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LK77 - Samurai Pride, Deity variant.

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Succession Games' started by LKendter, Sep 18, 2004.

  1. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    17,712
    Difficulty = Deity
    Civilization = Japan
    Pangaea, 60%, warm, wet, 5 million
    Sedentary barbs
    World Size = Small

    Signed up:
    LKendter
    Kaiser_Berger
    Open slot
    Open slot
    Open slot

    Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.

    Variant rules:
    1) Nothing special during the ancient age.
    2) Once the middle ages arrive we must go full steam to get Chivalry. We will research at max the required techs if we can't buy them. No other techs are allowed until we have Chivalry.
    3) Once we have built our first Samurai our defiant attitudes begins. At the point we must refuse all demands. We must demand AI leave our territory if they go past skimming our borders (1 tile in).

    Signup requirements: Previous deity military win. This will be much harder then average deity.


    ===========================================

    The following tactics are PROHIBITED:

    RoP Rape - if you have to ask...

    RoP Abuse that includes things such as irrigating all tiles with a city building wonders, denying resources with a RoP, putting a unit to block a land bridge, etc.

    Scout resource denial - parking a scout on a resource, as the AI won't ask scouts to leave. The same scenario also applies to workers.

    False Peace Treaties (must wait for the 20 years to end).

    The negative science exploit - you can run a huge deficit (-250 / turn) of negative cash with a token penalty of one lost worker / cheap building. If cash will go below zero, the research level must be dropped.

    Ship chaining exploit - you can move a ship, unload troops to another ship, move that ship, etc. This allows you to ship an indefinite distance, and that is why I consider it an exploit.

    Resources disconnect / connect exploit - I consider most resource tactics fine. Delaying to hook a resource, trading it away etc is fine. The exploit is to do this every turn. Build a stack of horses, connect saltpeter, upgrade to cavalry, and disconnect.

    Palace Jump - You abandon the capital city to move the palace to a new location. If you want to move the palace, build a new palace.

    Mass troop jumping - You can't give away a give a city to transport a large amount of troops to another land mass.


    Standard LK house rules:
    1) Worker automation of any kind is prohibited.
    2) No worker purchases during the first 50 turns to avoid civ crippling.
    3) Declaring war / demanding leave solely for the purpose of getting out of trade deals. This includes nonsense spying simply to force a war. Stealing techs is fine.
    4) Even if not covered under exploits listed, please try not to use tactics that take advantage of holes in the game design.
    5) Our trading reputation is golden - please respect it.
    6) Complete your turn. It is frustrating to get a 1/2 completed turn.
    7) Once you post a skip notice it is irrevocable.
    8) If I skip a player to due a missed got it, or over due turn the turn is invalid if the next player has posted a got it.
     
  2. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    17,712
    :bump:

    Still looking for 3 more players.
     
  3. meldor

    meldor Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2002
    Messages:
    3,666
    Location:
    Tualatin, Or
    OK, OK, sign me up. Let's get this thing going...
     
  4. gozpel

    gozpel Couch-potato (fortified)

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2002
    Messages:
    4,371
    Location:
    Australia
    Since this isn't early AW I sign up if you want me. And who says it will even be AW? :)

    Even I can handle a handful of samurais.
     
  5. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    17,712
    I fully expect a lot of fighting. Deity RoP will be a major problem for us. We will actually build an play assuming mutliple wars.

    ============================

    LKendter
    Kaiser_Berger
    meldor
    gozpel
    Open slot
     
  6. bed_head7

    bed_head7 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2004
    Messages:
    2,494
    I would only barely qualify, so I'll hold off on signing up. But I've been wanting to try Japan in an SG, and I think I will track this one.
     
  7. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    17,712
    :bump:

    Looking for player #5 for a tough deity variant.
     
  8. microbe

    microbe Cascaded Mansion

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2003
    Messages:
    4,596
    I resisted signing up for this but you kept bumping it. :) I'm in.
     
  9. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    17,712
    LKendter
    Kaiser_Berger
    meldor
    gozpel
    microbe
    got to love the :bump:
     
  10. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    17,712
    I will get this one started Tuesday night. RBG-15I took long and I am going to sleep as soon as I finish reading the boards.
     
  11. gozpel

    gozpel Couch-potato (fortified)

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2002
    Messages:
    4,371
    Location:
    Australia
    :bump: I couldn't let this fall to second page.
     
  12. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    17,712
    Well I am an airhead...
    Uploaded the game, and dotmap. I then proceed to forget the story. I will post it tonight.

    I can say this much. Our start is BRUTAL!
     
  13. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    17,712
    4000 BC
    We have a river and lots of forest. What we don't have is any food bonuses. After Kyoto is formed I notice a deer tile outside of the borders. If we have any more extra food we may have a first ring settler factory.


