LK166, Dutch, CCM, UN victory target

LKendter

Exterminate, exterminate, exterminate!!!
Supporter
Joined
Aug 15, 2001
Messages
19,564
Hear are ideas for the next game:

1 - Try for a UN victory

2 - Space again, but without the economic boost of Democracy / Republic. I'm not sure if standard Monarchy / Communism would be harder.

3 - 500K total civ, but without artist. I think emperor is reasonable, as we need to secure most of the wonders giving bonus culture such as religious monuments. Each one of those is worth 10K+ over 500 turns.

4 - Another AWM. I've figure out why these are so tough. Some civs get multiple bonus settlers. If you are next to them, it is almost impossible.


Let me know what sounds best. LK165 doesn't have much time left.
 
For me, 1, 2, and 3 seem to become "hit enter and wait for next turn" around the time we build Hoover Dam. Also, I have a save from LK165 that we could use to obtain a UN victory in 1 or 2 turns or we could go back a little further and use 1 of the later LK185 posted saves.

Of the choices offered I choose AWM.

What about a Conquest Victory? We would have to raze cities to avoid owing 58% of the land.
 
What about a Conquest Victory? We would have to raze cities to avoid owing 58% of the land.
I suspect the grind would be a lot more than domination. All the little islands would have be be destroyed.

The fighting with 100+ city empire is the biggest time suck portion of the game. Conquest would add a lot more of that time.


I'm trying to come up with ideas other then AWM over and over. This game at least finally let us win different with space.
 
How about a Primary victory conditions with 2 backup provisions?
Primary 500K culture. We will have about 400K complete when we complete the Mars Mission. Completing the culture/happiness buildings before all of the shield bonus buildings and having more cities would have helped get culture higher. Seems like we might do it at Deity level.
As a back up victory condition, if it looks like we will fall short of 500K culture, Space Race victory.
And finally, if we get bored hitting enter, or want to play with the more modern weapons, Domination victory, with the provision that no AI can still have its starting Capital.
 
Or a twist on AW?

First civ we meet - declare war.
Second and subsequent civs - declare war if we're not already at war.

Another option - Democratic Domination. Key rule would be: Switch to Democracy as soon as we learn it (or, if the GA is going at the time, as soon as the GA ends).

Could a strict "raze and replace" policy work in CCM? Most of our games rely heavily on capturing cities. Maybe if we managed to snag a couple of the early extra-settler wonders?

No-research Space game? We'd need to cultivate a couple of big rivals who could drive research, allowing us to tech-steal our way to Mars. It would also encourage some late-game war to prevent losing the space race.

I'll play whatever we decide on, with a slight preference for UN victory. We haven't played a game with that goal before.
 
You should consider playing the next game with the Flintlock patch and a prototype of the next version of CCM 2.6. Warfare becomes tougher, as the AI attacks with stacks containing land artillery with bombardment settings and knows how to fill and use armies. Land artillery and armies can be built with the next version of CCM 2.50 as in normal C3C. An always war game with these settings can become much more daunting compared to former versions of CCM and without the Flintlock patch.

Here is an excerpt of a pm I sent to Flintlock about the setting of the new offensive land artillery:

For the best use of the new features of your great mod, frequently some additional settings in mods like CCM and RARR are needed. Per example if there is only one capturable type of land artillery unit (catapult, cannon, etc.) available for all 31 civs, the victor of a battle of two stacks with hundreds of land artillery units in them, can capture hundreds of additional land artillery units and a clever human player can capture many hundreds of land artillery units if starting a surprise attack against the stack of that winner. If the land artillery units are set to have a defense value, this problem is eliminated, but the time for a battle between these stacks is massively enlarged, as now every land artillery unit in that stack must be additionally defeated. My solution for this problem in the CCM and RARR mods is, that every civ now has civspecific types of land artillery, so such massive gains in additional land artillery units for the winner of a battle of those stacks can be avoided without enlarging the time of the battle. Therefore hundreds of new land artillery units to make them civspecific will be added to CCM and RARR to achieve this goal.
 
Elephantium - CD version Flintlock patch is OUT. Until such point the Flintlock supports CD version, this isn't happening.
 
