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LK82 - Science Experiment II Invitational, Spain, Deity

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Succession Games' started by LKendter, Dec 29, 2004.

  1. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    17,796
    Difficulty = Deity
    Civilization = Spain
    Pangaea, 60%, warm, wet, 5 million
    No barbs
    World Size = Standard

    Signed up:
    LKendter
    Open slot
    Open slot
    Open slot
    Open slot


    The below is the list of players invited. The order of invitees was randomly determined. If I get at least 3 within 48 hours the game will start.
    Grimjack
    Greebley
    Microbe
    Gozpel
    Alternate:
    Kaiser_Berger
    Meldor

    Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.


    Variant rules:
    1) We must self-research at maximum possible rate that keeps a positive cash flow. This clearly prohibits minimum research. The following are the exceptions:
    1A) We are still allowed to turn down research the last turn.
    1B) We can shut of research temporarily if the ToE will be built in less time then any mandatory tech can be researched.
    1C) War emergency act: For a maximum of 5 turns we may shut off research to build cash for embassies / upgrades / cash rushed units. We must be actively at war to invoke this act. This may only be done ONCE per game Save this for a major crisis.

    2) We may not build the GL. We must raze the GL city unless we own education.

    3) We may only buy techs from the AI if the cash we pay is 50% or less of the initial self-research cost. The remaining 50% can be from techs we own, luxuries, resources or peace treaty. This amount is the raw dollar amount. If research is a total of $80, then buying is a total of $40 max. To check the value of a tech is easy. If 12 beakers give writing in 23 turns, then the estimated cost is $276.

    4) Research is prohibited on optional techs except the following specific techs: Literature, Republic, Military Tradition, Nationalism, and Sanitation. If Literature and Republic are available at the same time we can't choose literature.

    5) When in doubt remember the goal - to test if self-research is really that bad at deity.
     
  2. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    17,796
    The following tactics are PROHIBITED:

    RoP Abuse Tactics - Denying resources, blocking key tiles, RoP rape, or other ways to screw-up a civ via the RoP. A scout in AI territory has an explicit RoP and is subject to this rule.

    Peace Treaty abuse - If you get concessions from the AI you must wait for the 20 turns to end before declaring another war.

    Resource abuse - You can't disconnect / reconnect a resource every turn for the sake of building cheap units to upgrade with excess cash.

    Ship chaining exploit - you can move a ship, unload troops to another ship in the same square not using any movement, move that ship, etc. This allows you to ship an indefinite distance, and that is why I consider it an exploit.

    The negative science exploit - you can run a huge deficit (-250 / turn) of negative cash with a token penalty of one lost worker / cheap building. If cash will go below zero, the research level must be dropped.

    Palace Jump - You abandon the capital city to move the palace to a new location. If you want to move the palace, build a new palace.

    Mass troop jumping - You can't give away a give a city to transport a large amount of troops to another landmass.


    Standard LK house rules:
    1) Worker automation of any kind is prohibited.

    2) Worker blockades are prohibited. This prevents things such as fortifying workers along the coast to stop invasions, blocking troops from going through your territory with workers, etc. Workers activity doing something along the coast is fine. The workers must be actively doing something.

    3) You may not declare war on a civ if you are currently shipping cash and / or goods to the civ.
     
  3. meldor

    meldor Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2002
    Messages:
    3,666
    Location:
    Tualatin, Or
    I wil sign up as an alternate if you can't get the others.
     
  4. Greebley

    Greebley Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2002
    Messages:
    9,264
    Location:
    Boston Area, MA
    I am interested in trying this again.
     
  5. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
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    The below is the list of players invited. The order of invitees was randomly determined. If I get at least 3 within 48 hours the game will start.
    Grimjack
    Greebley (confirmed)
    Microbe
    Gozpel

    Alternates:
    Kaiser_Berger
    Meldor (confirmed)
     
  6. microbe

    microbe Cascaded Mansion

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2003
    Messages:
    4,596
    confirmed.
     
  7. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    17,796
    This one WILL start. It is just a question of players.

    The below is the list of players invited. The order of invitees was randomly determined. If I get at least 3 within 48 hours the game will start.
    Grimjack
    Greebley (confirmed)
    Microbe (confirmed)
    Gozpel

    Alternates:
    Kaiser_Berger
    Meldor (confirmed)
     
  8. Doc Tsiolkovski

    Doc Tsiolkovski Deity

    Joined:
    May 4, 2003
    Messages:
    5,032
    Location:
    Köln, Cologne, Colonia. Finally.
    If you have room left, I would be interested in this one.
     
  9. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    17,796
    @Doc Tsiolkovski
    I will keep you in mind in case the other to invitees aren't interested.
     
  10. Kaiser_Berger

    Kaiser_Berger Terran Emporer

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2002
    Messages:
    1,478
    Location:
    UW-Stevens Point
    I'm available as an alternate if needed.
     
  11. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    17,796
    The below is the list of players invited. The order of invitees was randomly determined.
    Grimjack
    Greebley (confirmed)
    Microbe (confirmed)
    Gozpel

    Alternates:
    Kaiser_Berger (confirmed)
    Meldor (confirmed)

    We definitely have 5. I just need to give Grimjack and Gozpel the time to post interest.
     
  12. gozpel

    gozpel Couch-potato (fortified)

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2002
    Messages:
    4,374
    Location:
    Australia
    I almost missed this one.

    Confirmed and please put me last, only a couple of busy days left.
     
