Leonardo's Workshop (The TECH Thread)

Ok Smokey, I will be very clear, as all these suggestions are based on one strategy, and surely a shift from the over-emphasis on cottages and slaving.

1. We let our cities grow to their full capacity of health/happiness where the land is developed, about to be developed. We got Wine, Gold and Furs, as it stands.

2. We make Pavlodar an industrial city, as we may need to send units along the NE shore for settling there, we may need a bigger industrial base
This means Pavlodar will be farmed and mined, not cottage spammed, a difference from what some people here are saying.

3. We change our civics first from Slavery to Hereditary Rule and Caste System (a bit later, after we have gotten Metal Casting, enabling Engineers).

4. We allow Aktau to grow to full happiness size, and then utilize food surplus under Caste System to produce city engineers (also enabling more great engineers later, needed for wonders)

5. Pavlodar produces military units we need, and Hazrate settlers, until Oskomen and Aktau have become independend industrial bases.

6. We settle the copper city and make this our external military defense city, with barracks, walls, and as many hammers as possible

7. Food surplus in Hazrate may be used for great scientists.

8. We try to get ourselves sailing, enabling us to trade gold for other resources, as well as shipping up a few advance forts on the NE coast (coastal hills, and fortify these), we also need Moai Statues for iron city.

9. We make Copper and Iron cities, as well as Pavlodar industrial cities, not commercial ones. We need a far NE industrial city, and Pavlodar is the best choice, as maritime scouting will not reveal the wonder citys location.

10. We should now make some archers as well (get archery) and produce archers in Oskomen, and the more mobile chariots/Horsemen in Pavlodar, until we get enough industrial base.
 
Ok Smokey, I will be very clear, as all these suggestions are based on one strategy, and surely a shift from the over-emphasis on cottages and slaving.

1. We let our cities grow to their full capacity of health/happiness where the land is developed, about to be developed. We got Wine, Gold and Furs, as it stands.

2. We make Pavlodar an industrial city, as we may need to send units along the NE shore for settling there, we may need a bigger industrial base
This means Pavlodar will be farmed and mined, not cottage spammed, a difference from what some people here are saying.

3. We change our civics first from Slavery to Hereditary Rule and Caste System (a bit later, after we have gotten Metal Casting, enabling Engineers).

4. We allow Aktau to grow to full happiness size, and then utilize food surplus under Caste System to produce city engineers (also enabling more great engineers later, needed for wonders)

5. Pavlodar produces military units we need, and Hazrate settlers, until Oskomen and Aktau have become independend industrial bases.

6. We settle the copper city and make this our external military defense city, with barracks, walls, and as many hammers as possible

7. Food surplus in Hazrate may be used for great scientists.

8. We try to get ourselves sailing, enabling us to trade gold for other resources, as well as shipping up a few advance forts on the NE coast (coastal hills, and fortify these), we also need Moai Statues for iron city.

9. We make Copper and Iron cities, as well as Pavlodar industrial cities, not commercial ones. We need a far NE industrial city, and Pavlodar is the best choice, as maritime scouting will not reveal the wonder citys location.

10. We should now make some archers as well (get archery) and produce archers in Oskomen, and the more mobile chariots/Horsemen in Pavlodar, until we get enough industrial base.

1. Not all cities need to grow to full capacity. Actau needs to be slaved

2. Pavlodar can be mined (we already have a farm) but the cottage belongs to the capital, we can farm the other tiles. This city needs to grow as slaving pottential not that great.

3. We need slavery to whip actau and buildings/units in new cities. caste is completely wrong at this stage.

4. You are jumping ahead of time considerably

5. In general that is the plan

6. We surelly need to expand further than copper city and get that land in the middle

7. No. we got 1 scientist for academy, now capital needs to grow to work all cottages and mines to produce workers/settlers until great library.

8. maoi of course, missed the point about forts

9. iron is coastal..not sure what you mean...copper can be unit production center possible heroic epic there.
 
Caste Systems allows unlimited merchants, artists and scientists- not engineers. And I would continue to run 2 scientists in Hazrat as much as we can to bulb Philosophy.
 
Caste Systems allows unlimited merchants, artists and scientists- not engineers. And I would continue to run 2 scientists in Hazrat as much as we can to bulb Philosophy.

I agree with the running of scientist in Haz in order to bulb Philo. We should do this at least until we have the GL.

As to Caste System - as soon as Aktua is able to run great people I think we should switch over. We will want to run merchants there and not having to build a market 1st will be a benefit.
 
Hmm, we're really bad at keeping threads on topic aren't we :rolleyes:

Provolution and Smokey said:
1. We let our cities grow to their full capacity of health/happiness where the land is developed, about to be developed. We got Wine, Gold and Furs, as it stands.
1. Not all cities need to grow to full capacity. Actau needs to be slaved
1. There's no point in growing to full capacity if that means we end up working unimproved tiles, far better to whip. Aktau is ideally suited for whipping with 3 food resources and only one good production tile.

