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Looks like the AI is still poor in Rise and Fall.

Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by Xaviarlol, Jan 15, 2018.

  1. FairFenix

    FairFenix Chieftain

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    Yes, but the introduction of more cartoony characters together with already cartoony art style made me worried that the game will deflect in the wrong direction. Ages and governors make the game more rpg than competition. But it might be only my perception
     
    ZubieMaster and Tiger Genocide like this.
  2. Disgustipated

    Disgustipated Deity

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    You bring up a good point. We don't want the AI to become even more timid than it already is. Will the AI try to conquer cities? I'm guessing they will continue to try to conquer cities at least as much as mentioned in post #40 autoplay. Because I suspect they won't be able to see what the city loyalty will be until after they gain possession of it. What I worry is after they take the city, they will quickly lose it due to loyalty problems. But still, I have seen the AI use governors in the envoy game (the diplomatic governor), I am reasonably confident they can use them to shore up loyalty. Of course, the AI may choose to value envoys over losing a city. The AI places huge value in city state suzerains.
     
  3. omega4

    omega4 Chieftain

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    Sounds like some gamers (or Firaxis employees?) are willing to let the devs get away with an incompetent AI (and expecting the modder community to do the dev's jobs for them).

    Glad I'm not one of those gamers. Based on your post, I will no longer buy any more Civ6 products and will simply wait for the completed game to be released / fixed / patched / modded in 2 years' time.
     
    Zuizgond likes this.
  4. CPWimmer

    CPWimmer King

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    Are there instructions posted somewhere on how to create an AI only game?

    And has anyone tried one, with any mod that reduces war weariness and warmonger penalties? (These seem to me to be one of the limiting factors on the AI aggressiveness.)
     
  5. earlc

    earlc Warlord

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    You don't seem to be comprehending what your own statement means. If you want to "hold them to a higher standard", all you can do is not purchase future releases. And of course that isn't guaranteed to have any effect because clearly there are a lot more variables than just wanting more strategic combat AI. But complaining about it on some forums doesn't hold anyone to anything, and I've explained why that's the case.
     
  6. pietro1990

    pietro1990 Prince

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    I did AI declares war on modern era. However it sometimes atacks with corpses of knights or other medieval renaissance units

    https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=877852279
     
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  7. PYITE

    PYITE Prince

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    https://forums.civfanatics.com/resources/autoplay.25735/

    It’s easy to get the AI to declare war/be more aggressive in any era using mods, the hard part is getting the attack to be successful.
     
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  8. Thormodr

    Thormodr Servant of Civ Supporter

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    Cartoony style worked for cIV and it is a fantastic game. The best of the series.
     
  9. ashendashin

    ashendashin King

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    That's IF they eventually release the DLL like they did with civ 5 after they were done milking expansions. You act like civ 5 immediately started with full proper modding support. Vox Populi wouldn't even exist if Whoward didn't set up the DLL first.
    So assuming people are still interested in years of work after getting ignored by Firaxis in favor of fluff mods that can't properly fix the game without DLL access, then maybe it will get a much needed overhaul.
    Basically we have to hope that Firaxis will at least be decent enough to let their fans fix the game after they get their cash again (which they're certain to get with their marketing). Doesn't help that TakeTwo doesn't seem to like modders.
     
  10. Thormodr

    Thormodr Servant of Civ Supporter

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    I am sure they will release what is necessary for modders just like they have always done.

    A healthy modding community helps their bottom line, as well.

    Once the game is feature complete, the code will be released.
     
  11. pgm123

    pgm123 Emperor

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    I think people really read way too much into the art style. A stylized look holds up better over time than attempts at "realism." Look at the toys vs. people in the first Toy Story.
     
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  12. TheMeInTeam

    TheMeInTeam Top Logic

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    Current BNW still has serious problems, and many of those carried over into Civ 6 and got worse. A few are even older than Civ 5. It's not reasonable to expect these particular things to improve. They've had the better part of a decade (longer in some cases) and it hasn't.

