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Lonely Hearts Club, BtS Edition, Chapter XXVI : Cyrus

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by r_rolo1, Aug 16, 2008.

  1. Wilhelmus

    Wilhelmus Chieftain

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2007
    Messages:
    57
    Reached checkpoint one 2850 BC.
    Monarch/Epic.
    Spoiler :
    I've taken on this challenge at Monarch level. I like to playu with raging barbs and aggressive AI, so I checked these options. The game speeed is Epic.
    000 - Settings.jpg

    I settled in place, and sent the sout northwest. There he found a hut and the vilagers taught me the wheel. A useful worker tech, and prerequisite for immortals and pottery.
    000 - The wheel from hut.jpg

    I started my research for animal husbandry (followed by mining and bronze working). I have a sheep to pasture, and like to learn about the presence of any horses. My initial build was a worker (followed by 2 warriors and a settler). Animal husbandry revealed horses in persepolis. I had a pleasant event when I received 11 beakers towards mining.
    021 - Tech breakthrough.jpg

    The worker improved the deer, sheep, and horses. When Persepolis reached size 4, I started production of a settler. I will be whipped for two pop before it passes 80/149:hammers:. I scouted the island, and finished my dotmap. I'm planning to move the palace more central, next to a river, and run bureaucracy. The current capitol and a city in the southwest (with 2 seafoods) will be my great person farms. In the south, with the two gems will probably be Oxford (or else in the capitol). To the east there will be a good production city. I have stone, so I dare building Moai statues on the ice island (hoping for some seafood there). Later on I will fill my island with the mediocre locations.
    046 - Dotmap.jpg

    I will try to build the great lighthouse in the capitol, and collect two great merchants, to lightbulb machinery and maybe guilds. The rest will be scientists for Oxford city.
     
  2. vicawoo

    vicawoo Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2007
    Messages:
    3,226
    Spoiler :
    Immortal/normal.
    Checkpoint 1
    I'm not too familiar with isolation starts, so I was guessing that wonderspamming would be worse than getting astronomy ASAP. Got great lighthouse and pyramids, lost great library, couldn't even start oracle. No chance of bulbing philosophy. I grew my seafood cities a little for coastal commerce, but in retrospect I think running rep scientists would have been much better. Settled great merchant helped my inland cottage cities a lot.

    Only roosevelt has a tech lead, but I've kept a monopoly on astronomy while trading to parity with everyone else. I decided not to get calendar and trade for it. Iron working, mathematics, currency, civil service, optics.

    Checkpoint 3
    Everyone's in mercantilism, so astronomy is kind of useless except for some resource trading. I could attack Peter or Roosevelt. Peter is weaker, but has bordering Boudica, who due to minimal army would have attacked me by now. Roosevelt has techs, but has been wonder spamming, and will likely run away with the tech lead if left unchecked.
     
  3. pawelo

    pawelo Emperor

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2007
    Messages:
    1,169
    Location:
    Québec, QC
    I'd say one thing to start : :mad::cry::whipped::nuke: MAP

    Anyway, Space on Monarch, AD 1993 :D
    Not glorious, anyway still something nice given the :mad::cry::whipped::nuke: MAP

    Spoiler :

    Full CE - obvious given the lack of food. I still managed a quite nice production.

    To spoil everything, you won't find OIL nor ALUMINIUM within your borders - just to make you :mad: abobe Monarch :lol:

    So, Perse settled in place and went Henge, Oracle for CoL and Mids. Secondary wonders went to Pasargardae - to the West on sheep/deer/stone.

    Susa - south of Perse on the river grass - got fully cottaged, Oxforded and West Streeted. It happened to be Confu HC too, which helps with a shrine on hand :)

    First I headed eco for CoL, Currency & Astro.

    I still got Liberalism for Printing Press (which given the number of village/town was a huge boost) at late XV century.
    On the foreign side, Peter & Boudi were sharing half/half the big island and their Buddha faith. Saladin & Roosy did the same on their smaller island with Hindu. Joao blocked Wang and they were both Tao. I managed to found Islam and got contaminated by Buddha, so FR was the only option to stay happy with everyone. Result - 3 religions everywhere (+Monastaries) and no war for the whole game long :king:

    Upon Democracy discovery, I revolted to US and went through a century of infra buying, getting Univ, Apoth, Market, Bank, Harb & Customs almost everywhere. When I set the research back on, I was +75% Research & +60% Wealth compared to before :D
    I think I'll keep it in mind - when not threatened, switch the research off and go happy rushing for a century or so.