I have some questions about the Flintlock patch.
I ran the "Install.bat" and it appears to have successfully installed the patch.
I then copied the patched Civ3Conquests.exe and the flintlock patch folder from the drive were I had just installed civ3 to the drive I have LK185 installed on.
I have been able to start a new CMM game and I was able to start an old save from the current game a test some worker stack commands.
1) The installation instructions refer to a config file. The only one I find is default.c3x_config.com with a Nov 8, 2021 modify date. Am I missing a config file?
2) Are we as a team going to use the same settings in the config file or can we have different setting and not Bork the game? e.g. I personally would turn off automate workers.

My limited test shows that the worker stack commands will need to be applied carefully. Most likely if you wanted to build a road, railroad, pant a forest, and mine with a mixed group of workers, you would have to move the request number of workers/slaves there for each task and not be able to use a group of 4 bulldozers and 9 slaves by issuing 4 stack commands and have the correct group chosen. I am not complaining. Just saying we have to use a little care when using mixed groups.

3) Is there a thread I can read to find out how the stack and other commands work in game?
4) I am going to run a test game to test the "worker" stack commands with various mixes of Steamrollers, Workers and Slaves.
 
Elephantium - CD version Flintlock patch is OUT. Until such point the Flintlock supports CD version, this isn't happening.

The Civ 3 Complete version of GOG is on sale at GOG all few weeks for € 1,29 (or the adequate price in dollar). This is about the price of a bottle of beer or a soft drink, but you are rewarded with a much better C3C. The Flintlock patch should work with the steam version, too, but it is developed on the GOG version and the steam version additionally needs a patch for the labels text file as steam inserted into the labels text file an additional line with the text "Unknown", playing havoc with the texts of mods and scenarios.

I have some questions about the Flintlock patch.
I ran the "Install.bat" and it appears to have successfully installed the patch.
I then copied the patched Civ3Conquests.exe and the flintlock patch folder from the drive were I had just installed civ3 to the drive I have LK185 installed on.
I have been able to start a new CMM game and I was able to start an old save from the current game a test some worker stack commands.

The Flintlock patch works with existing save files and saves made with the mod active will still work in the game without the Flintlock patch (see the readme file).

The installation instructions refer to a config file. The only one I find is default.c3x_config.com with a Nov 8, 2021 modify date. Am I missing a config file?

The default.c3x_config of R9 (Release 9) is the current file. R10 will come soon.

Are we as a team going to use the same settings in the config file or can we have different setting and not Bork the game? e.g. I personally would turn off automate workers.

In my eyes it is useful if players in a succession game use the same config file settings.

My limited test shows that the worker stack commands will need to be applied carefully. Most likely if you wanted to build a road, railroad, pant a forest, and mine with a mixed group of workers, you would have to move the request number of workers/slaves there for each task and not be able to use a group of 4 bulldozers and 9 slaves by issuing 4 stack commands and have the correct group chosen. I am not complaining. Just saying we have to use a little care when using mixed groups.

If the stack commands are enabled, they are an addition to the normal unit commands. The normal unit commands are still available. For workers in CCM the only small situation for still using the normal commands is when moving into a tile that has no road in it and than a road should be created in the next tile as here both MV points of a worker will be used before the remaining workers can build a road in the next tile. Otherwise with the 2 MV workers in CCM the workers can move into one tile with the stack command "build road" and when there is enough capacity in the worker stack for building the road in one turn, the remaining capacity of that stack can be used to build a mine or irrigate that tile or to move to another tile that is connected by a road and improving that tile with a mine, irrigation, railway and so on. It is a massive reduction of micromanagement in the game.

The same happens with the stack bombard command when beeing used. If there is enough capacity in the bombarding stack, the remaining units can do other actions if all targets in a tile are destroyed. If this is not wanted, individual bombardment can be used for each unit in a stack as it is in the normal game.

Is there a thread I can read to find out how the stack and other commands work in game?

The Flintlock patch holds a README file:

Readme1.jpg

Readme2.jpg

Readme3.jpg
 
Elephantium - CD version Flintlock patch is OUT. Until such point the Flintlock supports CD version, this isn't happening.

I wishlisted Civ 3 on gog.com. I'll pick it up next time it's on sale.

The Civ 3 Complete version of GOG is on sale at GOG all few weeks for € 1,29 (or the adequate price in dollar)

Sorry, I'm not sure what this means -- the "all few weeks" phrasing is confusing. When I go to https://www.gog.com/en/game/sid_meiers_civilization_iii_complete, I see it listed for the current "regular price". Where do you see it on sale? Maybe it's a regional difference?
 
