[LP] Leader Pass: Great Builders - 3/14 Developer Livestream Discussion w/ Potato McWhiskey

[blackbutterfly]

Basil is best at domination. Get Crusade. Kill units around their Holy City. Get +3 CS from his leader ability. Kill units around any other city, it flips to your religion, and now you have +10 CS. It's a total domino effect. You don't even really need holy sites with him.

Boes did a no holy site religious victory challenge as Basil:

 

[SemiLazyGamer]

She's going to be great at Sci Vic as well. Getting large yields of production, faith and culture from a single district (which is available very early) will allow a city to function as though it were 3 pop greater at least.

Seriously, a +8 HS for her would be like having a +2 TS without needing to build a wonder, with an amphitheater and 2 GWoW (before printing). Massively powerful.

You forgot the Hildegard for Science.

If you can get her.

 

[fy00sh]

was watching the stream while at work, i feel like theodora is pleasantly fun-sounding for getting some interesting synergies on district placements. ludwig also looks very fun, will be fun to plan out map tacks for cities with slapping down as many wonders as possible in mind. also theres a super interesting risk-reward to ludwigs ability that idk if they mentioned on stream, where the adjacencies make it so that you wanna put wonders in the middle of a bunch of districts, which is also a good place for other districts. so maybe youll wanna slap down a wonder you dont intend to finish next to like 4 districts, with the rationale that once someone else yoinks it you can put a district down to replace it... but then you're relying on them actually yoinking it, and if they dont then you might have a great wonder spot blocking an even greater spot for another district
as for sejong, his ability definitely feels way more active and intentional than seondok's, which makes it the better in my mind, but its still not great. but also i love the puzzle of how to optimize seowon yields so anything that makes the rest of korea even more fun is very welcome
also heres hoping they up the asset limit! i never finished the stream, im guessing they didnt say anything about any patches/updates/bug fixes/anything else they might also do an asset limit tweak alongside? they still might do it anyways but my gut says itll be with the last three leaders or never, unless maybe if they said like "and you can look forward to some new improvements alongside these new leaders"

 

[SammyKhalifa]

was watching the stream while at work, i feel like theodora is pleasantly fun-sounding for getting some interesting synergies on district placements. ludwig also looks very fun, will be fun to plan out map tacks for cities with slapping down as many wonders as possible in mind. also theres a super interesting risk-reward to ludwigs ability that idk if they mentioned on stream, where the adjacencies make it so that you wanna put wonders in the middle of a bunch of districts, which is also a good place for other districts. so maybe youll wanna slap down a wonder you dont intend to finish next to like 4 districts, with the rationale that once someone else yoinks it you can put a district down to replace it... but then you're relying on them actually yoinking it, and if they dont then you might have a great wonder spot blocking an even greater spot for another district
as for sejong, his ability definitely feels way more active and intentional than seondok's, which makes it the better in my mind, but its still not great. but also i love the puzzle of how to optimize seowon yields so anything that makes the rest of korea even more fun is very welcome
also heres hoping they up the asset limit! i never finished the stream, im guessing they didnt say anything about any patches/updates/bug fixes/anything else they might also do an asset limit tweak alongside? they still might do it anyways but my gut says itll be with the last three leaders or never, unless maybe if they said like "and you can look forward to some new improvements alongside these new leaders"

I bet there's a patch at the end.

 

[Andrew Johnson [FXS]]

- The short historical introductions (Is that Andrew narrating?) are a good addition. It's great they listened to our suggestions in that regard;

Yep, that's my voice and my text there.

And also, yes on the Friedrich II re: gay leaders. Alexander is so far back in history that our concepts of sexuality have changed, so the term is complicated, but undoubtedly Alexander enjoyed the company of men. Rumors surrounded Kristina, and even Julius Caesar. But, yes, from Civ6, Ludwig (and likely Kristina) is unquestionably gay in our modern understanding.

 

[SammyKhalifa]

Yep, that's my voice and my text there.

And also, yes on the Friedrich II re: gay leaders. Alexander is so far back in history that our concepts of sexuality have changed, so the term is complicated, but undoubtedly Alexander enjoyed the company of men. Rumors surrounded Kristina, and even Julius Caesar. But, yes, from Civ6, Ludwig (and likely Kristina) is unquestionably gay in our modern understanding.

The leader videos in this latest stream were really refreshing, thanks.

 

[QueenGloriana]

Byzantium got hit with the nerf stick (in the form of a new leader).

The other leader (whose name slips my mind - the bloke) is super OP.
Religious victory is like a no-brainer with him.

Is a nerf from S+ to S- tier really a nerf though? There is no way they could do anything as synergistic as Basil, but Theodora is still strong

 

[rocksinmypath]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm surprised no one has yet pointed out the potential synergy between Ludwig and Nan Madol. City centre, harbour, theatre square + a couple coastal wonders, and you're easily generating 15 culture/tourism per turn from one city by the medieval era.

