[GS] Loyalty, pillaging, & City defences

[lindsay40k]

So I’m playing as Mapuche and, having faced off a failed invasion, I’m attacking a city with defence in the 70s. Pretty daunting with crossbows, so I just set my Malon raiders on the districts and improvements. As I’m pillaging, I notice the Mapuche loyalty attack ability taking effect, and also I see the city’s defence falling. It went down to low 50s and I took it with ease. Never noticed this before, what’s the mechanism of action here?

 

[Naeshar]

Mapuche pillaging ability lowers the current loyalty of the city. I don't know if loyalty has any effect on city defences, but when you pillage districts, city defense might change. Since building a district adds some +3 city strength, I expect it loses this when pillaged. Religion also adds some strength and there might be some in the amenities or lack of them.
No idea how could you lower city defense by 20+ points.

 

[MrRadar]

Specialty districts add to the city's combat strength a bit. However, damaged districts add CS penalty. By pillaging them, you lower city's CS. You can see the modifiers applied when you target the city center with some unit's ranged or melee attack.

 

[Tech Osen]

Specialty districts add to the city's combat strength a bit. However, damaged districts add CS penalty. By pillaging them, you lower city's CS. You can see the modifiers applied when you target the city center with some unit's ranged or melee attack.

Why didn't I know this...

 

[TheMarshmallowBear]

Why didn't I know this...

This just made pillaging even more powerful!

 

[DanQuayle]

The damaged district CS penalty modifier is linked to city health (-1 to -10CS) just like the damaged unit CS penalty modifier is linked to a combat unit's health (also -1 to -10CS).

 

[MrRadar]

Why didn't I know this...

Well, what I said wasn't exactly correct, now that I re-checked.
Districts do add +2 CS, and when you pillage the district itself, after all the buildings, this +2 goes away, like in the spoilered screenshots:

Spoiler :

Before HS is pillaged:

After HS is pillaged:

For CS penalty to be applied you must start damaging the City Centre itself (and, probably Encampement, if there is one).

Now for the OP's case, ~20 cs drop seems too much to pin it on pillaged districts alone.
Maybe AI had a unit inside and then moved it away?

 

[lindsay40k]

Full situation as far as I recall:

City had a Mamluk in it, IIRC un damaged

City had two well developed land districts that had three pillages in them - holy site and prooobably campus

City had a one tile bay with a harbour that had two pillages in it

My army was Malon Raiders, Crossbows, GG, Musketman, Knight

I had Akkad onside, I’d converted the city by having a Debater with me, I was in a heroic age, don’t think he was in a GA

Saladin wasn’t negotiating so I moved on the city, with D75ish I thought, I’m not taking it, but I’ll cripple it with my Malons and max the rewards with Raid policy. As I feasted on his districts (and mines etc), I kept seeing ‘-5 loyalty’ pop up and the city defence falling to low 50’s. I *think* it might have been -2 per raid, with an unreliable updating that *may* have caused it to be like ‘-2 -2 0 -4 -2’ etc, which tallies with the pillage rule mentioned above and makes the loyalty debuff incidental

Easy prey, but raised so many questions!

 

[Tech Osen]

Well, what I said wasn't exactly correct, now that I re-checked.
Districts do add +2 CS, and when you pillage the district itself, after all the buildings, this +2 goes away

I knew districts added to a city's CS, I just never realised that pillaging would take away that bonus. I was never a big fan of pillaging because of having to repair everything once conquered.