  13. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2001
    Messages:
    17,796
    Grimjack
    Greebley (confirmed)
    Microbe (confirmed)
    Gozpel (confirmed)

    Alternates:
    Kaiser_Berger (confirmed)
    Meldor - not needed as 4 confirmed above.
    I am know just waiting on Grimjack...
     
  14. meldor

    meldor Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2002
    Messages:
    3,666
    Location:
    Tualatin, Or
    Oh no, I have fallen off the end of the world.....
     
  15. hotrod0823

    hotrod0823 Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2001
    Messages:
    2,753
    Location:
    Connecticut
    Meldor - At least you make the lists
     
  16. meldor

    meldor Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2002
    Messages:
    3,666
    Location:
    Tualatin, Or
    I have made a lot of lists in my life and not all of them were good, ask the wife...
     
  17. LKendter

    LKendter Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    Difficulty = Deity
    Civilization = Spain
    Pangaea, 60%, warm, wet, 5 million
    No barbs
    World Size = Standard

    4000 BC
    Not much of a starting position with no obvious bonuses. I form Madrid where we stand. Of course the expanded borders have to show a wheat tile. :rolleyes:

    Our first science objective is Pottery. With the nearby wheat available we want a granary in that city.


    3250 BC
    Our first Civ to meet is the Zulu. Since Pottery is worthless to them, no trades happen. Our next research goal is writing.


    3150 BC
    We meet the Vikings whom have the exact same techs as the Zulu.
    (IT) I am shocked when the Vikings offer Warrior Code for Burial. I jump on the opportunity.


    2800 BC
    Barcelona is formed to claim the cow on a river site.


    2390 BC
    We meet the Dutch. No trades available and they have writing already when we are 18 turns away. :(


    2270 BC
    The Vikings just claimed the dyes near Barcelona and will overlap it culturally. :(


    ==========================

    Summary:

    Signed up:
    LKendter
    Greebley (currently playing)
    Microbe (on deck)
    Gozpel
    Kaiser_Berger


    Remember 10 turns per round - STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 to complete.
    Don't forget the variant rules listed in the first post.


    http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/LK82-2150BC.zip

    Our mediocre starting lands
     
  18. Greebley

    Greebley Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    9,264
    Location:
    Boston Area, MA
    Ok, I got it. Can likely play tonight.

    For town locations, I am thinking that 3 squares SE of Barcelona on the river bend would be the next spot assuming it isn't closer to the Vikings than Barcelona. It maximises being on the river by getting one more city along it.

    To the north I would build a town W-NW of the wheat and build a temple in 10 with a rush. [Edit: Do I recall correctly that Spain is religious?]
     
  19. Greebley

    Greebley Chieftain Supporter

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    9,264
    Location:
    Boston Area, MA
    Preturn: We can lower lux but not raise science. An odd condition, but I do it (if i raise science to 90 we get one less entertainment. Science 80, 10 entertainment works). We are at max research and positive gold at the same time.

    2030 BC: Need to raise Lux to 30% for Barcelona.

    The following idea won't work:
    I decide to work the forest in Barcelona. We grow in 7 and will build the granary in 6 after the chop, otherwise we grow in 5 granary in 10 after the chop. I believe the first is about the same in food (we get the +10 food earlier), and allows us to start start settler sooner.

    I keep forgetting that if I chop the forest I can't also continue to work it :rolleyes: Not sure why I have so much trouble with remembering that. Remembered in time this time.

    So Grow in 5, Granary in 15(10) it is. I think I can get Granary in 9 as the mine will compete. That will be perfect.

    1990 BC: Colossus completed by the Dutch in Amsterdam.
    Going for a Settler right away in Madrid.

    Hmm... I can lower lux if I put both defenders in Barcelona. I will do this. I should be able to get back in 2 turns which will be in time for my warriors to die defending the capitol if we are attacked.

    I lower science to keep us from running a deficit. Don't want to be negative and then have a demand come in.

    1950 BC: Chop gives us another BG. The warrior move allows me to lower lux from 30 to 10%.

    Not sure on what to research. Decide to try Philosophy. There is an outside chance of a free tech. If it fails we can try Lit and see if we get that at first. If it succeeds we can probably catch up in tech.

    1830 BC: We meet the Iroquois. We can get Bronze working for Cer Burial, 2gpt and 9 gold. I check and this is well below 1/2 to research BW so I do it.

    1750 BC: I see an American border just South of one of our Warriors.

    Notes:
    Philosophy is admittedly a long shot, but it isn't a high priority tech so more likely than most techs to have some trade value.

    Currently our science is lower than it will be as we are running high lux. It was initially 27 turns a turn ago. We should be able to get back on track when we build the first town.

    I notice we can get one of the two dyes with no overlap with the vikings. We have a chance for the spice too. I am not at all sure that grabbing the river spot is better than going for the Spice. I already moved the settler though. What do you all think? The river gives us more gold and it can borrow the cattle.

    I set our capitol to Barracks. Not sure if this is the best choice, but I would like to get a unit into the town and didn't want to build another non-vet.

    Somehow I saved with a warrior still with movement. This was an error. Move the guy before ending the turn. I didn't want to re-upload for one stinking warrior.
     
  20. Greebley

    Greebley Chieftain Supporter

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Boston Area, MA
    Here is our current empire and a dot map of how I would settle.
    Green grabs the river.
    Red grabs the Spice.
    Blue grabs the wheat
    Teal grabs the Dye.

    Note that blue and red are spacing 3 for mutual defense. We could also move them both NW for less overlap with the capitol.
     

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