Keldr's HoF attempts

[keldr]

620 AD:
Take the mongol cities of Kazan and Darhan, still only meeting pikes and longbows. Move elite knights in as MPs to stop resistance and prevent flips, since i won’t be needing elites in combat until I have used my MGL.
Move the remaining cavalry into positions to take another 3 Mongol cities next turn.
Rush a settler in St. Petersburg to take over a nice spot of grassland in a few turns.
Rush another settler in Karakorum, which will be sttling the gems when my cavalry have cleared the path.


630 AD:
Take the mongol cities of Uliastay, Mandalgovi, Ulaanbaatar and their new capital Tsertserleg.
Right after taking the cities i saw the first little bit of war weariness. But I’m not too worried since the war won’t be lasting very long, in this round I faced more spears than pikes (I took their iron just two or three turns into the war), and I will have gems in just a few turns...

640-660 AD
Continue to take several Mongol Cities each turn. Then make peace at the end of a turn in order to get their 3 offshore cities.
In 660 AD I discover Banking, and finds that the Byzantines have Astronomy
I trade with them, getting Astronomy and 74 gpt in exchange for Banking. Cutting 4-5 turns from my race to rails

670 AD:
Take what I thought was the last mongol city of Saynshand, but they turn out to have a settler 4 tiles away, so it will be one more turn before they will be wiped out.

IBT:
The mongols settle their last capital, getting a few spears and longbows. The longbows take out one of my cavalry units, and 2 spears and a pike move out of the city as well

680 AD:
I take out the two longbows with elite cavalries, and then destroy the last mongol city that had only 2 spears left for defence...
I rush a few settlers in ex-mongolia, so they don’t have that long to travel before settling. The 70-80 pieces of cavalry in the northern part of ex-mongolia start the short journey to the german border for an iminent attack.
The elimination of the Mongols have done wonders for my happiness, raising the approval rating in the F11 screen from 78% to 92%

It turns out that gems will still be a few turns away as the mongols was unable to get them connected even though they had more than 4600 years to do so

 

[Elear]

Looks like you are doing well.

But you BADLY need railroads, whatever it takes, because it seems like it is a nightmare to maintain your supply lines, getting new troops and settlers to the frontier. This is slowing you down a lot.

 

[keldr]

I definately agree about the railroads. It's not too bad with the military, since most of my cavalry is already at the front, and I'm focusing on settlers and banks in the core at the moment.
The worst part is the settlers, that are taking forever to reach the captured areas, fortunately I've easily been able to keep most of the mongol cities, and are rushing a few settlers each turn in 3+ size cities.

I'm thinking about gifting Physics to the fastest researching AI's when I'm done with it. But I don't know weither they will go for magnetism or theory of gravity, since I should probably go the other way, and maybe win a few turns if they research it in less than 8 turns...

 

[Elear]

Perhaps I am wrong here but AIs tend to research Theory of Gravity first. I consistently play with scientific AIs, like you are doing, so perhaps this will hold true as well. Go for Magnetism if you try that.

And yes, railroads are a common problem. I once had a Monarch game (probably lost in some archive now...) where I had an outstanding 8 cattle, 2 wheat, perfect grassland start on Huge/Monarch, and I blew it because at that time, I wasn't competent at maintaining my supply lines. My conquest got bogged down and around 1400 AD I gave up because I was evidentally just not getting to the domination limit very fast.

 

[keldr]

Perhaps I am wrong here but AIs tend to research Theory of Gravity first. I consistently play with scientific AIs, like you are doing, so perhaps this will hold true as well. Go for Magnetism if you try that.

I'm not playing with all scientific AIs, I only have Russians, Germans, Koreans and Byzantines, but you could be right about them going for ToG, I'm thinking maybe because of Newtons being Scientific. I just think I have seen someone writing about AIs choosing units over improvements and wonders, and with Magnetism giving privateers, galleons and frigates, I'm a bit puzzled about how that weighs up against Newtons.

...around 1400 AD I gave up because I was evidentally just not getting to the domination limit very fast.

