[LP] Leader Pass Pack 2: Great Commanders Sneak Peak (Confirmed; Release Dec. 15)

Status
Not open for further replies.
I think the civ show civgiv confirmed the new ottomans leaked ability. What were all the leaked abilities, again? I believe they're essentially confirmed, if potentially nonfinal
 
tokugawa2.png


It's the same. The reason it looked different to me was because they made his eyes darker for the announcement picture (see below). So I added two white dots (above) and suddenly there's no difference.

1670803411201.png


Funny how such a tiny detail makes his eyes look narrower.
 
DogeEnricoDandolo said:
As Persia, you already want to send domestic trade routes, and this ability basically adds more yields to it => More passive yields for something you would like to do anyway. I think I have been quite vocal about how much I hate that, such a lazy and uninspiring design.
Click to expand...
You call it lazy and uninspiring whereas I see it as good synergy and integrated design! I hate these sprawling civs whose design is all over the place. To each their own I guess.
 
It's not synergy. Synergy is when the contributions of multiple systems come together to produce a result greater than the sum of their contributions if they were separate. Byzantium is a great example of synergy:

- Getting free cavalry (that, indirectly, are given to you by having more cities) is good.

- Getting an ability that allows cavalry to actively attack walls is also good.

- Getting higher attack bonuses for cavalry (indirectly) based on how many cities you've conquered is also good.

- Gettng a unique unit that has bonuses based on how many other units are near

Those together doesn't get you a civ that's merely good, but excellent because they magnify each other, they individually work better for the presence of the other abilities.

Nader Shah's ability doesn't do that. It just stacks on top and contributes. Basil/Byzantines' abilities multiply, Nader Shah's merely adds. You could add him to any other civ (that don't have aversions to trade routes) and his contribution would be the same.

I think the word you (and others) looking for is simple. He's not a civ that you have to plan much. You go to war? It's made a bit easier by having additional CS if they're not damaged. You get a nice boost to your TRs, whether you're at war or not. No planning around your abilities really, just play. The flip side is that it's boring and uninspired, just like the Romans. You're opinion that you like the simplicity is valid, I'm just not a fan. I'm more bothered by Caesar in this regard, though - they could have had a complex and interesting Rome alongside Trajan's "beginner's" Rome, but instead we have another beginner's Rome. Meh.
 
The new Persian design may not be synergy in the sense of 2+2+5, but at least the benefits are accrued in the same way. It's kind of like doing all your shopping in one place instead of having to run several errands. I personally find it more appealing than the new Ottoman persona, but not as appealing as new Japanese leader.

The new Japanese leader actually meets the 2+2=5 standard with half-cost specialty districts and trade route yields that are boosted by district count. I will also aim for more dark ages so I can get the internal trade route card.
 
The Shah/Persia design is equivalent to something like:

Aztec Ability: Can spend Builder charges to complete 20% of a district's Production cost.
Montezuma Ability: Can spend Builder charges to complete 15% of a district's Production cost in cities not founded by the Aztecs.

It should instead be more like Spain's:
Trade Routes receive +3 Gold, +2 Faith and +1 Production. Trade Routes between multiple continents receive triple these numbers.

Where the more powerful aspect of an ability requires a further step to unlock.

So Persia's would be:
Domestic Trade Routes provide +2 Gold and +1 Culture or triple these numbers in cities not founded by Persia.
(that's hardly OP)

Leaving Nader Shah to have some other ability that synergizes with Persia. E.g.:
Nader Shah Ability: Foreign Cities with a Persia Trading Post provide additional CS and Health Regen to adjacent Persian units. Requires a single adjacent Persian unit to place city under siege.

Strategy: Send Trade Routes to an empire until Trading Posts are established, then declare war. The alternative is for the enemy to declare war first, thus saving you on grievances.

Something like that...

Edit: Gain a Trader for each city conquered. (He'd probably need that too).
 
