Lets Try C2C in JosEPh_II Style

[Hydromancerx]

So JosEPh_II challenged me to play in his setting. My game setting are ...

Civ: Portugal
Leader: Afonzo I (Picked At Random)
Difficulty: Noble
# of Teams: 7

Victory
- Mastery

Map
Map: C2C Shuffle
Size: Large
Climate: Temperate
Sea Level : Low
Era: Prehistoric
Speed: Normal
World: Cylindrical
Resources: Standard

Options (Only checked off)
- No Revolutions
- Start as Minor Civ
- Multiple Production
- Multiple Research
- Usable Mountains
- Surround and Destroy
- Advanced Diplomacy
- Unlimited Wonders
- Barbarian Generals
- Assimilation
- Great Commanders
- Culturally linked Start
- Advanced Economy
- Larger Cities without Metropolitan Administration
- Realistic Corporations
- Religious Decay
- Barbarians Always Raze
- United Nations
- Advanced Espionage
- Modern Corporations
- Advanced Nukes
- No City Limits from Civs
- Infinite XP
- Unlimited National Units (Probably should not have checked this off)

Other
- Resource Depletion
- Multiple Region Spread
- Terrain Damage

So I will report back with how it goes. No screenshots unless I get in the mood. This is more to personally try out than as a series.

 

[Hydromancerx]

First 5 Turns

In the First 5 turns I settled where i was at a river in the middle on a landmass. Things are going way too fast for me. I got already 4 techs in 5 turns and changed civics to Native Language during one of them.

The terrain is very disordered and looks more like a patchwork of unrelated terrains. With like Deserts and Salt Flats appearing randomly in the middle of forests. So far I dislike this map a lot for its unrealistic nature.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Turns 6 to 10

Seems like a lot more trees than on PW2f and no big deserts. I have not found the poles yet but there are lots of animals to hunt at least. Odd not having to worry about terrain damage. I feel like I am cheating.

The other thing that's hard to get use to is all the buildings take like 1 turn to make. I put them in the cache so not to waste hammers. I also have been using the beelining of techs a bit more not to waste beakers either.

Everything is going at warp speed!

 

[Hydromancerx]

Turns 10 to 20

Techs are flying by. I did not mange to get termite mounds before cooking even though I put them off. Seems like every turn there is a new discovered tech. I also changed to Banditry and Oral Tradition civics.

Lost some units to animals but have not found any other civs yet. This map is very strange with how much of a patchwork terrain style. So disorderly. Its hard to enjoy anything when so much is coming so fast.

 

[JosEPh_II]

First 5 Turns

In the First 5 turns I settled where i was at a river in the middle on a landmass. Things are going way too fast for me. I got already 4 techs in 5 turns and changed civics to Native Language during one of them.

The terrain is very disordered and looks more like a patchwork of unrelated terrains. With like Deserts and Salt Flats appearing randomly in the middle of forests. So far I dislike this map a lot for its unrealistic nature.

The map is not an Earth type map so you'll have that. This is alt-earth or another planet think SMAC.

I should've said do not Start as Minors, why? Cause it's not really needed with 7AI. You'll find that out anyway.

But Barb World would've added some excitement since it places 1 barb city for every "player" in the game. This would've put 8 Barb cities on this map.

This speed will get the rust out of your gears.

Pay attention to your Crime and Disease though, can get out of hand much faster than you're used to. Well it's all faster than your used to

I'm going to enjoy this in more ways than one.

JosEPh

 

[Hydromancerx]

Turns 20 to 40

I am speeding through everything. I got a Deer event and lost my last starter unit to a Neanderthal. However I made 5 scouts and they are going gangbusters on all the animals. I even got a master hunter. The effects of each animal seems to have a much larger effect than on snail speed.

My city is producing building VERY fast its insane! And I still get a tech either every turn or every other turn. Its sick! I will be at Tribalism before I know it.

 

[JosEPh_II]

You should hit Tribalism at somewhere between 14-13000BC.

The screenie is a shot of My starting place. I almost regenerated but said what the heck let's do it! Now I got Mammoth Riders! Really glad I didn't regen the map.

I have 4 cities at 7220BC. I reached Sed Life at 8100BC. I have met 1 of the 7 AI. Start as Minors would've just been wasted in my game.

JosEPh

 

[Hydromancerx]

Turn 40 to 50

Ok this is crazy I am getting frequently 2 techs in one turn! I also seem to be killing like at least 5 animals per turn just by having them sit on a forested hill. I have more subdued animals than I know what to do with!