Edit: Actually, you could reasonably be generating ~30 tourism per turn. Create a triangle of city centre, harbour and theatre square. Put Mausoleum and Kilwa next to the theatre square. Use Aesthetics policy card:
- +6 culture/tourism from Nan Madol
- +5 culture/tourism from normal theatre square adjacency
- +7 culture/tourism from Aesthetics (including Nan Madol bonus)
- +4 culture/tourism from Mausoleum being next to the harbour and theatre square
- +2 culture/tourism from Kilwa being next to the theatre square
- +3 base tourism from Mausoleum
- +2 base tourism from Kilwa
- Total: 24 culture and 29 tourism per turn

Even without wonders, you're getting 10 culture/tourism from the district triangle + Aesthetics combo alone. Use production from Hansas in your inland cities to pump out settlers to send them out to the coast and you can probably reach 100 tourism by turn 100?

 

[kryat]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm surprised no one has yet pointed out the potential synergy between Ludwig and Nan Madol. City centre, harbour, theatre square + a couple coastal wonders, and you're easily generating 15 culture/tourism per turn from one city by the medieval era.

Edit: Actually, you could reasonably be generating ~30 tourism per turn. Create a triangle of city centre, harbour and theatre square. Put Mausoleum and Kilwa next to the theatre square. Use Aesthetics policy card:
- +6 culture/tourism from Nan Madol
- +5 culture/tourism from normal theatre square adjacency
- +7 culture/tourism from Aesthetics (including Nan Madol bonus)
- +4 culture/tourism from Mausoleum being next to the harbour and theatre square
- +2 culture/tourism from Kilwa being next to the theatre square
- +3 base tourism from Mausoleum
- +2 base tourism from Kilwa
- Total: 24 culture and 29 tourism per turn

Even without wonders, you're getting 10 culture/tourism from the district triangle + Aesthetics combo alone. Use production from Hansas in your inland cities to pump out settlers to send them out to the coast and you can probably reach 100 tourism by turn 100?

Unless I’m mistaken, it only counts culture coming from adjacencies, not culture from other sources like Nan Madol.

 

[DogeEnricoDandolo]

Unless I’m mistaken, it only counts culture coming from adjacencies, not culture from other sources like Nan Madol.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm surprised no one has yet pointed out the potential synergy between Ludwig and Nan Madol. City centre, harbour, theatre square + a couple coastal wonders, and you're easily generating 15 culture/tourism per turn from one city by the medieval era.

Edit: Actually, you could reasonably be generating ~30 tourism per turn. Create a triangle of city centre, harbour and theatre square. Put Mausoleum and Kilwa next to the theatre square. Use Aesthetics policy card:
- +6 culture/tourism from Nan Madol
- +5 culture/tourism from normal theatre square adjacency
- +7 culture/tourism from Aesthetics (including Nan Madol bonus)
- +4 culture/tourism from Mausoleum being next to the harbour and theatre square
- +2 culture/tourism from Kilwa being next to the theatre square
- +3 base tourism from Mausoleum
- +2 base tourism from Kilwa
- Total: 24 culture and 29 tourism per turn

Even without wonders, you're getting 10 culture/tourism from the district triangle + Aesthetics combo alone. Use production from Hansas in your inland cities to pump out settlers to send them out to the coast and you can probably reach 100 tourism by turn 100?

Just check, doesn't work. The bonus from Nan Madol is not an adjacency bonus, it is an intrinsic, non-modifiable culture bonus

 

[Shaka Zulu]

What is release time?

 

[Noble Zarkon]

What is release time?

Normally 1300 East Coast time, as they are now on Daylight Savings that would be 1700 GMT/1800 CET this time.

 

[Shaka Zulu]

Normally 1300 East Coast time, as they are now on Daylight Savings that would be 1700 GMT/1800 CET this time.

Means in 4 hours? Thx

 

[Laurana Kanan]

What is release time?

In the livestream chat they stated 10:15AM PT / 1:15PM ET. Don't know why it's not "on the hour".

 

[Jkchart]

Also,Sejong Redesign:
Seowons get +1 Culture per adjacent district. Buildings inside the Seowon get +1 Great Work Slot,+2 Great Writer Points

This would be neat, but the Seowon would have to be redesigned entirely to not lose science from adjacent distrcts (or would we be converting it? Which would actually be interesting to lose the science in exchange for culture, but still be a science district...)

 

[Noble Zarkon]

In the livestream chat they stated 10:15AM PT / 1:15PM ET. Don't know why it's not "on the hour".

Ok so that is

10:15AM PT / 1:15PM ET / 5:15PM GMT / 6:15PM CET

 

[Jkchart]

Ok Ludwig is really fun, I love him

 

[Pitohui]

This would be neat, but the Seowon would have to be redesigned entirely to not lose science from adjacent distrcts (or would we be converting it? Which would actually be interesting to lose the science in exchange for culture, but still be a science district...)

The Seowon wouldn't be changed,so yeah it would be a Science->Culture Conversion