economics, Qing == Isolationism/Protectionism, Shu == Military, Mao == Agriculturalism/Industrialism

The Shu is Sukritact's contribution to the split, and is a homage to the Three Kingdoms. I haven't anything to do with the choice or design, but is an opportunity for vanilla China's design to be retained somehow.

 

[Zantonius Hamm]

On a separate issue, I'd appreciate to hear everyone's thoughts on the Austrian UA. Do you like it? Do you think it a bit of a gimmick? Does it serve a practical strategy in your gameplay? etc. I would like the option to consider using it in a limited capacity for the Holy Roman Empire, but there are a lot of specific notifications about it being a "Diplomatic Marriage" that I would like to change, and I'm wondering if removing the function from Austria entirely would be too radical.

I think it is way too gimmicky and is quite honestly not useful enough. I mean, you lose almost all of the benefits of a city-state, AND you waste money on it. Venice does it way better... Although there's always the possibility of giving every civ the ability of diplomatic marriage, like in Scramble for Africa. I mean, it's happened other places than in Austria as well. Actually that would be great.

 

[JFD]

Taking Leugi's initiative, if anyone wants to try out Sukritact's Decisions mod, then Sukritact has released a beta to allow as much (though it's intended for Modders )

Currently, the following of my civs have decisions support:

• Belgium
• Great Britain
• Khazaria
• Switzerland
• Norway
• Churchill
• Hitler
• Carthage
• The Papal States

Feedback on balance is welcome; I know the Papal States decisions are too costly, but other comments on cost/reward potency is sought

 

[sukritact]

The Shu is Sukritact's contribution to the split, and is a homage to the Three Kingdoms. I haven't anything to do with the choice or design, but is an opportunity for vanilla China's design to be retained somehow.

Yes, to be more accurate; the civ will be the Shu Han one of the Three Kingdoms that arose after the downfall of the Han Dynasty. The civ will actually represent all three states however. I just picked the Shu as the main representative.

The period is heavily romanticized in Asia: while the Art of War tends to be the most talked about peice of Chinese literature in the west, the Romance of the Three Kingdoms is much more well known here in the east. (on a side note there's even a MtG card set)

 

[Leugi]

Hello Lenin:



Also, a version with his fancy hat if you'd rather have it:

Spoiler :

 

[BttLsht]

Alright then a few things, lightning is messed up considering this is sunset and that it comes from the west so the light should drop on the left side of Lenin, which gives me a transition to the next thing that bothers me which is Lenin stole some Cuban cloths, now reusing past works and using it as a base isn't all that bad as long it is not common and complements the other parts of the work which is the face and it looks pretty low quality, a result of Lenin being so small to the rest of the picture.

Final verdict: I hope my grammar was right.

 

[janboruta]

For once I have to say that current (TPangolin's) Lenin looks better. But that's just my opinion.