    Afterwards, research went smoothly and though I missed two out of three happy wonders (getting only Hollywood), I got the Golden SpaceShip track : 3 Georges, Space Elevator, Internet. It somehow compensated the lack of ALUMINIUM :mad::p

    The ship was out well before my opponents, who managed to fight happily throughout the centuries.
    I said yes to all Tech/Tribute requests and no to all Cancel Deals and Join War. It paid, with some Infantries/Arties on the coast, even without Oil I stayed out of the conflict :D

    Small score of ~13K and Lincoln status - well below my offline JC Praetorian Domination on Emperor in 940 AD (Standard Pangea)... ;)

    Screenie of the last turn:




    Cheers and see ya for the next setting :)
    Pleasure to have played Cyrus again, though his traits are somehow underemployed here. As is the UU... :cry:
     
  4. dalamb

    dalamb Deity

    Joined:
    May 9, 2006
    Messages:
    3,160
    Location:
    Kingston, Ontario
    In these LHC games, how often are other civs galley-accessible? Unless there's something relatively nearby the UU isn't too useful except possibly against barbs, right?

    I may try the Noble save but only after the GOTM and NC XI (Catherine).
     
  5. semirami

    semirami The Wolf

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2007
    Messages:
    547
    Location:
    currently Thessaloniki, Greece
    Checkpoint 3+4 1889AD/ Domination victory

    Spoiler :
    Joao declared on Wang and he capitulated soon. Now Wang plays one city chalange. After few wars Boudica bribed Sal to join against Peter and he capitulated to her, but he still has decent empire. Sal strangely went for Scientific Method. So I was able to get this from Liberalism.



    Well war preparation next. Rifles and Trebs and beeline to Steel, so I can upgrade all trebs to cannons. Traded Scientific Method from Joao for Education+ something else that I dont remember. Bad news, we dont have oil. Too bad I'll lose GL and Parthenon, but I really want Communism, state property and the free spy. By the way I changed my mind and decided to attack Sal+FDR, instead of Joao. They are closer and Joao is getting powerfull. Early 17th century the war begins. I decided to attack FDR and Sal first until I still have tech advantage. FDR is easy target. Rifles versus longbows. The bastard Sal joined the fun against his true friend, he obviously wants to take something too. Few turns later FDR is no more and Sal managed to capture a city. Wait what is this? Rifles:eek: Yes Sal has protective rifles. I declared on him immediatelly, I still have cannons on him. It's going to be a difficult war. He has well defended empire. Sal bribed Joao to declare on me and he came with the impressive stack 2 carracks. He managed to land 2 trebs a knight and a rifle. I killed his units of course and made peace for 100 gold and his world map. Altough I had 40 cannons I very soon was short on them and was forced to make peace. Few turns later I redeclared with another 40 cannons. That was enough. The entrie continent is mine. Sal has a island city, close to Joao's teritory and I didnt want to bother, so I capitulated him. Hey Sal you are welcome to Wang's club:lol: OK Boudica/Peter are next. Altough she lacks many renneisance techs, she managed somehow to get Rifling too. I decided to avoid any troubles and set down a bit and research Assembly line. Wow Boudica is in WHEOOHRN mode. Is it Joao? No, they are friends, so it's me. Too bad for her she doesnt have Chemistry, altough she has huge army. The turn when AL was in the bag, she declared on me and came with 20 galeons. She is not that stupid and managed to land her impressive stack at the same turn, altough she is not very clever, becuase she decided to attack my Heroic epic city, which contains my stack. 108 units, cannons and rifles upgraded immediately to infantries. She decided to sacrifuce her stack with no loses and no WW for me. My frigates and ironclads of course killed her naval stack. Well it's time to invide her. She has 15 cities and Peter has 5. She really has a huge army. Sometimes 30 infantries were not enoug to capture a city in 1 turn, just because she has more units defending it. Peter soon broke free. He settled the crappy island in my teritory. I capitulated him. Welocme to the Sal's Wang's club. The war with Boudica continued. Later I upgraded all cannons to artilery, not because I need, but because i can. Industrialism was the last tech and there isn't aluminium on our island. Not that I need it. Late 19th century, Boudica has 1 city left. Welcome to the club:lol: But before I can vassal her a border pop gave me Domination victory.



