Just a random map

[elitetroops]

Indeed, there are some techs you have an incentive to complete with as little overflow as possible.
Most common reason is : you'll get an instant increase in commerce and your science multipliers will have better value on the following turn (Currency, Civil Service, Printing Press, Astronomy are all options). If you're racing and have a huge gold deposit, it might not matter but in some conditions, it's better to finish the tech with as little overflow as possible (Currency, especially true).

Not sure if I follow you here... It is better to complete Currency earlier to get the extra trade route earlier, but this has nothing to do with overflow. If Currency is researched on turn N, then it doesn't matter if it has very little or a lot of overflow. It only makes a difference if the low overflow option also means it is completed earlier. The techs you mention don't add any value to your multiplier buildings, they only increase total commerce. It doesn't matter if that commerce is converted to gold before or after the tech is researched.

A tech that could work with the inverse effect (decrease in commerce) is Scientific Method, since it obsoletes Monasteries.

This would depend if science overflow is processed locally or globally. My guess is that it is done globally, in which case you would indeed get to keep all local modifiers (multipliers in cities) for the overflow making high OF a good idea.

 

[elitetroops]

You are never converting gold into beakers, you are converting commerce into beakers or commerce into gold. Currency increases your total commerce at some point, but it does not matter if you convert commerce into gold before or after you get this increase. As long as you get the increase on the same turn, your total commerce will be the same and you have just as much commerce to spend either on gold or science. Science modifier buildings has no effect on this.

 

[intutama]

I decided to create a post in the Strategy Articles section concerning this topic. Maybe it is of relevance for the future new war academy.

https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/beaker-overflow.624745/

 

[jatamixx]

Yeah I had a feeling of déja vu when I read "and the woodsman mace is in position to catch some workers"
Thought it was just me though lol

Keep up BIC, Nationalism > drafting > domination you are on the right path imho

 

[dutchfire]

I've got the impression that you're doing lots of long-term investments at the moment. Settling overseas, settling the gems in the middle of the bloody jungle, working cottages in the recently cleared jungle, and the war. I personally prefer to go a bit more all-in on wars. Here you've given Willem a lot of time to build up his defences and this is making the war a lot more expensive. The 50 AD screenshot shows two defenders in Maastricht, with a swordsman at the top. Wouldn't an extra unit or two going to Maastricht at that point be more valuable than the settler you've build for the gems? In terms of shortening the war, avoiding reinforcements and in terms of short and medium-term pay-off.

This is also visible in your tile improvements. A city like Canterbury might have had a few farms and just be whipville for some time to produce an army that would have given you another city by now.

I appreciate that this is all said with hindsight and that this makes it easy to comment.

Yes, I think you're right.

Farms : I'm quite sure I should have done more, so as to get more production. I've almost played to 800 AD and that decision still bites me. (Also, I favoured Forges over Universities in commerce cities, which I now feel was a mistake.)
Build orders : it's a tough call. If you build more troops, you may be able to conquer faster. War takes a bigger toll on your economy, too, but if it ends earlier, chances are you end up better off. Once I know my stack won't get countered, however, the temptation is real to invest in those settlers, far away galleys, set up the National Epic, give the capital its multipliers...

I don't know the right answer, here. Those long term investments also allow to keep up turn by turn with Mansa/Hannibal. It might be a soft spot of mine.
For sure, I misjudged the number of units I needed to capture Maastricht.

Actually, I didn't anticipate I'd go after Maastricht right after Amsterdam's capture. I just happened to see I had 5 units in the area, including 2 catapults. I probably should have adjusted my builds a little more at that point, to get the appropriate melee count, but the decision was made on the fly.

I think some of this came back in the most recent turnset. Waging war and going for Liberalism simultaneously is difficult. Here, you've done both but that has meant a rather prolonged war and getting a mediocre tech from Liberalism. Would it have been better to focus on one or the other?

Anyway, the game still looks good. Nice land, decent situation in terms of techs. Meeting the other continent will be important. Is it an option to attempt a bribe between Mansa and Hannibal at some point to slow them down?

What's the next planned war? Drafted Redcoats+Trebs?

 

[dutchfire]

Have you located all 8 Dutch cities already? Bit hard to tell from the screenshots.

You mention setting up universities. On what time scale do you think they'll pay off? I think I would rather invest more in conquering Huayna quickly (build wealth and subsequently units) than building universities here.

Did Willem found Islam somewhere? It would be of great use for you if Versailles was built in the New World.

 

[Snowbird]

Continuing (part 2), to turn 147 (740 AD) :

Spoiler :

Hmm... Dover offers an interesting question : how do you develop such a city ?
I didn't go as far as doing maths for it. Do you start with Lighthouse or Granary ? How do you complete the build ?
I opted for : Lighthouse first, grow to size 3 and hire 2 citizens, then whip 1 population at 30 hammers. Not sure if it's the best way to do it.
I think the 1pop whip at size 3 is good but it's possible that Granary first should be favoured.