I don't think I'm slowed too much down at the moment especially if I can have rails in the 700s... I reached 20 % domination in 660 AD, compared to the current #1 reaching it in 760 AD. I'm currently making 57 ppt compared to 49 ppt, although I'm still trailing about 200 pts due to slow initial expansion... I will be allright if I have a continental rail by the time I have conquered Germany since I expect to have all the military I need for that already at the german border.

 

[keldr]

The pics in this reply are a bit weird - I might fix it later if I remember - right now I must sleep...

690 AD: Prepare for the invasion of Germany
700 AD: Prepare for the invasion of Germany

710 AD:
Discover Physics
Declare war on the Germans, take 3 cities.
7 elite wins, but no leaders.
Sells Physics to Byzantines for 58 gpt and 37 gold
Sells Physics to America for 9 gold
Gives Physics to Korea
In retrospect it might not have been the best idea to take the 58 gpt from the Byzantines since it probably will slow down their research, decreasing the chance that anyone will discover Theory of Gravity for me. But I’ll wait and see...

720 AD:
Take 2 german cities (another 5 elite wins but still no leader)
Move around 60 Cavalry into position to take another 3-4 cities next turn depending on the german infastructure. (Not even the 10 elite knights can keep up with the conquest, because the germans have only spears, longbows and horsemen.)

Around 100 workers continue to road and irrigate ex-mongolia.
3 new cities founded in ex-mongolia
Rush 5 settlers in ex- mongolia, in my effort to prevent the slow-down of my expansion.

IBT: A single german counterattack from a longbow is killed by one of my cavalry. A few german units are moved towards my recently captured cities, but still only spears and horses...

730 AD:
Gems are finally connected, and I now have all 8 luxes, though I’m still depending on import of furs from America and Dyes from Korea.
3rd eilte win of the turn grant me my 4th leader
Pentagon prebuild not too well timed – still 15 turns to go... But I don’t need it until after the conquest of Germany.

IBT
New Heidelburg flipped back to the germans, it was only guarded by 2 recovering cavalries, so it’s not hurting med too much... I’ll be able to take it back next turn...
Other than that, only scattered german forces trying to move around my progressing army. But with nothing but spears, horses and longbows, I’m not really that concerned...

740 AD:
Take “back” New Heidelburg with an elite knight against a spear...
Get another leader from an elite knight when taking out the scattered german troops...
Take another 3 german cities. Berlin should be only 1 turn away, also taking away germany’s horses, after which I should meet nothing but spears and longbows...
Also take the german colony of New Salzburg...

IBT: A lonely german horseman on the colony island to the north capture 2 workers and a settler
Some scattered german activity, but no noteworthy counterattacks.

750 AD:
Take Frankfurt, Munich and Berlin with no artillery and only loose one cavalry – gotta love them spears (good thing I don’t have tanks yet )
My conquest tacitc, is somewhat risky with regard to flip risks, but if I can prevent flips just this one turn I will for sure take at least 6 more german cities next turn leaving them with only 1 more metro.
Not sure however if I will keep Berlin, since i only have 3 cavalries defending it against 11 resisters. Furthermore the germans have 12000+ culture compared to my 5000+. I’m thinking I will risk it, since I will be easily able to retake it next turn if it flips, and the war won’t be lasting for too long even if I should get a little war weariness from a flip.

I also capture the last two german colonies on the northern continent, and move 2 cavalries right next to the german horseman, he might be able to re-capture 2 more slaves next turn, but it will be the last thing he does...

750 AD (turn #190) stats:
Area: 25%
Population: 52%
Score: 3498
Ppt: 64
Magnetism due in 1 turn
151 cities
1699 squares (F11 – so don’t know how many domination tiles that is)
Approval rating: 90% (At only 10 % lux slider – even at 30 % it’s still 90% approval)
8 Luxes (6 connected, 2 imported)
Only Mongols are eliminated, but Portugal is a 1CC on the coast of England, and Russia is confined to ~5 cities on a small island (plus two cities to the east and south of Korea. And Germany will be history arond 800 AD.