    75k, not the best score ever, but not bad.



    Great game, I really enjoyed. Thanks Rolo for hosting. As allways it was interesting and challenging game.

     
  6. Single Malt

    Single Malt Prince

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2008
    Messages:
    349
    Location:
    Ireland
    I just finished NC Catherine (first victory on noble:)), and found this earlier today and had to give a go. I didn't heed the checkpoints (sorry). Interesting map. Its noble difficulty, marathon speed, to 1305AD.
    Spoiler :
    I settled 1 south of start if I can remember correctly, so as to have max land but still coastal. Teched AH first for the sheep while building a worker, all the while my soldier scouted for the next city site. When AH done horses appeared in BFC, so the wheel was next. When the worker was finished I went for a barracks to build up pop and my worker hooked up the sheep and horses in that order. Alternating builds of worker and immortal followed, then after three of each a settler was queued. My next city site was to be south for gems. Tech wise I went mining, BW, masonry (for stone), mysticism, IW (jungle gems) pottery (food poor island - cottage spam), fishing, sailing, maths, economics, CoL (founded confuc)...(don't remember rest, beelined the reqs for caravels). I built the GW in that time too (was lucky as I started late). I also attempted the pyramids, statue of Zeus and stonehenge, but that was only cos I couldn't build anything else (no need for a military build up until other civs were discovered, especially if they didn't have astro), I wanted the coins from failed wonder build to boost my treasury.

    As soon as caravel was built I went exploring, met Peter and his master Boudica to the east, further east was Joao and his vassal Wan Kon (who had only two cities to his name), and to my west was Saladin and Roosevelt.

    The spread of religions was buddist for peter and Boudica, Joao/Wan later were taoists and Saladin/FDR were hindu. Thats bad - my next tech research will be astro, and hope some religions come my way so I can choose sides (fingers crossed for hinduism, as Peter/Boudica are cramping my style (peter keeps demanding tribute, despite he cannot hurt me without astro). I did a bit of tech trading. I don't remember exact trades, but i acquired construction, paper and machinery among others. Wan offered to trade world maps, I then bought map off Boudica (Peter wasted CoL and 120 gold) for 50 gold, and FDR for 45 gold, and then sold my maps for 120 - 180 (bar the scabby git Joao who gave 80:mad:, he is on my invade list). Now I am building an army of maces, xbows, and cats, in anticipation of astro and the coming conflict.

    some pics:
    My empire year 1305 AD


    My capital


    My opponents


    The power graph


    The tech situation


    Overall my situation doesn't look too bad, but violence is called for. Personally I would attack Peter first, but I need to see where the best land is and go from there.
     

    Attached Files:

  7. IPEX-731BA5DD06

    IPEX-731BA5DD06 Deity

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2005
    Messages:
    2,717
    Location:
    Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
    I must say, Thanks Rolo...Really Thankyou....:gripe:,:evil:

    Spoiler :
    F'n ROLO, if I ever get a hold of his Scrawny neck.....:gripe::crazyeye::sad:

    :lol:, I'm joking...ok...I first consider the water in BFC, and decide to move the capital inland to the Plains hill...and what do I get, water on the other side...OMFG....explored the Island and this is what I've found



    And to take a page out of Obsolete's Novel, "the games already won, I have 6 city sites planned out ;)
    :lol: Nah...I'm really going to struggle here, I shot my self by moving the capital. I could squeeze in two more cities..I'll have a look post bronze working. Oh yeah, need fishing for those exploring work boats.
     
  8. KaytieKat

    KaytieKat King

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2007
    Messages:
    999
    Hi

    Noble, Marathon, 830 AD checkpoint 1 land all explored and settled but havent met other AI's yet.