    In UI and performance the game has consistently regressed since Civ 4. Improvements to some mechanics don't overpower this. Civ 6 UI is still in alpha, though modders have helped it out a bit.
     
  13. CPWimmer

    CPWimmer King

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    Thanks for posting that link.

    I finally ran my own AI Battle Royal with one of the Warmonger reduction Mods and no barbarians. I was using the Firaxis supplied Earth Map with 2 extra Civs added to make things a bit tighter. Wow, talk about a depressing and eventually boring 2.5 hours.:cry:

    About 1/4 of the city states were taken out, but I'm pretty sure only before walls. Not a single Civ lost a city. No siege towers or battering rams were deployed. No sustained offensives could be brought forth. Wars were at least somewhat more plentiful, even later in the game, than I feared they would be, and I did see a few bombers used (but only against a few units - never to attack a city), which was a blessing near the end of this charade. However, overall I was really disappointed, even with all of the doom and gloom out there, I hadn't truly fathomed how horrendous the basic city siege combat AI really is at this point.:shake:

    Eventually someone stumbled into a Science Victory, after 1/2 the space ports were disabled by spies and never repaired, but a half way competent human with a handful of spies would have been able to stop that, apparently. So how exactly do people lose this game? AI Religious Victories are nearly impossible except on Pangaea; Spaceports remain pillaged long after your spies move on to the next Civ who tries to get ahead, and Domination is clearly a joke for the AI. I guess that just leaves Culture as a ticking time bomb you have to race against.

    I almost wondered if i should try it again with Barbarians turned on, so there might be a weakling out there who fell behind due to bad luck that someone might then prey upon - but instead i uninstalled the Autoplay Mod. Time to bury my head in the sand, and keep believing that I am an uber-player tactical genius and just keep on trucking ahead in my little sand-box. I always did like Simcity...


    tl;dr - The AI proved to me that it still blows chunks. :vomit:
    However, I will attempt to return to my happy little dream world and continue to enjoy Civ 6 wishing I was still having the delusions of grandeur I had when I woke up this morning.
     
    Zuizgond, HF22, ZubieMaster and 3 others like this.
  14. FairFenix

    FairFenix Chieftain

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    I don't talk about myself but I think overreacting is something that loyal players and modders have right to do. They have also put a soul in it.

    And if casual players are ok with current state of AI, it is because they are unaware of its shallowness. I would seriously recommend everybody, trying multiplayer at least once
     
  15. Sagax

    Sagax Emperor

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    Multiplayer is a can of worms on its own. It neutralizes the AI issue, but in exchange it shows how out of whack the game balance is in other aspects. There’s a reason why people ban Sumeria, Scythia and Aztec in MP.
     
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  16. PYITE

    PYITE Prince

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    If you are willing to give autoplay another chance, try it with my AI improvement mod. It makes the AI blow smaller chunks.

    https://forums.civfanatics.com/resources/civ-flavor-deity.26561/

    The AI performs a lot better when you select new world age and abundant resources from advanced options as well.
     
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  17. Thormodr

    Thormodr Servant of Civ Supporter

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    Meh. There are already ages in the game. I like the idea that they are fleshing it out a bit. The governors don’t seem like rpg, to me. If anything, they feel like a portable district.

    I like the cartoony style as it is more like cIV, which is the best game of the series. Cartoony ages well. Realistic does not.
     
  18. FairFenix

    FairFenix Chieftain

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    The game is already highly enjoyable, and modding community is thriving, but I don't know, better watch some gameplay videos before buying, instead of reading forum responses.
     
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  19. sonicmyst

    sonicmyst Emperor

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    Can someone try another all AI autoplay with abundant resources and using a map with less hills/mountains?

    Just to confirm my theory that AI is hampered by two things: lack of resources and tactics due to pathing.
     
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  20. liv

    liv Emperor

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    In the quill Cree play through the new India attached with war elephants and a crossbow. They attacked his most defended city with wall, Magnus and an Encampment and just had their elephants killed off partly by banging them into the encampment while being shot at. It was not a promising sign if we are looking for better AI, I think that was Immortal difficulty.
     

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