Last edited:
AntSou said:
The Shah/Persia design is equivalent to something like:

Aztec Ability: Can spend Builder charges to complete 20% of a district's Production cost.
Montezuma Ability: Can spend Builder charges to complete 15% of a district's Production cost in cities not founded by the Aztecs.

It should instead be more like Spain's:
Trade Routes receive +3 Gold, +2 Faith and +1 Production. Trade Routes between multiple continents receive triple these numbers.

Where the more powerful aspect of an ability requires a further step to unlock.

So Persia's would be:
Domestic Trade Routes provide +2 Gold and +1 Culture or triple these numbers in cities not founded by Persia.
(that's hardly OP)

Leaving Nader Shah to have some other ability that synergizes with Persia. E.g.:
Nader Shah Ability: Foreign Cities with a Persia Trading Post provide additional CS and Health Regen to adjacent Persian units. Requires a single adjacent Persian unit to place city under siege.

Strategy: Send Trade Routes to an empire until Trading Posts are established, then declare war. The alternative is for the enemy to declare war first, thus saving you on grievances.

Something like that...
Click to expand...
It’s perplexing to me that anyone sees Nader Shah’s ability as elegant or synergistic, rather than treading the same ground as the Civ ability.

Your theoretical Aztec example is a perfect analogy to illustrate why the ability is disappointing.
 
Kupe Navigator said:
If it's true then there is no reason whatsoever to think that Nader and Tokugawa's ability would be different! THIS IS EXCITING!
Click to expand...

Eh - they changed two of the four LUAs from the first batch (Casear and Nzinga) between initial creation and release based on the marketing discrepancies, so I'm still taking the wait and see approach.

Having said that - it was marketing text that was wrong, and the screenshots that were right, and it was screenshots we got in the leak, so there's chance the marketing text was from some early draft that was never even implemented.
 
Does anyone know what they renamed the original Suleiman persona to?
 
Linklite said:
It's not synergy. Synergy is when the contributions of multiple systems come together to produce a result greater than the sum of their contributions if they were separate. Byzantium is a great example of synergy:

- Getting free cavalry (that, indirectly, are given to you by having more cities) is good.

- Getting an ability that allows cavalry to actively attack walls is also good.

- Getting higher attack bonuses for cavalry (indirectly) based on how many cities you've conquered is also good.

- Gettng a unique unit that has bonuses based on how many other units are near

Those together doesn't get you a civ that's merely good, but excellent because they magnify each other, they individually work better for the presence of the other abilities.

Nader Shah's ability doesn't do that. It just stacks on top and contributes. Basil/Byzantines' abilities multiply, Nader Shah's merely adds. You could add him to any other civ (that don't have aversions to trade routes) and his contribution would be the same.

I think the word you (and others) looking for is simple. He's not a civ that you have to plan much. You go to war? It's made a bit easier by having additional CS if they're not damaged. You get a nice boost to your TRs, whether you're at war or not. No planning around your abilities really, just play. The flip side is that it's boring and uninspired, just like the Romans. You're opinion that you like the simplicity is valid, I'm just not a fan. I'm more bothered by Caesar in this regard, though - they could have had a complex and interesting Rome alongside Trajan's "beginner's" Rome, but instead we have another beginner's Rome. Meh.
Click to expand...
I don't know. The ability makes you want to turtle, which is traditionally easier if your cities are close together, which Japan wants because of the better district bonuses which are further helped by the TR bonus. Maybe not multiplicative "synergy" but they complement a common play style.

Still, I do mainly like that we don't just have more abilities stacked on top of other abilities making a civ power that's six paragraphs long.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Laurana Kanan
[LP] Leader Pass Pack 2: Great Commanders (Dec. 2022) - Patch Notes Discussion
5 6 7
Replies
134
Views
15K
Horizons
Horizons
Laurana Kanan
[LP] Civilization VI Official Leader Cards
2
Replies
28
Views
5K
Laurana Kanan
Laurana Kanan
Laurana Kanan
  • Sticky
Civilization VI - Version History
4 5 6
Replies
110
Views
33K
Markus5
Markus5
Top Bottom