Military:
4 Armies (1 knight, 3 cavalry)
108 Cavalries
25 Knights
35 Horsemen
126 Workers
23 Settlers
13 Galleys
Some more useless junk, some of which serve different semi-useful purposes

The minimap at 750 AD:

 

[keldr]

760 AD - 770 AD

Berlin doesn’t flip, and my overwhelming army of 3 cavalries actually quell 2 resisters
On the other hand New Dortmund flips back – I suppose it’s not too surprising since it was undefended, but it was a size 1 town as far from the current german border as possible. Anyway, it won’t cause too much trouble, I’ll just retake it...

760 AD:
Discover magnetism – set research to theory of gravity which is due in 4 turns with more than 300 gpt to spare, I really don’t want to wait for the AIs to research it for me, since I have no idea how fast their research is at the moment, and for all I know they could research Music theory, economics or navigation, which I have no interest in at the moment.
With a little luck I should have Steam in 800 AD...

Since Berlin didn't flip this will be a bad turn for the germans...
Retake New Dortmund with a single cavalry.
Capture New Berlin – only guarded by two spears
Capture Nuremberg – loose one veteran cavalry against two spears and a treb.
Use a 4/5 elite cavalry to get rid of a longbow in front of Leipzig and gain a MGL
Capture Bremen – guarded by 3 spears gaining one elite
Capture Dortmund – guarded by 2 spears
Capture Hamburg – guarded by 2 spears
Capture Leipzig – cannot remember the defenders, but one of my 12/12 cavalry armies was reduced to 6/12 by an unfortified spear

Rush another bunch of settlers in ex-mongolia. With the money saved in the final turn of research on magnetism I had almost 1000 gold to spend this turn...


IBT:
Two german longbows move up next to Leipzig
But it shouldn’t be too much of a challenge for 3 cavalry armies, and 10-15 cavalries I have nearby...
New Nuremberg flips to the germans. It was guarded by 3 cavalries, and again no way near the german borders, but score one more for the RNG
Anyway it’s a marginal town, and should be no problem to retake...


770 AD:
Retake new nuremberg – guarded by 1 spear
Capture new konigsberg – guarded by 2 spears
Capture Bonn – guarded by 2 spears
Capture New Frankfurt – guarded by 3 spears – choose to raze it since a flip would cost me my knight army
Capture Cologne – guarded by 3 spears and a catapult – I loose one cavalry in the effort
Capture Heidelburg – guarded by 3 spears and a treb. Now own the Temple of artemis which obviously is irrelevant – and only 600 years old, so it’s not even a tourist attraction yet...
Berlin, Leipzig, Cologne and Heidelberg are almost 100% resisters, but I’ll keep them anyway, since they have large populations, which is a nice score boost once i eliminate the last 5-6 german cities. In the mean time I just keep my military out of the cities, so I will be able to retake them the next turn if they flip.
Improvement of ex-mongolian terrain continues, trying to gather the workers close to the future placement of the trans-continental railroad. A small gathering of presently unemployed workers also start to appear in and around the core cities...

An overview of the remaining part of Germany:

 

[Elear]

Why did you choose to fight up that peninsula? It strikes me that until you have railroads, it will take a decent amount of time to march back to the main attack route.

 

[keldr]

It was mostly because the germans had nothing but spears and horsemen, and I because of that would be able to conquer them faster. If they had a little more time, they would have been able to connect their saltpeter and get muskets...
And they were the most powerful civs, and I suspected they would be able to upgrade a lot of spears quite fast. And spears against cavalry is great for leader farming

Byzantines and Korea have pikes and no saltpeter, so it will make no difference weither I attacked them before or after the germans.

But you are right, that it will take 3-4 turns to move cavalry from the far end of the german peninsula. But I don't move my entire army all the way up there, and I have already started to move some of them back, so it shouldn't hold me up too long.