I also built the Venus of Willendorf so I have a size 5 city. There are so many animals to kill. I am researching Spear Making and well on my way to Tribalism. It seems like the game is only playable if you have techs and cities with their queues all lined up. Also had a border pop. I had forgotten how huge it gets. So I sent out like 5 gatherers (2 made per turn).

This game seem both too easy and too hard at the same time. And for different reasons. BTW my crime is still at like -100 or more so I don't have to worry about it at the moment. Also still have not met anyone yet. But I stil have not explored everything either. So many animals to wade through.

I will post more later when I have some more time to play.

 

[Hydromancerx]

Turn 50 to 75

So a lot has happened. I reached Tribalism and am on my way to Sedentary Lifestyle. I founded my first city and almost went bankrupt. I have so many animals that I had to butcher a ton of them just to come up with money. I also lowered my research to 0 and still did not have enough. Plus my techs are still coming like 1 per turn even with the research at 0%. Its crazy!

I also found China to the south of me. Still have not explored every part of the landmass. Note that I usually play on Large map so the size it at least the same for me. However I usually play with Old World so I usually see more civs by now.

 

[JosEPh_II]

Did you attempt to pick up Tengrii after Tribalism?

I usually do not have to lower research to 0% but mid Ancient I may dip to 50% for a few turns after I found a new city. I keep just enough animals to make herds, Hunters Lodge and animal standard for a new city in the closest city to the spot picked for the next one.

It's 5120BC and I just founded my 5th and 6th cities. Both will have Horse resource!

I have encountered my 2nd AI, Hiram. 1st was Gilgamesh.

Still plenty of room for expansion. Tons of animals still roam and will for sometime to come.

Researching Sac Cult on my way to Monotheism and eventually Judaism. Copper discovered in my Capital cities Fat X. Bronze Working in the path I set for Monotheism.

Every city will have 4 to 8 bldgs/units/wonders qued up. I do not set single items in build que anymore Unless it's a Major Wonder.

On your research and tech coming at "like 1 per turn... at 0%", remember the tech costs for Preh and succeeding Eras were just recently "standardized".

JosEPh

 

[Hydromancerx]

75 to 89 (aka The End)

I reached Sedentary Lifestyle at turn 89 (10900 BC). I have 3 cities and am only keeping my money in check by having lesser wealth in my capital. I have so many animals I don't know what to do with them all.

I met the Ottomans, Sioux and Mayans too. I am at the top score with 139 and I reached Sedentary Lifestyle first so I took Caste System as my free tech. This was a fun and crazy run. I have no idea how you would like to play with these settings on.

Overall I can see that if any new players played on this setting they would get overwhelmed too quickly. I can also see why you always complain about not enough gold. There is not enough time to build your infrastructure when your cities grow so fast and turns go so fast. Not to mention all the animals did not help my economy either by trying to keep them rather than butcher them.

I hope you had a good time listing to updates. But this is the last update for this experimental game.

 

[wolfensoul9]

Wow, nice early date for sedentary. I got it around 8900 on my experimental game. However, I had zero money issues at all. At all. I've gotten quite a few animals, though not as much as you, I think, and was in the double digits profits the whole way, and am currently in the early ancient era. I'll play until turn five hundred, and see how it goes.

 

[JosEPh_II]

You now have an inkling of how Preh Era "can" go on Normal. But you really need to go to the next level and continue play thru Ancient to Medieval.

You apparently held on to too many animals. I butcher and use for Culture and or Beaker(s). Using the Animal "Fight" in a new city (or several) works like having a Storyteller and helps expand city borders to the Fat X level. This can be very important If you have an Early Neighbor.

If you made Sed Life by 10900BC then you didn't pick up Tengrii and most likely none of the Mount giving techs either. That does cut the time down somewhat.

What were you Civics? I bet you used Slavery. That would also explain getting to Sed Life by 10900BC. Of course you know I never use Slavery but I didn't mention Not using it for the setup either so that was my fault.

Yes I enjoyed your cries of "This is Crazy!"

JosEPh

 

[wolfensoul9]

Well, Joseph, in my game, it's 6000 B.C., and Tengriism still hasn't gone. I know it's a fairly good religion, but it doesn't seem like the AI is gunning for it, like they do in your game.

Edit: oops, haha, my bad. Didn't see that it went around 8500 BC.

I'm not going to give a detailed play by play, but I'll play until turn 500, and give some general highlights and points.

I do really wonder how he got to sedentary so early. All I can think of is maybe he had alot of commerce, and built research. Turn 89 is crazy, even if you straight beeline it.

 

[Hydromancerx]

What were you Civics? I bet you used Slavery. That would also explain getting to Sed Life by 10900BC. Of course you know I never use Slavery but I didn't mention Not using it for the setup either so that was my fault.

My civics are ...