    Spoiler :
    Getting land settled didnt seem to diff. Goodie huts were mix of good and bad. Got mining from one then map form another and last goody hut after land had all been explored was a scout. not the best thing to get but he helped with fogbusting. Barbies werent a problem just 1 warrior and 1 archer and 1 galley before fog got all busted.

    I managed to get 11 cities done.





    Not sure how wise these locations are but best I could do.

    I'm made the little island east of my cap my maui statues city. I managed to get Mids, GLH, and even got great library built in city in center that has room for tons of cottages.

    oracle and hg were built before I even tried for em and lost collosus by 14 turns :(. But at least it gave me a ton of gold so I run slider at deficet now for awhile.

    demo at this point:



    My rankings all seem semi decent considering the isolation but I am thinking I am getting out teched. So that might be a problem once I met the other AI's.

    Good news there been some GG's popping now and then so hopefully they wont all be one big happy fam when I do. A gp popped at some point somewhere then chritianity got founded so that means AP will be a pain at some point I bet.

    Not sure what to do really at this point. Going for engineering to get notre dame and then boosts from castles then tech towards guilds for UU and in between get optics for whales and to do exploring. NOOOO clue as to what type of victory to go for.

    Kaytie
     
  9. Snapman

    Snapman Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2007
    Messages:
    46
    Monarch/Epic Checkpoint 1

    Spoiler :
    Man, I ain't liking this land at all. What's with all the sheep and silk? I'm not a fan of either of those resources.

    Anyway, I settled in place, played until Turn 61 (whihc is 2475BC or something like that...), having settled my second city next to the river due south of the capital, 1NW of the silk next to the mountain. Will probably cottage that. I really wanted to settle on one of the stone resources to quickly knock out Stonehenge, but either location would leave me with an awful second city, so I quickly knocked that idea on the head. I may still have a crack at Stonehenge without the stone hooked up - the capital has just about got enough early food and hammers (yay, Horses) to justify having a crack at it. Besides, I quite like to settle Great Prophets, and I probably won't be going for Oracle on this.

    The problem is that most cities will be terrible until Civil Service or even Biology. There's a good location near the gems for cottaging, and the fish and clam could be used as a GP Farm of sorts. The rest... I'm less enthusiastic about. Also, the lack of seafood tiles means I'm reluctant to build the Great Lighthouse, even though I love it in isolation, mainly because I probably won't have enough coastal towns to justify it.

    Can't really justify Pyramids on this map either, even with stone.

    Early tech path went: Mining > BW > AH > Mysticism. Next I'll go Wheel > Pottery > probably Writing.

    From the goody huts I got 114 gold (nice), and an utterly useless map (not so nice). The other one remains unopened, waiting for the capital to pop it's borders.


    Checkpoint 2, 1000 AD
    Spoiler :
    Started teching quite well. Cottage spammed Pasargadae and Ecbatana while using the capital as my main production city. Pleased, except that I messed up the placement of Gardium, but I can deal with it. The discovery of iron, crab and whale around the small north-east island was a pleasant surprise, so I founded Tarsus there and made it my Moai Statues city. I've currently got 7 cities in total, but I can probably cram another 2 in.

    Anyway, interesting map. It seems to be 4 continents, with 2 civs sharing 3 of them, then good old Lonely Cyrus, cast out on his own. I've actually kinda messed up my diplomatic relations here, after I traded too eagerly with Roosevelt, only to discover the more powerful Saladin was his worst enemy and was kinda hacked off at me. Likewise with Peter - his score was so low that I figured he must also be isolated, but no. He's at war with Boudica, who now hates me. On the final continent, Joao and Wang Kon are getting along fine with their Buddhist love-in. Joao is in the points lead at the moment, with myself coming in at a close second.

    Tech-wise, I'm well ahead and Liberalism is in the bag. Roosevelt was kind enough to help me back-fill most techs, and I got Engineering off Wang Kon, which was nice. As soon as I can get Vassalage from somebody, I'll research Guilds to get the UB and also an extra hammer to make workshops worthwhile to build. Other than that, I guess I'll head for Liberalism, make a quick detour for Printing Press, and will probably take Astronomy as my prize.