Spoiler :

Lighthouse gives +1 food to any tile worked, so granary first never pays off in time (typically you want both LH and granary as first builds - and lighthouse first gets it faster since LH delivers immediately while granary takes some time and you have no grow potential to use it)

I think hiring citizen at size two improves city fastest, but of course extra coins might be worth it for empire.

In theoretical best, you whip warrior at size two (in order to get 15 hammer overflow which while sucky beats hiring citizens). With warrior whip, clam/crab only city can have LH ~turn 16, and with second warrior whip granary is ~t26-27. City will be size one at ~half food bin (IIRC, one turn taking clams off at some point is needed to halt growth, whip earlier). Ofcourse, whipping warriors is not an option for you... Still growing to size three is megaslow... city has what +3 food on size two?

 

[jatamixx]

After reading about the 1 crab / 1 clam city issue, I wanted to elaborate on Snowbird method and compare it with another way of solving this puzzle, courtesy of Doshin and/or Shakabrade.

Snowbird method : 27 turns for LH + granary + 2 warriors

Spoiler :

- Grow for 6 turns, city is level 2 with 2 and 5 into LH + 1 into warrior.
- Whip warrior, city is level 1 with 6 and 15 capped overflow.
- Grow for 4 turns, city is level 2 with 0 and 24 into LH.
- Hire a citizen for 3 turns, city is level 2 with 6 and 30 into LH.
- Whip LH, city is level 1 with 10 and 1 overflow.
-----Total 15 turns-------
- Grow for 3 turns, city is level 2 with 3 and 3 into granary + 1 into warrior.
- Whip warrior, city is level 1 with 8 and 15 capped overflow.
- Grow for 3 turns, city is level 2 with 1 and 21 into granary.
- Hire a citizen for 2 turns, city is level 2 with 7 and 25 into granary.
- Hire 2 citizens for 2 turn, city is level 2 with 7 and 31 into granary.
- Whip granary, city is level 1 with 12 and 2 overflow.
-----Total 12 turn------

A la worker method : 42 turns for LH + granary + 2 workers

Spoiler :

- Stagnate for 10 turns, city is level 1 with 0 and 50 into worker.
- Grow for 6 turns, city is level 2 with 2 and 6 into LH.
- Whip worker, city is level 1 with 2 and 25 overflow.
- Grow for 5 turn, city is level 2 with 0 and 30 into LH.
- Whip LH, city is level 1 with 4 and 1 overflow.
-----Total 23 turns- ---
- Grow for 4 turns, city is level 2 with 2 and 5 into granary.
- Grow for 4 turns, city level 2 with 22 and 9 into granary.
- Stagnate for 8 turns, city is level 2 with 22 and 48 into worker.
- Whip worker, city is level 1 with 22 and 24 overflow.
- Grow for 1 turn, city is level 2 with 5 and 34 into granary.
- whip granary, city is level 1 with 10 and 5 overflow.
- --Total 19 turn----

Feel free to point at eventual mistakes

 

[Snowbird]

After reading about the 1 crab / 1 clam city issue, I wanted to elaborate on Snowbird method and compare it with another way of solving this puzzle, courtesy of Doshin and/or Shakabrade.

Snowbird method : 27 turns for LH + granary + 2 warriors


A la worker method : 42 turns for LH + granary + 2 workers

15 turns with LH and granary is lot of pop which can be whipped into whatever is needed, more like extra settler i think. Also earlier growth means more coins from the coast.

Even early on, I think, one worker and one warrior since second worker really slows in that version.

 

[jatamixx]

Digging in old Shaka-threads, aren't you ? Possibly SGOTM ?

Nah just fragments of memory

PS : Hi Pomthom have you had enough of Brexit ?

 

[Rusten]

Wow! I didn't realise your cities were so small! It must have truly pained your soul to see so many unworked green tiles.

F1 660 AD

Spoiler :

 

[dutchfire]

I keep mentioning this stuff about the military because :
- Dutchfire was right all along ;

War should be decisive.

 

[Pedro78]

What VC did you choose? I'm asking that because you're having a very good game: teching fast, conquering fast etc. But it doesn't seem like you're headed towards any specific VC -- invading the other continent is counterproductive for Space, you're also getting many techs that are useless for conquest or diplo. My expert eyes tell that you're not likely to be headed for Culture either

So my question is: what the purpose of your game, i.e. where does the motivation stem from? Or is the idea to have fun in a game where you're far ahead and can experiment outside-the-box strategies? I'm really interested in the answer to this because I myself have a lot of trouble finishing the games I start.

But whatever the answer, I really like your write-ups : not only are you having a good game but you also make it interesting to follow