Kim Jong Il Has Died

[aronnax]

I'm not so sure. From what I've read, the chaos of the '90s cracked the carefully cultivated façade of the Kim regime pretty irreparably. Defections sky-rocketed- more so than we often realise, in fact, because most of them didn't defect to South Korea, but ended up hiding out among the Korean population of China- and most of those who escaped report not only an obvious scepticism towards the regime on their part, but that the tremendous fallibility of the regime is by now an open secret. It's not quite at the point of the Glasnost-era USSR, but it's a long way from what it was fifty years ago.

It's a mix of both I suppose. Pyongyang is and always has been the show case city of North Korea. They get the best of everything and first priority in terms of food, shelter and resources. Only the incredibly loyal get the right to stay there. Those Pyongyang documentary seems to show that the average Pyongyang family, although completely brainwashed, are to some extent genuinely happy and grateful for Kimmy's regime protecting them from America. Pyongyang and the probably few other cities where those tourist go are still deeply entrenched. The other areas, the rural and the forsaken cities are probably, as you described, sceptical towards the regime and so on.

 

[Traitorfish]

It's a mix of both I suppose. Pyongyang is and always has been the show case city of North Korea. They get the best of everything and first priority in terms of food, shelter and resources. Only the incredibly loyal get the right to stay there. Those Pyongyang documentary seems to show that the average Pyongyang family, although completely brainwashed, are to some extent genuinely happy and grateful for Kimmy's regime protecting them from America. Pyongyang and the probably few other cities where those tourist go are still deeply entrenched. The other areas, the rural and the forsaken cities are probably, as you described, sceptical towards the regime and so on.

That's a fair point.

 

[CELTICEMPIRE]

I'm not sure if this is good or bad, but if North Korea goes to war with the South, we'll all know the outcome.

 

[Ajidica]

I'm not sure if this is good or bad, but if North Korea goes to war with the South, we'll all know the outcome.

I'm not worried about war. If they go to war soon, it will be obvious the generals aren't mourning the Dear Great Leader enough, and therefore have to be shot as Imperialist spies.

 

[Antilogic]

I'm not sure if this is good or bad, but if North Korea goes to war with the South, we'll all know the outcome.

Western intervention, possible Chinese intervention, tons of casualties and outright destruction up and down the Korean peninsula for years?

 

[Ajidica]

Western intervention, possible Chinese intervention, tons of casualties and outright destruction up and down the Korean peninsula for years?

If this happens, the number of people saying "History repeats itself" will result in every pseudo-historian on CFC committing mass forum departure.

 

[Traitorfish]

If this happens, the number of people saying "History repeats itself" will result in every pseudo-historian on CFC committing mass forum departure.

First time as a tragedy, second time as a farce?

 

[Antilogic]

If this happens, the number of people saying "History repeats itself" will result in every pseudo-historian on CFC committing mass forum departure.

About the response I was expecting. I debated adding a line about a brilliant landing at Incheon but thought that would be pushing it too far.

 

[Ayn Rand]

It's fascinating - I should hate North Korea's society but I don't. I can't escape the overwhelming impression that 90% of the things written about it are completely unsubstantiated. And the more I read people's commentaries, the more I develop a surreal sense that North Korea is some kind of a mirror-society to ours, mocking us and our own illusions in ways that would be funny if only we could see them

 

[Narz]

time for #occupyPyongyang

Personally my favorite is #occupyPoontang

 

[Mr. Dictator]

Well, I bet 2012 will be a good year for at least this Dictator.

 

[Elta]

Personally my favorite is #occupyPoontang

 

[Traitorfish]

It's fascinating - I should hate North Korea's society but I don't. I can't escape the overwhelming impression that 90% of the things written about it are completely unsubstantiated. And the more I read people's commentaries, the more I develop a surreal sense that North Korea is some kind of a mirror-society to ours, mocking us and our own illusions in ways that would be funny if only we could see them

So you're familiar with the 1984-but-real theory of the North Korean state?

 

[Ayn Rand]

So you're familiar with the 1984-but-real theory of the North Korean state?

Funny you mentioned 1984, as it's the scene of the 5-minutes-hate which always springs into my mind when I read threads like this

 

[Quackers]

The last communist dictator, sure, but it's a bit naive to imagine that the collapse of the Workers' Party regime means democracy, freedom, Big Macs, etc. There's a faction within the North Korean state that has for some time been pushing for a reconstitution of the regime as a corporate gulag-state, letting Western, South Korean and Chinese companies take advantage of the rock-bottom labour costs and trimming of a nice slice of the fat for themselves. They're the ones who are most likely to be the immediate benefactors of any such moves towards de-Juchification.

Almost anything is better then the present situation. Maybe they could even feed there population in a corporate gulag state!

 

[ParkCungHee]

Expect a few more "free trade zones" to crop up soon, and South Korean exploitation to ramp up.

 

[Luckymoose]

Any war with North Korea would be over in a matter of days, if not hours, and would be a complete loss for their regime.

 

[Pangur Bán]

Any war with North Korea would be over in a matter of days, if not hours, and would be a complete loss for their regime.

Foolish jingoism. No-one with any knowledge thinks that.

 

[CELTICEMPIRE]

Foolish jingoism. No-one with any knowledge thinks that.

you'd be surprised

 

[Pangur Bán]

you'd be surprised

I wouldn't be that surprised, as I'm perfectly used to Americans congratulating themselves on their "military invincibility" and declaring that all their enemies are just mere paper awaiting Uncle Sam's flamethrower, but give me some names please. I'll probably go no true Scotsman on them, but I'd like to hear some names nonetheless.