Tzintzuntzan would be a nice candidate.
Mochica would be an interesting civ to do. Maybe I can do it when I have some free time.
I did Olmec just for fun. As I said, most of the things there are speculative.
Latin American Civilizations and City-States
- Thread starter Xandinho
- Start date
Tzintzuntzan would be a nice candidate.
Mochica would be an interesting civ to do. Maybe I can do it when I have some free time.
I did Olmec just for fun. As I said, most of the things there are speculative.
Cuba
Leader: Fidel Castro
Start bias: close to a coast
UA: La Bayamesa - Coastal tiles gain +1 appeal. You have a free access to the Tobacco luxury resource. After Opera and Ballet, you unlock five unique city projects called "Dance Performance", each of which has unique bonuses and can be done in any city:
Danzón: culture when active and +3% permanent culture across the entire Cuban culture generation when complete.
Salsa: culture when active and +3% permanent tourism across the entire Cuban tourism generation when complete.
Bolero: culture when active and a tourism boost in neighboring civilizations or on the same continent as Cuba when complete.
Mambo: culture when active and +1 amenities in all Cuban cities for the next 15 turns when complete, plus a culture boost.
Cha-Cha-Cha: culture when active and a big boost in generating Great Musicians when complete, plus a culture boost.
However, you cannot do two dance performances in a row in the same city and you cannot do more than one dance performance of the same type at the same time.
Leader ability: Viva La Revolucion! - When you liberate a city or city-state, all your land units gain +7 combat strength for the next 10 turns. When at war, both your units and your allies gain +5 combat strength. After the modern era, Great Generals gain the ability of revolutionaries, in which they can be consumed and five units of Guerrilleros are generated automatically
Unique building: Cigar Factory
Replaces Factory
Available in Industrialization
+3 production to all City Centers within 6 tiles of the Factory's Industrial Zone.
+4 culture
+8 tourism
+1 citizen slot
+1 Great Engineer point per turn
Grants a source of the Cigar luxury resource that grants +6 amenities and can be sold to other civilizations from the second source onwards.
However, this building doesn't receive an extra bonus from energy.
Unique unit: Guerrillero - Not buildable and doesn't replace any standard units. And it's not unlocked by technology or civic either. However, from the Modern Era, when Cuba is the target of a declaration of war, you automatically get eight of these units for free on your territory, you get new ones of them for free if other civilizations declare war on you afterward. They have 70 combat strength, +4 extra combat strength fighting on Cuban territory, +4 extra combat strength during Dark Ages, +4 extra combat strength when fighting a unit from a civilization that follows another government instead of yours. There is no gold maintenance cost. Requires no resource.
Cuba is a cultural powerhouse, which benefits from its rich and influential musical and dance rhythms, as well as its beautiful beaches. The Cuban cigar here is not only an important element of its culture, but also of its economy. Fidel Castro and his Guerrilleros will not go easy on any imperialist foreign power that dares against them. However, Fidel can be a good ally.
Leader: Fidel Castro
Start bias: close to a coast
UA: La Bayamesa - Coastal tiles gain +1 appeal. You have a free access to the Tobacco luxury resource. After Opera and Ballet, you unlock five unique city projects called "Dance Performance", each of which has unique bonuses and can be done in any city:
Danzón: culture when active and +3% permanent culture across the entire Cuban culture generation when complete.
Salsa: culture when active and +3% permanent tourism across the entire Cuban tourism generation when complete.
Bolero: culture when active and a tourism boost in neighboring civilizations or on the same continent as Cuba when complete.
Mambo: culture when active and +1 amenities in all Cuban cities for the next 15 turns when complete, plus a culture boost.
Cha-Cha-Cha: culture when active and a big boost in generating Great Musicians when complete, plus a culture boost.
However, you cannot do two dance performances in a row in the same city and you cannot do more than one dance performance of the same type at the same time.