    3400 BC
    We have first contact with Germany. Our nearest neighbor has Ivory. :(
    I can't get a good trade for the moment. I will hope something when pottery completes in 3 turns.


    3350 BC
    The German borders are absurdly close. The race for the silks begins.


    3350 BC
    This is a better deal. I ship Germany The Wheel, Pottery and Burial. I get Bronze Working, Warrior code and $10.


    3050 BC
    I make first contact with the Hittites whom are also way to close to our borders. It looks like they have contacted 2 other civs already. I send them Burial and The Wheel and get Alphabet and $30 in return.


    2900 BC
    I dial up Germany and ship him Alphabet and $35 for Masonry. The Hittites need Masonry. I hope they get something of value for us to get.


    2710 BC
    I am already dancing with the Hittites to keep them away from the spice patch.


    2630 BC
    The AI can be so predictable sometimes. I leave the hill and the settler turns around again.


    2550 BC
    :mad: The Germans already stole the silks and a first ring city spot.


    ==========================

    Summary:
    We got a very rough start. Losing a ring spot is very bad.

    The Hittites still have nothing to offer for Masonry. Keep checking every turn.

    Watch if the Hittite settler turns around again for the spices and / or horses.


    Signed up:
    LKendter
    Kaiser_Berger (currently playing)
    Meldor (on deck)
    Gozpel
    Microbe

    Our general game plan:
    1) I am treating this like AW and targeting cities 3 apart.
    2) Avoid a city that sticks out, as the will trip the demand territory rule and add more wars.

    The below are the variant rules.
    1) No restrictions occur in the Ancient Ages.
    2) Upon entry in to the Middle Ages we most head to Chivalry ASAP. Any trades must be for Chivalry or the mandatory techs. No trading for other techs hoping to pull off a 2 for 1 deal. If we can't buy the techs we must researching at the fastest possible positive cash flow rate toward Chivalry.
    3) If we don't have iron to build Samurai we must make the effort go buy iron / acquire a source of our own.
    4) After our first Samurai is built / upgraded to the defiance rules kick in.
    • We must refuse all demands.
    • We won't sign any RoPs.
    • We must demand that Civ leave our borders except in the case of cutting a corner.
    • We won't accept any peace treaty that requires US to pay. Note: It is fine to pay for a tech at a clear discount. It is only valid to pay for a tech if straight up peace was already offered available.
    • We are not obliged to sign peace treaties.

    OPEN QUESTION What should the alliance rules be? We could wind up in a situation of having to demand our "ally" leave our borders and start yet another war.


    Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.

    http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/LK77-2550BC.zip
     
  14. Kaiser_Berger

    Kaiser_Berger Terran Emporer

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2002
    Messages:
    1,478
    Location:
    UW-Stevens Point
    I've got it.

    I'm not sure about the alliances. I'm inclined to say go with them, and if we have to boot out an ally, so be it.

    Preturn- As I would expect, everything in in good shape.

    IT- Hittite Settler pair moves back towards the spices/horses

    Kyoto-settler-warrior

    T1 2510

    After some thought, I decide on settling the horses first so we have military options.

    I continue the Waltz de Hittites, hoping they will turn away.

    IT- As predicted, they disappear into the fog

    T2 2470

    Not much.

    IT- Hittites reappear

    T3 2430

    Osaka is founded. Of course, there is a cow right outside of it's future borders.

    Hittites are now up Writing, IW, and Math. Not a single trade possibility.

    IT- Hittites run away

    Kyoto completes warrior, starts settler.

    T4 2390

    Our western warrior spots light blue borders. I also spot a Mayan city in the north. Our warrior up there will reverse course to meet them.

    IT- zzz

    T5 2350

    We have contacted China. They have same tech as Hittites.

    In some interesting news, the Mayan city is now a pile of ruins! It appears our neighbors are a bit feisty.

    IT- zzz

    T6 2310

    We have some nice land to our east.

    IT- zzz

    T7 2270

    The Maya must be closer than I though, as we spot a settler pair near the Hittite settler pair. They are at the same tech level as China. I notice Hittites lack Mysticism, so I'll try and swing something here. 129g and 2gpt get us Myst from Maya. Myst and our last 5gpt gets us Iron Working. We're skating on economic thin ice now, but it will improve as soon as we road more tiles and settle more cities.

    The Mayan settler pair is standing on the nearest visible iron.

    IT- The Mayans settler on the iron

    T8 2230

    An exploring warrior stumbles upon an Aztec warrior fortified in the jungle. We're up Myst on them. No deals right now.

    IT- zzz

    T9 2190

    Good news-We discover iron just east of Kyoto.

    Bad news- Germany just plopped a city next to it.

    IT- zzz

    T10 2150

    Not much new.