- Government = Chiefdom
- Power = Junta
- Society = Tribal (Changing to Caste)
- Economy = Barter
- Military = Banditry
- Religion = Folklore
- Welfare = Survival
- Garbage = Garbage Anywhere
- Immigration = No Borders
- Education = Oral Tradition
- Language = Native Language
- Agriculture = No Agriculture
- Currency = No Currency
- Politics = Matriarchy

BTW my Capital was a turn or 2 away from size 10.

EDIT: Here is the save game from the turn 89.

 

[wolfensoul9]

Well, so far it's turn 307, and I'm about a third into the way of the classical era.

I have to say...this is fairly hard. I don't know why, but the crime is so much harder to keep track of than it used to be. Then again, that may be because the last time I played, was back in v23. Money is much more difficult to come by once you get writing and then currency. Once you get those, your income just plummets, as well as the stone tool maker going obsolete.

Happiness is being a *****, too. The cities just grow in population so fast, the crime, and thusly unhappiness and income lost just skyrockets. It's really hard to take care of. I actually had to go down to 40 percent science after currency, and am now up to 70.

Right now I have seven cities, not very many compared to the other civs. I have more than double the score of the second highest, though I've only been able to see two others so far.

Unlike Hydro, I rather like this map. It's not nearly as random as he was making it out to be. I'm in a sort of snaky archipelago, and the terrain looks pretty realistic to me. No humongous deserts at every turn.

I have to say...

...

Joseph may be right.

This is more fun. It's more fast-paced, and frantic, and since that means you make more mistakes, it means it's more challenging, and well, ergo for me at least, fun.

I may drop down to playing these faster speeds, though the fact that the units still heal as fast, is really annoying. Five turns to heal is huge at this speed.

Still, if I want to play as well as I can, I'll stay on the slow speeds. This is more...just breakneck crazy-fun.

It's still too early to say how balanced the production to tech to turn ratios are, though.

I have to say one thing, though. I wish there was a better city defender than archers in between them and longbowman. You go all of ancient and classical with them. There's really no real better pure city protector than them until all the way to feudalism. Kind of annoying.

 

[JosEPh_II]

Aww what does an "old black sheep" know anyway.

I made a mistake with Hydro when I only challenged him thru Preh Era. I should have said thru at least Classical or into Medieval. And even though he didn't get to use Termite mound I do, every game. It's all in how you "Path" the tech tree. (But I rarely, anymore, use his Berry Bushes or Mushrooms even with taking Herbalism as the 3rd tech taken.) And I usually make Sed Life between mid 8000BC to early 6000BC because I always try for Tengrii. I've missed out before too (Inuit beat me by 2 turns) and had to make a real hard effort for Shinto.

Seriously I'd like to see someone else besides me take a Normal or Epic speed game into Modern Era w/o using REV, City Limits, Limited religions, FB, and Realistic Culture Spread (hint: it's Not realistic, it's broke.) nor using an earth type map with 28 pre set Civs all starting in the Old World.

I actually have not made it past Medieval Era since v24. Just too many game breaking changes to try to keep an SVN game going, when whole new systems are put in. And I only started using Normal with v26 release. Before I used Epic and sometimes Marathon but was chided and castigated several times for using Epic instead of Snail.

JosEPh

 

[Dancing Hoskuld]

I can't get to modern at all. I end up with too many units and just give up. The crime units add at least 2 units per city which means I reach my unit limit a lot sooner.

 

[JosEPh_II]

I can't get to modern at all. I end up with too many units and just give up. The crime units add at least 2 units per city which means I reach my unit limit a lot sooner.

I'm finding that by the end of Cassical now I have 4-6 TW per major city and at least 2 Healers in All cities.

I've had up to 120 units in a border city as the AI had 130+ in the city across the river. Last game that made it to mid Medieval had 500+ units from 22 cities. I kept waiting for that AI to cross that river so the War to end all Wars would get under way. BUt a new system for building upgrades got put in and that game got tossed. That was an Epic game.

Maybe I'll make it thru Med Era on this current Normal speed game.

JosEPh

 

[ls612]

I'm finding that by the end of Cassical now I have 4-6 TW per major city and at least 2 Healers in All cities.

I've had up to 120 units in a border city as the AI had 130+ in the city across the river. Last game that made it to mid Medieval had 500+ units from 22 cities. I kept waiting for that AI to cross that river so the War to end all Wars would get under way. BUt a new system for building upgrades got put in and that game got tossed. That was an Epic game.

Maybe I'll make it thru Med Era on this current Normal speed game.

JosEPh

Speaking of which, how is your new Normal game going? Could you please post that on the Balance thread, I'd like feedback on my changes. Thanks.