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Late Game Wonders

Discussion in 'Civ5 - General Discussions' started by Yrrebnot, Aug 1, 2013.

  1. Yrrebnot

    Yrrebnot Chieftain

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    Since they have made the game much more late-game focused you would think that there would have been more late-game Wonders.. But no there are less (we lost the UN)
    Anyone else think they should introduce some extra Modern, Atomic and Information Age Wonders?
    It really spoilt my wonder spamming game when i ran out of buildings to build in the late game lol.
     
  2. ballingforlife

    ballingforlife Chieftain

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    To name a few: I think the 3 gorges dam, Empire State Building, and Burj Khalifa would be good choices. Can't think of an Atomic Era one with quite as much support. Maybe Hollywood, but I've seen absolutely torn up in some threads.
     
  3. VainoValkea

    VainoValkea Emperor

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    There really is a decent amount, but they run out much quicker with the likely availability of Great Engineers to rush them. In the diplomacy/culture beeline to Globalization/Internet, by memory, there's Big Ben, Statue of Liberty, Prora, Louvre, Broadway, Eiffel Tower, Christo Redentor and the Sydney Opera House in industrial era and beyond. Not that few. Of course, that's ignoring everything beyond that beeline, the part of the tree I rarely climb.

    EDIT: For late-game wonders, if they wanted, they could introduce stuff like SETI and Three Gorges Dam from earlier establishments. Although I personally think adding SETI as a wonder was a horrible decision anyway...
     
  4. Yrrebnot

    Yrrebnot Chieftain

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    Information Era has 2 Wonders... CN tower and Hubble Space Telescope
    seems a little short
    The Atomic Era has a grand total of 3 Wonders.. also a little short.
    i also forgot they have removed the Internet as a wonder as well
    So we have lost 2 wonders and gained none and there are plenty of examples that coul be used.
    Also i have a problem with the GPP distrubution too but thats a different story (too many engineers if you wonderspam leads to more engineers for more wonderspam)
    EDIT
    Prora The Kremlin and The statue of liberty have been limited to Autocracy Order and Freedom Respectively
     
  5. ahawk

    ahawk King

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    Pentagon and Great Firewall are two more that come to mind (from the other part of the tree you tend not to climb).
     
  6. VainoValkea

    VainoValkea Emperor

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    ahawk, I also remember the Hubble. Oh yeah, and there's Brandenburg Gate, Neuschwanstein and Kremlin, of course. I also forgot CN tower from the beeline list. But what on earth... there isn't a Space Elevator in Civ V? Glad I noticed that now!
     
  7. Yrrebnot

    Yrrebnot Chieftain

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    pretty much what i mean by late game.
    im not going to include industrial because thats fun but after atomic there is just a whole lot of military upgrades and not much else
     
  8. Rohili

    Rohili King

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    I agree. I tend to have too many Great Engineers and too few wonders to rush in the Atomic Age and beyond; they all end up making manufactories, which is a waste at that late stage in the game.

    Some wonder effects that could be useful would be:
    - Free copies of strategic resources like oil/aluminium/uranium
    - Reveal the entire map permanently (there used to be a wonder like that IIRC)
    - Reduce social policy cost
    - Reduce golden age cost (it takes forever to trigger a GA via happiness by this stage in the game)
    - Free airports in your cities (great for late-game cross-continental warfare; useful for those going for a domination victory)
     
  9. VainoValkea

    VainoValkea Emperor

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    Rohili, in some earlier Civs Apollo program revealed the entire map. In Civ V, researching satellites has the same effect. On its own, it would be a pretty tame wonder if it couldn't grant LOS as well... maybe a GPS wonder that also grants 1 tile visibility in each city?

    As for social policy cost, that's what Christo Redentor (and in a way, Sydney) already does. I think it's a bit tame, as in that point of the game, I typically have all or almost all policy tracks filled and wind up using the "spare" culture on something only marginally useful. Given the typical nature of late game, I think it's better to focus on wonders that reward the player with big pushes instead of small long-term gains.
     
  10. spfun

    spfun King

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    Modern to late information age only takes a very short time due to bulbing and full strength RA waves, i find i have many wonders to build at the end of the game. They probably made it this way, as most people get bored at the end so they want to speed that part up.
     
  11. Yrrebnot

    Yrrebnot Chieftain

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    I have never had this happen to me mind you i am playing pretty much exclusively on marathon or epic which leads to a slower tech and a lot more buildings getting built.

    Also i see no problems with that it then leaves you with a decision do i get wonder A or do i build another tank and let the Ai get it only so i can take the city later.

    also i am now suffering from a peculiar problem that when i wonderspam i produce 1 GS for every 6 GE so bulbing is almost impossible.
     
  12. Rohili

    Rohili King

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    Oh, I forgot about Satellites. But yeah, I agree that a wonder with that effect should grant LOS as well to be useful. For the human player, at least; I'm not sure whether the AI would know how to exploit that information beneficially.

    But with ideologies in BNW, you now have more things to spend culture on in the late game, so I think reduced SP costs would still come in handy.
     
  13. VainoValkea

    VainoValkea Emperor

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    But there are free tenets in the late game - two for early adoption, one for Sydney, one for ideology wonder. I've also noticed that I tend to pop policies the fastest in the very early and late game - if anything, I think renaissance era could use a policy accelerator.

    About the LOS, doesn't the computer need it for ranged attacks like the human?
     
  14. Dai

    Dai Warlord

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    A wonder that gave permanent vision everywhere would be interesting, but would potentially be a nightmare when playing with unit animations on. I guess the easiest way to fix that would be to simply only show unit animations in areas that your units and cities would be able to see without the wonder, which might look a little inconsistent, but would keep turns from taking forever.
     
  15. de_baser

    de_baser Warlord

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    You're not supposed to build wonders late game, you're doing one of these things:

    1 - Furiously clicking next turn waiting for the diplo victory vote
    2 - Beelining for internet, then clicking next turn till your cultural victory comes in
    3 - Churning out units or busy nuking enemy cities
    4 - Churning out GS's,yawning.
     
  16. Aleal

    Aleal Chieftain

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    If you play Prince or higher dificulty levels, my experience almost all civilization can be a back stabber if your army is weak.

    sorry mistakenly replied in a wrong page ... I should have commented in "Back stab boys"
     
  17. VainoValkea

    VainoValkea Emperor

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    de_baser, but wonders are extra points!

    Which reminds me, I got a Neuschwanstein to build.
     
  18. Yrrebnot

    Yrrebnot Chieftain

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    That is exactly the problem maybe we should have multiple ways to win that diplo victory (more wonders which give UN votes), or even tourism centric wonders (give a city 10 tourism), how about a wonder which gives all troops a free promotion (would seriously change the conquest game, perhaps a special forces training centre (west point maybe) which allow special forces to be trained a UU late game which is useful, and wonder dependant.
    these are ideas which would add another dimension to the current victory conditions and give builders something to do plus if the ai builds them you will have to counter them traditionally.
     
  19. TomKQT

    TomKQT Prince

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    No I'm not. Maybe we're playing a different game?
     

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