Leader ability: Viva La Revolucion! - When you liberate a city or city-state, all your land units gain +7 combat strength for the next 10 turns. When at war, both your units and your allies gain +5 combat strength. After the modern era, Great Generals gain the ability of revolutionaries, in which they can be consumed and five units of Guerrilleros are generated automatically
Unique building: Cigar Factory
Replaces Factory
Available in Industrialization
+3 production to all City Centers within 6 tiles of the Factory's Industrial Zone.
+4 culture
+8 tourism
+1 citizen slot
+1 Great Engineer point per turn
Grants a source of the Cigar luxury resource that grants +6 amenities and can be sold to other civilizations from the second source onwards.
However, this building doesn't receive an extra bonus from energy.
Unique unit: Guerrillero - Not buildable and doesn't replace any standard units. And it's not unlocked by technology or civic either. However, from the Modern Era, when Cuba is the target of a declaration of war, you automatically get eight of these units for free on your territory, you get new ones of them for free if other civilizations declare war on you afterward. They have 70 combat strength, +4 extra combat strength fighting on Cuban territory, +4 extra combat strength during Dark Ages, +4 extra combat strength when fighting a unit from a civilization that follows another government instead of yours. There is no gold maintenance cost. Requires no resource.
Cuba is a cultural powerhouse, which benefits from its rich and influential musical and dance rhythms, as well as its beautiful beaches. The Cuban cigar here is not only an important element of its culture, but also of its economy. Fidel Castro and his Guerrilleros will not go easy on any imperialist foreign power that dares against them. However, Fidel can be a good ally.
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Ryansinbela
King
Will the city states get replaced
I have plans to update the city-states.
Patine
Deity
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- 11,070
Fidel Castro died in the 21st Century. I believe that take him out of contention.
reddishrecue
Some dude on civfans
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Ditto, I did Pipil just for fun, nothing serious.
untitledjuan
Warlord
I've got some ideas for alternate leaders for a Gran Colombia/Colombia civilization
I would go for Antonio Nariño (currently a Comandante General in-game), Francisco de Miranda or even Francisco de Paula Santander (also a Comandante General). This could be the abilites for these leader options for Gran Colombia.
Antonio Nariño (vice-president of Gran Colombia and president of Cundinamarca) could be a more cultured centred leader, as he brought many ideas from the Enlightenment to the colonies, such as translating the Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen to Spanish (he was sent to jail by the Spanish for doing this). He also became rich from importing products from the Old World.
Leader ability name: "Patria Boba or United Provinces of New Granada": receives a culture points bonus towards civics that have already been discovered by other civilizations, you get some gold yields from cultural buildings. (during his political career some defended a Federal system, such as the one in the US and others a centralist system, such as the one in France, both were tested during the independence movement)
Leader agenda name: "The Precursor of Liberty": dislikes civilizations with fewer civics as himself, likes civilizations with more civics as himself (He was inspired by the heroes of the American Revolution, such as Benjamin Franklin)
Capital city: Bogotá or Villa de Leyva
Francisco de Miranda (briefly dictator of Venezuela) could be a more diplomatic centred leader, as he established contact with countries such as the UK, France and Russia to seek support for independence. He also fought in the American Revolution and in the French Revolution.
Leader ability name: "First Republic of Venezuela": receives more diplomatic favour points from each alliance he has with other civilizations and/or when fighting a war together with other civilizations
Leader agenda name: "The Precursor of Independence": dislikes civilizations who have conquered other nations capitals, likes civilizations which have conquered none or less capitals from other civilizations.
Capital city: Caracas
Francisco de Paula Santander (vice-president and acting-president of Gran Colombia when Bolívar was off fighting elsewhere) could be more centred on culture, as he favoured the rule of law and constitutional rule of the country, as opposed to Bolívar's almost dictatorial rule. He drafted much of the early laws and constitutions of Colombia and founded various cultural institutions, such as public schools, the National University of Colombia, the National Museum of Colombia (the first national museum in both North and South America) and much more.