    Wonder-wise, I built three. The first was Stonehenge, which is a favourite of mine if I'm not a creative leader. Didn't have stone hooked up so, did some intense chopping to get that one out quickly on turn 79 in Persepolis. Even though I stated in checkpoint 1 that I'd forgoe Great Lighthouse this time, a border pop revealing the crab on north-east island convinced me otherwise. Completed it in Persepolis on turn 131. Should get some good trade-route income as soon as Astronomy kicks in, and with the stone and Engineering that I got from Wang Kon, cheap Castles should enhance this for a while. Finally on turn 220 (700 AD), the Great Library was built - also in Persepolis.

    As far as victories, diplomatic is unlikely, as is culture, and considering I'm not the best warmonger, domination probably won't happen. Although I may try and earn points with Boudica by giving Peter a kicking at some point (and hopefully grab some more land in the process). So it seems like ye olde bog-standard Space Race victory looks the most likely.
     
  10. Single Malt

    Single Malt Prince

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2008
    Messages:
    349
    Location:
    Ireland
    My last attempt ended in disaster:
    Spoiler :
    Joao DoW me as the majority of my troops were off the Arabian coast 1 turn from invasion:mad: He used a massive stack of trebs, maces and knights, when I had a token few cats and macemen.

    I may have issues reloading a save game, but none starting from scratch, so we have:
    Take 2, this time more structured. Again noble, marathon, to 1970 BC.

    Spoiler :
    The screenshot everyone has already seen:


    Dotmap


    First tech I have gone for was AH, while building a worker. AH finished shortly before worker, who went to work on the sheep, next research was the Wheel, so as to hook up the horses in the BFC. Barracks was the next build (this was to raise the pop). BW was then beelined. As BW was in progress I find out the Russians were destroyed

    Not good 1 civ now has ample opportunity to expand. I chopped/whipped 2 settlers in about 10 turns, (2 forests, 2 pop whip, 2nd settler finished 2 turns no growth), and here is the state of empire at 1970 BC

    Three cities, several fogbusting immortals (being) built. Hopefully my midgame will be stronger than the last, and I can aggressivly ReX somewhere else.
     
  11. oyzar

    oyzar Have quit civ/forums

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2006
    Messages:
    6,923
    Location:
    Norway
    immortal / normal checkpoint 1
    Spoiler :
    played 20 turns, popped wheel then some gold then HBR(soo good in isolation.. not), revealed island. Space for 6 cities at least, maybe some more filler cities, probably won't get the GLH in time(want to optimze imperialistic) and as such i doubt it'll go late enough for me to get it. the double fish city and the capital will generate great people, the 3 other marked cities will work tons of cottages, probably place a production city up with the deer and all the hills. Not sure if i'll go for much wonders. As i have stone maybe i'll get the later stone ones. Probably get GL in capital even though i don't have marble... Tech path AH -> mining -> BW then probably myst or something.
     

    Attached Files:

  12. Negator_UK

    Negator_UK King

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2007
    Messages:
    758
    Hi all.

    Better late than never (except with the cardio kit).

    When I loaded the WB save I didn't get the picture r_rolo1 posted, but slightly different

    Spoiler :


    After initial expansion, my island plans looked like this


    - note belated / frantic realisation I could build wonder since I had stone !!
     

    Attached Files:

  13. r_rolo1

    r_rolo1 King of myself

    Joined:
    May 19, 2006
    Messages:
    13,818
    Location:
    Lisbon, Portugal
    Negator.....

    Spoiler pls ;)
     
  14. Negator_UK

    Negator_UK King

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2007
    Messages:
    758
    My.. you were quick, but... Sorry :).... When I post pictures I have to do it quickly or else civfanatics locks me out until I reset my modem and wait a while. I realised my mistake as soon as I uploaded, but it means a half hour wait after that....

    This is also the reason my reports tend to be a bit um.. terse.. If there's anything you think is missing from them just holler...
     
  15. Lord Chambers

    Lord Chambers King

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2001
    Messages:
    999
    Why no emperor start?
     
  16. r_rolo1

    r_rolo1 King of myself

    Joined:
    May 19, 2006
    Messages:
    13,818
    Location:
    Lisbon, Portugal
    Do you want one? I can make it...
     
