I've started my first full post patch game (the one, where autoexplore no more zooms to curiosities in the fog), and after 5 turns I had enough science to pick the first culture (Civilization difficulty), so I thought I'd linger no more and immediately picked Mycenians to try some early warmongering. But starting a civilization with only one outpost and one scout proved tricky, and too soon I was facing Spiffing Brit persona who picked the Huns. A bit of impatience, recklessness and bad luck on my side saw the Hunnic hordes slaughtering all my troops and marching into my capital, to make me their vassal. Thanks for the spared life, by the way So on turn 51 I started my life as a vassal to the Hunnic Spiffing Brit persona, and I soon found out it wasn't so bad. The tribute to the liege was quite small, I got to enjoy all his resources without the need to pay for them, no more headache from the harassment of his troops, no protests when I snatched the last region on our continent next to him, then I found a lot of uncontested land for further expansion and now, some further 125 turns later I'm at least triple or even quadruple the size of my liege in territory, fame-wise I rose from the last place to the first, no harassment with any sort of grievances from other AI whatsoever, I keep minimal troops and build to my pleasure, while remaining a happy vassal. So I think that vassals might have their life a bit too comfy? Where's the downside? The gold tribute is minor, if the liege is strong, nobody messes with them and leaves you in peace by extension, yeah, trade options limited, but when you get your liege's resources for free, that is being offset somehow, so the vassal just sits there and collects their stars and influence etc. without trouble. Shouldn't the liege be entitled to something more? A share of other yields, perhaps, like influence, food, scientific knowledge, manpower, maybe demand that the vassal supplies them with some units from time to time?