Leader ability name: "Constitution of 1821": cultural buildings from conquered and/or recaptured ("liberated") cities receive no damage. Military buildings produce some culture and/or can produce cultural buildings faster. (Considered the first constitution of Colombia/Gran Colombia, laid the legal framework for future constitutions and for the rebuilding of the country after the war of independence)
Leader agenda name: "El Hombre de las Leyes or The Man of the Law": dislikes civilizations with low diplomatic favour points production, likes civilizations that produce a lot of diplomatic favour points
Capital city: Bogotá or Cúcuta
I would go for Antonio Nariño (currently a Comandante General in-game), Francisco de Miranda or even Francisco de Paula Santander (also a Comandante General). This could be the abilites for these leader options for Gran Colombia.
Antonio Nariño (vice-president of Gran Colombia and president of Cundinamarca) could be a more cultured centred leader, as he brought many ideas from the Enlightenment to the colonies, such as translating the Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen to Spanish (he was sent to jail by the Spanish for doing this). He also became rich from importing products from the Old World.
Leader ability name: "Patria Boba or United Provinces of New Granada": receives a culture points bonus towards civics that have already been discovered by other civilizations, you get some gold yields from cultural buildings. (during his political career some defended a Federal system, such as the one in the US and others a centralist system, such as the one in France, both were tested during the independence movement)
Leader agenda name: "The Precursor of Liberty": dislikes civilizations with fewer civics as himself, likes civilizations with more civics as himself (He was inspired by the heroes of the American Revolution, such as Benjamin Franklin)
Capital city: Bogotá or Villa de Leyva
Francisco de Miranda (briefly dictator of Venezuela) could be a more diplomatic centred leader, as he established contact with countries such as the UK, France and Russia to seek support for independence. He also fought in the American Revolution and in the French Revolution.
Leader ability name: "First Republic of Venezuela": receives more diplomatic favour points from each alliance he has with other civilizations and/or when fighting a war together with other civilizations
Leader agenda name: "The Precursor of Independence": dislikes civilizations who have conquered other nations capitals, likes civilizations which have conquered none or less capitals from other civilizations.
Capital city: Caracas
Francisco de Paula Santander (vice-president and acting-president of Gran Colombia when Bolívar was off fighting elsewhere) could be more centred on culture, as he favoured the rule of law and constitutional rule of the country, as opposed to Bolívar's almost dictatorial rule. He drafted much of the early laws and constitutions of Colombia and founded various cultural institutions, such as public schools, the National University of Colombia, the National Museum of Colombia (the first national museum in both North and South America) and much more.
Leader ability name: "Constitution of 1821": cultural buildings from conquered and/or recaptured ("liberated") cities receive no damage. Military buildings produce some culture and/or can produce cultural buildings faster. (Considered the first constitution of Colombia/Gran Colombia, laid the legal framework for future constitutions and for the rebuilding of the country after the war of independence)
Leader agenda name: "El Hombre de las Leyes or The Man of the Law": dislikes civilizations with low diplomatic favour points production, likes civilizations that produce a lot of diplomatic favour points
Capital city: Bogotá or Cúcuta
Henri Christophe
L'empereur
I never heard about Antonio Nariño... But I think Santander could be a god choice to lead Gran Colombia.
Patine
Deity
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- 11,070
Gran Colombia should NOT come back! A very short-lived, Colonially-derived nation that blocks up a geographical slot better filled by an infinitely more intriguing civ like the Muisca reprising the mistake of its appearance and taking up a development and game slot is tantamount to ridiculous as I see it, let alone getting three alternate leaders.
Henri Christophe
L'empereur
I need to disagree with you! Colômbia still a country today so it isn't short lived, what was short lived was what we call today Gran Colombia who also helds territory even in Bolivia under the dictatorship of Simon Bolivar. Speaking about Simon Bolivar, he conquer more territory then Napoleon and was the most influencial Libertador who defeated the might of Spanish Empire.Gran Colombia should NOT come back! A very short-lived, Colonially-derived nation that blocks up a geographical slot better filled by an infinitely more intriguing civ like the Muisca reprising the mistake of its appearance and taking up a development and game slot is tantamount to ridiculous as I see it, let alone getting three alternate leaders.