2. We make Pavlodar an industrial city, as we may need to send units along the NE shore for settling there, we may need a bigger industrial base
This means Pavlodar will be farmed and mined, not cottage spammed, a difference from what some people here are saying.
2. Pavlodar can be mined (we already have a farm) but the cottage belongs to the capital, we can farm the other tiles. This city needs to grow as slaving pottential not that great.
I don't see why we need to be settling along the NE shore at all, there is plenty of prime land to settle along the Sar Darya valley. Once we have maybe 10 cities we can think about settling elsewhere.

I think it's only Cav Scout now who wants to cottage Pavlodar, most people seem in favour of farms and mines. Btw we might want to whip the worker to finish it off a bit quicker and then I wouldn't whip any more there.

3. We change our civics first from Slavery to Hereditary Rule and Caste System (a bit later, after we have gotten Metal Casting, enabling Engineers).
3. We need slavery to whip actau and buildings/units in new cities. caste is completely wrong at this stage.
Caste System is definitely premature at this stage when we have a lot of use to be made from slaving still. I would wait to switch to Monarchy once we can also switch to OR.

4. We allow Aktau to grow to full happiness size, and then utilize food surplus under Caste System to produce city engineers (also enabling more great engineers later, needed for wonders)
4. You are jumping ahead of time considerably
Caste System lets you run unlimited Scientists, Artists and Merchants. We don't need Artists and can run Scientists through libraries, so only point would be to run Merchants.

5. Pavlodar produces military units we need, and Hazrate settlers, until Oskomen and Aktau have become independend industrial bases.
5. In general that is the plan
After Pavlodar has done this worker I think we should not build any workers/settlers there and not whip any more. It can use the grassy knoll soon and we'll soon be able to chop those forest with the 50% bonus from Maths. When should we think of building a wonder there?

6. We settle the copper city and make this our external military defense city, with barracks, walls, and as many hammers as possible
6. We surelly need to expand further than copper city and get that land in the middle
I agree with Smokey, if copper city is our 'front line' then we are really in trouble! We can use it to produce military units for sure, that's fine, but we want to push further than that for sure!

7. Food surplus in Hazrate may be used for great scientists.
7. No. we got 1 scientist for academy, now capital needs to grow to work all cottages and mines to produce workers/settlers until great library.
Priority should be to let Haz grow (maybe produce a temple there too?) as this will give us maximum benefit when we later run Bureaucracy and (much later) Oxford Uni. Hazrat-e on it's own will keep our tech rate monstrous!

8. We try to get ourselves sailing, enabling us to trade gold for other resources, as well as shipping up a few advance forts on the NE coast (coastal hills, and fortify these), we also need Moai Statues for iron city.
8. maoi of course, missed the point about forts
Glad you've ditched the idea of Maoi for the fish city next to Haz :). As I said earlier, settling along the NE coast?? We've got no reason to. We don't even know what the land is like inland there and there aren't many resources that way that we've seen.

9. We make Copper and Iron cities, as well as Pavlodar industrial cities, not commercial ones. We need a far NE industrial city, and Pavlodar is the best choice, as maritime scouting will not reveal the wonder citys location.
9. iron is coastal..not sure what you mean...copper can be unit production center possible heroic epic there.
I would also quite fancy HE in the copper city, that will really put us on a nice footing for warring SANCTA. Pavlodar, being further back from the front line (and about as far away from every other civ as you can get) is an ideal spot to build wonders, yes.

10. We should now make some archers as well (get archery) and produce archers in Oskomen, and the more mobile chariots/Horsemen in Pavlodar, until we get enough industrial base.
I would much rather have Axemen than Archers! If the enemy is near enough to be attacking our cities then we've done something wrong.
 
Hmm, we're really bad at keeping threads on topic aren't we :rolleyes:
Absent us designating some new office, I would say it is the :king:'s job to keep the threads on task, and direct folks to the appropriate thread when they get off-topic. Dont you agree :king:? I will try my best to help, but we need a strong leader for a healthy Kazakhstan;)
 
The thing is that us regulars can follow all of this but for casual followers or new members it must be a nightmare trying to figure out what we're planning. For example, you would think that coming to the 'tech thread' you would be able to read about what techs we are planning to go for, right?

But we haven't actually discussed that here for a while...

No wonder none of the new people that joined our team recently have posted!!
 
For example, you would think that coming to the 'tech thread' you would be able to read about what techs we are planning to go for, right?

But we haven't actually discussed that here for a while...

No wonder none of the new people that joined our team recently have posted!!
Hmmm... IDK :king:. Have you checked the front page of the "Tech Thread" recently? Any new member who goes to the front page would be able to see exactly what we are going for and what we can get next... What we are "planning" to go for is very fluid, don't you agree?