Also I won't be attacking the Byzantines or the Koreans until after i discover Theory of Gravity, because I don't know how many of the 4 scientific civs I will have to gift up to the IA before I can get Steam and Medicine from them.
Best case scenario is that I will only have to gift Russia and Germany, so I won't be fighting rifles in Korea or Byzantium, but that might just be dreaming on my part


So long story short, I wanted to do some leader farming, and prevent the germans from getting muskets. And I won't be attacking Byz/Korea until I have (hopefully) traded for steam in 800 AD, and by that time I should have an army big enough to attack at the Byz border. Plus When I get steam, it will only be a few turns before I have a transcontinental railroad, which means faster settler transport to the front for colonizing.

 

[Elear]

Alright, this makes more sense.

Plus, if you are about to discover Theory of Gravity, perhaps you will have Steam Power very soon and can position a line of workers from Germany to the main frontier in stacks of 3 to create as much of your railroad system on the first turn possible to allow as many Cavalry to use it as possible.

 

[keldr]

Excactly. ToG is 3 turns away, and with a little luck I should be able to trade for steam in 3 turns as well. I should be able to time this with the germans only having around 1 city left. So after I take their free tech (steam please ) they will be eliminated, and whatever few armies I have in Germany will no longer be needed to quell resisters, and will be able to make most of their journey to the Byz border by train.

Best case scenario is that I will be able to get steam and Medicine from the AIs, and I will only have to research Electricity and Scientific Method, build ToE, take Sanitation and Replaceable Parts as free techs, and turn research to 0%, and watch the money roll in and start rushing stuff.

Worst case scenario is that all 4 scientific AIs get Nationalism, I will have to research steam and medicine myself along with the two techs mentioned above, and I will be facing rifles very soon in Korea and Byzantium.

 

[Spoonwood]

I say don't take your chances and keep the AIs away from the industrial age as much as possible.

 

[keldr]

I will definately gift the germans up, since I will be able to destroy them before they can trade around.

My biggest concern is if the Americans and English will also get their hands on Nationalism, since they are much more powerful than Korea and Byzantium.

I have thought about starting a few wars, by making the americans and english declare war on Korea and Byzantium, so they cannot trade IA techs. But I'm not sure I have a good enough reputation to make this possible. Nor do I think I can afford to start 4 wars in one turn.

 

[Marsden]

You could also go by results, if the Germans get steam then you won't need to worry about the Byz, so just start with them. I don't think you should have too much trouble with riflemen though.

 

[keldr]

I have thought about just taking steam if the germans get it, and research medicine by myself, since i consider steam much more of a priority than getting replaceable parts and sanitation 4 turns later...

I'm just not sure if I am overrating rifles, as some of you mentioned earlier, it's probably only going to be one rifle in each city...

 

[Elear]

I disagree on denying the AI riflemen. As already stated, the first AI you gift into the IA may end up gettiing Steam Power. Even if some end up with nationalism, they will likely not have very many riflemen even by the time you arrive at their doorstep. Buy their gold from them if necessary to prevent mass upgrades.

I think you are powerful enough and productive enough to overwhelm anyone. With railroads and buying armies/cavalry/settlers, I see no reason why you shouldn't be able to just overwhelm anything they have. Even if they had infantry, it would still be possible.

edit: I also agree with your thought to self-research Medicine and Sanitation if you get Steam Power right off the bat. No reason to risk AIs getting Nationalism once you have Steam Power.

 

[Spoonwood]

I guess it's "only" Emperor level, so rifles might not work out as big of a deal as they would on say Deity.

 

[keldr]

780 AD - 790 AD


IBT: No german cities flip. Nothing else worth mentioning


780:
Take Konigsberg from the germans, but it is the only german city I can reach this turn. It is not really important, as I will still be able to time the conquest of the germans with the discovery of ToG two turns from now.
Continue to settle/resettle the mongol land, and produce some more workers for future rail construction.


IBT:
Heidelburg and Nuremberg flips

790 AD:
Retake Heidelburg and Nuremberg – Both comfortably within reach of a fully healed cavalry army
Capture Salzburg and Hannover
A little bit of war weariness is starting to show – a good thing the german war will only last one more turn
Will discover ToG next turn, and see how it goes with the trading...