But I don't mind if civ7 have Muisca instead. But Gran-Colombia was a very good choice and I was very exicited when see this release. I just think the name should be just Colombia, because this "Gran" is just used a posteriori by historians.
untitledjuan
Warlord
I wasn't suggesting to have three alternate leaders for it, just possible options for a single alternate leader. This considering that the developers stated that there could be an alternate leader for every civilization, as was mentioned in other threads.Gran Colombia should NOT come back! A very short-lived, Colonially-derived nation that blocks up a geographical slot better filled by an infinitely more intriguing civ like the Muisca reprising the mistake of its appearance and taking up a development and game slot is tantamount to ridiculous as I see it, let alone getting three alternate leaders.
On the other hand, Gran Colombia's real name was just the Republic of Colombia and the Republic of Colombia still exists as a country and still follows some laws made during that time period. Gran Colombia is just the name of a historical period in which Colombia was larger and got independence. Its like calling a USA led by Washington "Revolutionary America", or "Byzantium" what would actually be the Roman Empire.
Also, many people from Venezuela, Ecuador and Panamá, perhaps even from Perú and Bolivia (which already have the Inca), might feel identified as well with the inclusion of this Hispanic American civilization.
Also, the appearance of Canada didn't block the appearance of the Cree, nor did the appearance of the USA block the Iroquois from appearing in previous games. So the Muisca, which are a very interesting civilization, could still appear and I hope they appear sometime in the future.
I find the inclusion of Gran Colombia interesting. It's perhaps the best representative of Spanish Latin America, especially considering how influential Simon Bolivar was. Also, we can't confuse culture/civilization with nation-state. As I said in another thread, Gran Colombia kind of exists until today through its successor states, and even for a short-lived political entity, it has a notorious historical importance to be in the game. That said, I wouldn't mind if GC was replaced by Muisca. Argentina or Mexico could take GC slot as Spanish Latin country.
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Henri Christophe
L'empereur
I still think Gran Colombia is better then theses countries because of it's leader Simon Bolivar who was very well known.
Argentina have a lack of great leaders to be it's civ leader, the most propably leader should be Evita Perón, but she never lead the country.
The leaders of the revolution as San Martin also never held status of Argentine leader. The best president of Argentina we can count in is Bartolomeu Mitré, who wons Argentine civil war and also the international war with Paraguay. But Bartolomeu Mitré is just more one White Criollo of South America, nothing very hot.
And about Mexico, it's leader is very easy to choice, it should be Benito Juaréz. But it's capital city share the same location with the Aztecs. I know the same happens between Byzantium and Turks and isn't a great deal for Fireaxis.
untitledjuan
Warlord
We could have a similar situation as the one with Norway, Denmark and Sweden in Civilization 5 and 6. Sweden is in both and Denmark and Norway rotated, Denmark in Civ5 and Norway in Civ6.
This can be the case for South America. Brazil and Inca in all games, in Civ6 Colombia and the Mapuche and we can switch for Civ7 to have the Muisca in the place of Colombia and Argentine in the place of the Mapuche.
However, I would prefer to have all four of them: Colombia, Argentina, the Muisca and the Mapuche, perhaps even the Tupi, along with the Inca and Brazil.
Maybe that's too much to ask for, but it would be great to have them all at the same time
Patine
Deity
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There are a little over 200 sovereign nations in the world today (give or take by conflicting international recognition and de facto vs. internationally recognized de jure status on), and still a lot of beloved civ's that recur that no longer exist as formal nations. Plus, after Bolivar's death, Colombia's impact on world history drops drastically, comparatively.