    Summary


    We're really getting boxed in. I think we'll get a few more cities before we have to hook up our horses and torch the offending German towns.

     
  15. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    17,712
    Watch if the Hittite settler turns around again for the spices and / or horses.

    The next city site is defintely the spices. We want to secure at least one native luxury.

    I will do another dot map tonight.

    ===============================

    Signed up:
    LKendter
    Kaiser_Berger
    Meldor (currently playing)
    Gozpel (on deck)
    Microbe

    Our general game plan:
    1) I am treating this like AW and targeting cities 3 apart.
    2) Avoid a city that sticks out, as the will trip the demand territory rule and add more wars.

    The below are the variant rules.
    1) No restrictions occur in the Ancient Ages.
    2) Upon entry in to the Middle Ages we most head to Chivalry ASAP. Any trades must be for Chivalry or the mandatory techs. No trading for other techs hoping to pull off a 2 for 1 deal. If we can't buy the techs we must researching at the fastest possible positive cash flow rate toward Chivalry.
    3) If we don't have iron to build Samurai we must make the effort go buy iron / acquire a source of our own.
    4) After our first Samurai is built / upgraded to the defiance rules kick in.
    • We must refuse all demands.
    • We won't sign any RoPs.
    • We must demand that Civ leave our borders except in the case of cutting a corner.
    • We won't accept any peace treaty that requires US to pay. Note: It is fine to pay for a tech at a clear discount. It is only valid to pay for a tech if straight up peace was already offered available.
    • We are not obliged to sign peace treaties.

    OPEN QUESTION What should the alliance rules be? We could wind up in a situation of having to demand our "ally" leave our borders and start yet another war.


    Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
     
  16. meldor

    meldor Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2002
    Messages:
    3,666
    Location:
    Tualatin, Or
    I see it and will start on it tonight if possible.
     
  17. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    17,712
    I *moved* yellow dot one space. I realize green dot isn't on a river, and I don't care. This is going to have as much fighting as AWE. We need our cities 3 tiles apart.


    The bad news I planned for this to be a deity+ game, but we have a Sid- game. Germany just settled to close to us.
     
  18. Kaiser_Berger

    Kaiser_Berger Terran Emporer

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2002
    Messages:
    1,478
    Location:
    UW-Stevens Point
    Indeed, it is a bit of bad luck that Germany expanded directly towards us, considering the decent piece of open land to their northwest.
     
  19. meldor

    meldor Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2002
    Messages:
    3,666
    Location:
    Tualatin, Or
    2150 BC (0)
    Not much to change.
    (I)Kyoto settler->settler.

    2110 BC (1)
    (I)

    2070 BC (2)
    Settler start on his way.
    (I)The Chinese begin the Pyramids, the Hittites the Oracle. The Mayan's are at war with someone. Osaka worker->rax

    2030 BC (3)
    One more square to go.
    (I)Nada.

    2030 BC (4)
    We found Tokyo, starts warrior.
    (I)Bismark demands 1g, I give it.

    1950 BC (5)
    (I)Hmmm. The Aztecs appear to be after the Chinese.

    1910 BC (6)
    (I)Watch the Aztecs capture a Chinese city.

    1870 BC (7)
    (I)Kyoto settler->settler

    1830 BC (8)
    The spices are now connected to the capital.
    (I)Bad news. The Germans are building the Statue of Zeus.

    1790 BC (9)
    (I)The Germans are fighting the Mayans.

    1750 BC (10)
    The settler is in place to found next turn.
     
  20. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    17,712
    Signed up:
    LKendter
    Kaiser_Berger
    Meldor (currently playing)
    Gozpel (on deck)
    Microbe

    Our general game plan:
    1) I am treating this like AW and targeting cities 3 apart.
    2) Avoid a city that sticks out, as the will trip the demand territory rule and add more wars.

    The below are the variant rules.
    1) No restrictions occur in the Ancient Ages.
    2) Upon entry in to the Middle Ages we most head to Chivalry ASAP. Any trades must be for Chivalry or the mandatory techs. No trading for other techs hoping to pull off a 2 for 1 deal. If we can't buy the techs we must researching at the fastest possible positive cash flow rate toward Chivalry.
    3) If we don't have iron to build Samurai we must make the effort go buy iron / acquire a source of our own.
    4) After our first Samurai is built / upgraded to the defiance rules kick in.
    • We must refuse all demands.
    • We won't sign any RoPs.
    • We must demand that Civ leave our borders except in the case of cutting a corner.
    • We won't accept any peace treaty that requires US to pay. Note: It is fine to pay for a tech at a clear discount. It is only valid to pay for a tech if straight up peace was already offered available.
    • We are not obliged to sign peace treaties.

    OPEN QUESTION What should the alliance rules be? We could wind up in a situation of having to demand our "ally" leave our borders and start yet another war.


    Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
     

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