  17. vicawoo

    vicawoo Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2007
    Messages:
    3,226
    I think it's better to save the huts as long as possible, in the off chance of popping a big tech.
     
  18. Lord Chambers

    Lord Chambers King

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2001
    Messages:
    999
    Nah, I just went with Immortal. There is a difference between AI starting units/tech on Emperor and Monarch though, correct?

    Checkpoint 1.5
    Spoiler :

    The blow of such a ****** start was ameliorated by reading a bit of the first post, and then after exploring I found it was a pretty decent start. All things considered, decent and mediocre don't make a game unwinnable.

    In the screenshot below you can see my dotmap. I took the screenshot because of the occurrence which seems to typify the completely broken random number generator in my game.

    First it was losing a warrior on a forested hill to a barbarian warrior (1.2% odds), second it was losing a warrior on a forested plains to a barbarian warrior the very next turn (11% odds). Third, soon after I sprung silver in my capital, which completely made up for the lost warriors. Then the Great Lighthouse popped a Merchant at less than 20% odds, sort of four. This Merchant screwed up my plans of bulbing Philosophy and using Taoism and Pacifism to blow my way through Astronomy and onto Liberalism. I persevered and used my next Great Scientist to found Taoism anyway. But the RNG was displeased. Number five. He knew that like 99% of the time it should get founded in one of my size 1 cities. In an attempt to fux with me he puts in in the best candidate for Wall Street (the city with most cottage potential, which I settled my Merchant in). Now, it's not like I'm ever going to build a shrine, so this isn't good news, it's just random. Number six. I pop a Great Merchant at about 10% odds, which is keeping me from the second Scientist I need to fully bulb Astronomy about 900 AD. Seven. I pop another Great Merchant at about 10% odds. What the . .. .. .. .. It's 1070 AD and I'm getting pissed. I've got 3 Great Merchants and 2 Great Scientists. The odds of getting five Great Scientists? 64.8%. The odds of getting 3 Great Merchants. .2% You're more likely to lose a warrior on a forested hill to another warrior.

    It now taking me 10 more turns (standard) to generate my next great person. I could have had Astronomy years ago but instead I'm throwing beakers into techs I can trade for because I can't finish Civil Service and Paper so my next Scientists (which I could already have right now) can bulb Education.

    Anyway, since I have the capital with National Epic, Great Library, and can run 3 Scientists under Pacifism I'm generating lots of GPPs per turn. Since it's a steady rate I plan to self-research/bulb Printing Press, and either self-research or trade for Gunpowder & Engineering so I can use Liberalism for Chemistry. I've never used Privateers seriously before, so that might be fun.

    Good case scenario, bulb Steel with Liberalism. Research Nationalism and hit the high seas with Cannons and drafted Musketmen.

    Better case scenario, discover backwards AIs around the world, and start directing my self-research towards Banking. Use Liberalism for Replaceable Parts, trade for Nationalism, and wrap it up by researching Rifling and drafing Riflemen.

    Best case scenario, finish exploring and discover everyone has Longbows and Musketmen. Take Military Tradition with Liberalism, get started with Cuirassers while undertaking the arduous trek to Rifling for Cavalry to finish domination. If it weren't for Replaceable Parts requiring Banking I would probably finish most games without Guilds.
     
  19. semirami

    semirami The Wolf

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2007
    Messages:
    547
    Location:
    currently Thessaloniki, Greece
    The Monarch save is OK for Emperor. Each level starts with correct number starting units. And because Archery is added they will start with x number archers on Monarch and y number archers on Emperor. And there isnt a difference with starting techs. On both levels AIs start with Archery only.
     
  20. Snapman

    Snapman Chieftain

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2007
    Messages:
    46
    Checkpoint 3 + 4, Monarch/Epic
    Spoiler :
    Won the Space Race in January 1981. Eh, turned out to be not so exciting in the end. Focussed on research, tech traded with Joao and Wang Kon, built up my army enough to deter any would-be invaders. 1981 is my worst effort yet with the Space Race, but a victory is a victory. Probably would have been quicker if I'd had access to aluminium, but those Laboratories and Space Elevator helped out.

    In future I'll probably start turning Space Race victories off.
     

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