So did Il-Arslan of the Khwarezmian Empire, but most people just remember that empire for being one of the first to be stomped by Genghis Khan under Il-Arslan's grandson. Raw territory conquered isn't really as much as you make it to be, in and of itself.
This somewhat ties into my belief of moving beyond the ideal of civ's that are strictly based on having been a Colonial construct by another civ, but to add a, "Revolution," "Commonwealth," and/or, "Independence War of a conquered civ," for civ's who to immense size and power across multiple continents quickly through founding new cities, conquering civ's, establishing vassal states, controlling trade lines, etc, regardless of who that civ(s) is.
As for, "Byzantium," and the Roman Empire, I've addressed this many times, and how this is not the same thing at all, and the Byzantine Empire was, socially, politically, economically, militarily, and religiously - and mostly linguistically - completely different, connected only by a pretense and claim of direct succession (one rivaled, in fact, by the Vatican and the Holy Roman Emperor), and I've explained and defended by viewpoint there extensively on several threads recently, which you may peruse, if you like, and I stand by all of it.
I often find it odd that, when Argentinian leaders are proposed and bandied about on these forums, there's always an, "elephant in the room," - Juan Peron. You know, Evita's husband. For some reason, discussing Argentinian leaders seem to want to avoid touching him like the plague. Which is odd, and even counter-intuitive and inexplicable, because Argentinians, themselves, tend to regard him as one of their greatest and most defining leaders...
After three former British colonies in a row, a former Spanish colony was needed, and they chose GC possibly because Simon Bolivar was in high demand here. I wouldn't mind if they had chosen Argentina or Mexico, both would be interesting. Anyway, Latin America is very diverse and culturally rich, I think a Spanish colonial representative was a slot to be filled.
I think when people think of Peronism, Evita comes to mind before Juan. Obviously she was very charismatic, and I'm not surprised people thought of her more than him.
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Henri Christophe
L'empereur
As Xandinho said, it has 3 former British Colonies... so this game need a former Spanish colonie to be balanced. And I would say more, not just Argentina or México can replace Colombia. But also Paraguay or Cuba should be nice.
The impact of Khwarezmian Empire was be conquered by Gengis Khan, that's the why it is so not-well knowed. Bolivar's impact still today, still a free America pride of it's history.
If we just look the last 100 years of West Rome (around years 300) after the convertion to cristianity. There is no difference between Rome and Byzantium.
Juan Peron also can be a good leader, I will would like if Brazil come together with Getúlio Vargas, both are very similar (both are populist) and should be nice to play with they together.
millansoft
Warlord
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- 138
The leaders for Argentina (althought I dont like them) should be Juan Manuel de Rosas, XIX century, and later Juan Domingo Peron, they clearly ruled Argentina for several years, Bartolome Mitre is far away from the ideal choice. I´m from Argentina, by the way.
One could just as easily (or indeed more easily) argue there is no difference between Spain and Gran Colombia.
BuchiTaton
Emperor
- Joined
- Jul 8, 2019
- Messages
- 1,131
I am of the idea that Colombia+Mapuche should be exchanged for Argentina+Muisca in CIV7, but talking like this about in game Colombia is exaggerated.Gran Colombia should NOT come back! A very short-lived, Colonially-derived nation that blocks up a geographical slot better filled by an infinitely more intriguing civ like the Muisca reprising the mistake of its appearance and taking up a development and game slot is tantamount to ridiculous as I see it, let alone getting three alternate leaders.
1- Its official name was at the moment as its now Républica de Colombia, it is not a short lived country.
2- Colombia in CIV6 is not a "mistake", it is the best representative of the dream of an united Hispanoamerica and it take tha role in game.
3- The couple of Cree+Canada show that be on the same country (both), similar to other culture (Canada) or low relevance (Cree) are not impediment to be on game.
Maybe Colombia would not be a new regular like Brazil, but it definetely could come back in CIV8 or CIV9 as Canada or Australia would certainly come back.
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