Also :king: look at page 3 of this thread and focus on posts# 48, 49 & 50 and then think really hard about whos fault it is that this thread has strayed off topic... 50 especially could have quoted 49, but posted in another thread. I am not looking for apologies, just a little introspection. AND post 65 WTF?!? Can you say... "Mid Term Strategy Thread"?

I get totally what you are saying, I just think that the tech thread is a bad example... Yes we stray off topic a little, but for the most part the tech thread stays on topic. So in that vein:)...

I think we should get Metal Casting next instead of Aesthetics. Maybe we can convince one of our allies to go for Aesthetics, as :king: says, we have contributed the most tech to the alliance so we should get to call the shot on who techs what. We obviously need Math for chops, so maybe Cavalieros can go for Aethetics for us after Math.
 
Hmmm... IDK :king:. Have you checked the front page of the "Tech Thread" recently? Any new member who goes to the front page would be able to see exactly what we are going for and what we can get next... What we are "planning" to go for is very fluid, don't you agree?

The :king: is correct - it is difficult to follow what we are doing. The first post in this thread is great but it doesn't give the whole tech picture, does it? We have a three way alliance with tech trading - that is am important aspect of our tech picture. I have no idea what we're planning to get from our allies at this point.
 
We need a second treaty developed, I hope people will be more cooperative and less troubling this time around.
 
The :king: is correct - it is difficult to follow what we are doing. The first post in this thread is great but it doesn't give the whole tech picture, does it? We have a three way alliance with tech trading - that is am important aspect of our tech picture. I have no idea what we're planning to get from our allies at this point.
Good point Don, I will Put that Info on the front page as well.:)

We need a second treaty developed, I hope people will be more cooperative and less troubling this time around.
And Provo, this above Post is Mean spirited and Off-Topic. In your reply please:

1. Stay on topic and say something of substance. I know you have good ideas about a tech trading treaty for example...
2. Resist the temptation to put in Barbs and Insults... Please! Your team mates are "troublesome" because you antagonize them by calling them "troublesome." OK?;)
 
Btw it will take us only 4 turns to tech both Masonry and Monotheism once we have our Academy!

I'm sure we could get Judaism if we wanted...
 
I am opposed to getting Judaism. We have one religion and will get philo with a GS. Those beakers would be better spent elsewhere.
 
We'll also be getting Organised Religion for +25% production and prevent S&S from getting a religion for a long while...
 
We'll also be getting Organised Religion for +25% production and prevent S&S from getting a religion for a long while...
I think that denying religion to our enemies is reason enough to scoop up Judaism and Philosophy. Not to mention all the :commerce: When I play the AI, I always get three religions for the :commerce:. However I realise the S&S are not the AI. I still want to get Metal Casting, but I would consider this option as well. 4 turns you say? Very tempting:)

I am opposed to getting Judaism. We have one religion and will get philo with a GS. Those beakers would be better spent elsewhere.

But damnrunner, earlier you said...

Another option might be to go for Monotheism. I think the 25% building construction bonus makes it the best early religion.
Surely you dont want to miss out on the construction bonus just because we have a religion already?
 
our quick religion spread calls for getting Mono, I say we do exactly that, and then do MC, so we can get forges for another 25 % production bonus. MC will be cheaper, as Sancta already got it.
 
We want monotheism, to addopt organized religion, but it would be better if we get it from a tech exchange instead of teching it ourselves.

It would be better if we tech Aesthetics or metal casting and get monotheism from MS for example. the question is are they doing it? and how fast?

Another reason to do that is that we want them to have a religion to feel happier...if we start getting all the religions, soon we will be target!
 
our quick religion spread calls for getting Mono, I say we do exactly that, and then do MC, so we can get forges for another 25 % production bonus. MC will be cheaper, as Sancta already got it.
Exactly. Forges are expensive so best to build them with 25% bonus.

We want monotheism, to addopt organized religion, but it would be better if we get it from a tech exchange instead of teching it ourselves.

It would be better if we tech Aesthetics or metal casting and get monotheism from MS for example. the question is are they doing it? and how fast?

Another reason to do that is that we want them to have a religion to feel happier...if we start getting all the religions, soon we will be target!
I would prefer to get OR via trading but we'd have to wait as MS are going for Sailing now, I'm still nagging them via Cav for an accurate ETA.

If we are clever we can actually time the founding of the iron city to coincide with us getting Judaism, so it would be the holy city with +5:culture: meaning we can have both iron and fish (and fur) within the BFC on turn 2 after the city is founded.

Cav and MS both have a religion, so I can't see them being bitter about us getting it. It will screw over S&S too as a bonus :)
 
Good then, most of us seem to agree on a race for Monotheism, then Metal Casting, in order to leverage our nice religion spread with our need for production, as well as denying the same OR bonus to Sancta, our production rival.
 
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