Just checked around to see that none of the three fast researchers (America, Byz and Korea) had discovered ToG or Magnetism yet, so not much help from them...

On the positive side Korea doesn’t have Saltpeter and Byz doesn’t have saltpeter or horses, so no muskets in the next two wars

England has horses and saltpeter, but no iron – and they are still 3 techs from Military Tradition. Which means I will be facing muskets there, but they have no iron for knights, and they are still quite far from cavalry...

America will definately be the challenge from a military point of view. They have the largest empire, they have iron, horses and saltpeter, and they have all techs except for Magnetism.

This is also evident by looking at the power graph. Though I must admit I'm starting to like the look of it

 

[keldr]

800 AD - 840 AD

IBT:
Discover Theory of Gravity
Berlin flips

800 AD:
Sign a peace treaty with the germans, and gift them up to the IA. Unfortunately they get nationalism.
I gift up the Russians and they get Steam Power, but I am unable to trade with them, since they will not accept any deal with gpt...

I might just be showing off my ignorance and/or inexperience in reputation here, but I try to gift up the Byzantines, hoping that they will be more willing to accept a gpt deal since we have had several such deals, and the are paying me in gpt in 3 different deals at the moment. They actually get medicine, but again gpt is not possible.

Since it is not possible to trade any techs from the AIs I decide not to gift up the Koreans since I don’t really see a point in it.

I declare on the Germans and take their last three cities. At least now Nationalism is no longer in the game...

After all this I will have to research steam on my own, and wait another 4 turns to get it – unless the russians will trade for it before...

It is a bit of a setback, but not a gamebreaker in any way. It would probably take a few turns until I was ready to attack Byz anyway, since I will wait for my cavalry armies to return from Germany. The biggest impact will be on my settlers since they are getting nowhere without railroad. If I have to find something positive it would be the fact that since my settlers are taking a long time to reach the Byzantine border, it doesn’t matter too much that I have a few turns of peace before declaring on them.
A few turns' wait should also mean, that my forces will be much more concentrated, which means a shorter war and less war weariness.


810 AD:
Loose furs from America and dyes from Korea

Trade with the Americans – get furs and 20 gpt for Magnetism and 3 luxes...
Trade with the Koreans – get dyes, 23 gpt and 38 gold for Magnetism and ToG

It probably won’t last the full 20 turns, but Dyes are nice to have for as long as it lasts...
Korea actually gets steam power as well. But still no trade possible...


820 AD:
55 Cavalry at the Byzantine border + 4 armies within reach.
I am currently getting 74 gpt for another 4 turns, and 58 gpt for another 9 turns from the Byzantines
But I decide to declare on them anyway, since there is no point in waiting. I capture Ohrid, Prilep and New Adrianople, and autoraze two other towns...
I also find furs right next to Ohrid so the trade with the americans unfortunately turned out pretty useless...

830 AD:
Capture New Constantinople, but due to jungle that is the only town I can reach this turn. But with 3 cavalry armies ready to strike Chalcedon next turn, that jungle shouldn’t be a problem any longer

I try to get steam power from the russians in a trade to save at least one turn from the research, but they don’t seem to interested...

Spices, ivory and silks are also on the table, but it still wasn't enough to please her...

I actually was able to get them to accept a deal if I also added wines, furs and gems... But I think I will take one more turn of research instead...


840 AD:
Discover Steam Power at long last...
And I have coal in the city of “005”
Capture Chalcedon which was only guarded by two pikes – So I am now able to use the road through the three tiles of jungle...
Capture Smyrna with a couple of armies, and fill it up with cavalry

Set research to electricity to be discovered in 5 turns at 80 %.
With 10 % lux and a lot of micromanaging it’s possible to loose only 25 gpt.


The Byzantine battlefield at the end of 840 AD

IBT:
6 Medieval Infantries advance towards Smyrna – I really think their scouting is somewhat insufficient – since they failed to see the 50+ cavalries I have stationed in and around the town. Not to mention the 4 armies also around...

 

[Spoonwood]

Maybe you saved a little commerce since they had Steam before you learned it.