Interesting results with the Flintlock patch:
I upgraded 176 Partisans in using the stack upgrade command. It only upgraded the 165 Partisans that cost zero (0) gold to upgrade and skipped the 11 Partisans that cost 270 gold to upgrade.
Also when trading, if I offer 1 Resource or 1 Luxury I get the best offer from the AI. However, if I offer the Resource plus the Luxury I do not get the best price.
 
Sorry, I'm not sure what this means -- the "all few weeks" phrasing is confusing. When I go to https://www.gog.com/en/game/sid_meiers_civilization_iii_complete, I see it listed for the current "regular price". Where do you see it on sale? Maybe it's a regional difference?

This means that it only lasts some weeks when it was offered in sale for € 1,29 until it is offered in another sale at GOG for € 1,29 again. If remembering well, the last sale for Civ 3 Complete was 2 weeks ago, so in about 2-3 weeks it could be on sale again (but this is only a rule of thumb). These sales are not regional. There are weekend sales starting each Friday at 3pm, middleweek sales and tons of big special sales (not only Eastern, Christmas, Chinese new year, Valentin´s day, Halloween - there are so many that I think they like to do such sales as frequently as possible). If I am aware of such a sale for Civ 3 Complete I will do a post here.
 
Interesting results with the Flintlock patch:
I upgraded 176 Partisans in using the stack upgrade command. It only upgraded the 165 Partisans that cost zero (0) gold to upgrade and skipped the 11 Partisans that cost 270 gold to upgrade.
Also when trading, if I offer 1 Resource or 1 Luxury I get the best offer from the AI. However, if I offer the Resource plus the Luxury I do not get the best price.

The best price setting is not working in all cases. This is why I have not mentioned it when introducing the Flintlock patch. I reported this to Flintlock some time ago.

Jersey Joe, can you please post your save file with the 270 gold partisans, so I can have alook into it, when I have the time to do it.
 
This means that it only lasts some weeks when it was offered in sale for € 1,29 until it is offered in another sale at GOG for € 1,29 again.

...

If I am aware of such a sale for Civ 3 Complete I will do a post here.

Ah, that makes sense now! Thank you! :goodjob:

In your previous comment, I would have said it as "It's usually on sale every few weeks on GOG." Language is funny sometimes :crazyeye:
 
Jersey Joe, can you please post your save file with the 270 gold partisans, so I can have alook into it, when I have the time to do it.
Attached is a copy of the turn when I updated the Partisans.

There are 3 stacks of Partisans. The partisans are all fortified except for 1 Partisan per stack who is active.

When preparing the stack for you (no one is moving except the 3 Partisans) I noticed that Flintlock seems to have our Scientific Golden age working correctly, or at least better than it was. Scientists are now earning 5 beakers per turn :goodjob: instead of the 12 beakers per turn they got using the Antal1987 exe file.
 

Attachments

  • Test Partisan Upgrade 1981 AD.SAV
    1.6 MB · Views: 26
Thank you very much for the save file. :) À pro pos Golden Age: The Flintlock patch also shows the number of remaining turns when having a Golden Age. :thumbsup:
 
Here are ideas for the next game:

1 - Try for a UN victory. Tusker preferred.

2 - Space again, but without the economic boost of Democracy / Republic. I'm not sure if standard Monarchy / Communism would be harder.

3 - Total civ culture of 500K, but without artists. I think emperor is reasonable, as we need to secure most of the wonders giving bonus culture such as religious monuments. Each one of those is worth 10K+ over 500 turns.

4 - Another AWM. I've figured out why these are so tough. Some civs get multiple bonus settlers. If you are next to them, it is almost impossible. JJ preferred

5 - Must raze all as suggested by Tusker. NOTE: We did this with LK155, Maya, required raze all.

6 - Conquest as suggest by JJ since it has never been done. This will be a major time grind at the end. We would have to agree on a maximum empire size to avoid accidental domination.

I’ve already debated changing the .biq to bring back map trading. This is a must for conquest. I don’t want to spend ages looking for 1 city hiding on an obscure island. I would enable map trading with printing press. My #1 complain with CCM for ages has been lack of map trading.
 
I should have mentioned this earlier. Why do I not see the Astronaut splash screen when I start Civ3/CMM2.50 with the flintlock patch? I get the standard splash screen :confused:.
 
Top Bottom