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Mad Monty

Discussion in 'Civ4 - General Discussions' started by capnvonbaron, Aug 29, 2009.

  1. Xellos-_^

    Xellos-_^ Prince

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    just make sure they both have different religions. monty will invade shaka and shaka will return the favor :D
     
  2. Yared

    Yared That Guy

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    It's called "warmonger respect" I think.
     
  3. Silu

    Silu Deity

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    ^ Blitzkrieg

    It's usually pretty obvious which city the enemy aims to get first; the closest to them. So I guess what he's trying to say is: settle the city closest to them on a hill and build Walls in it.

    If they for some reason talk to you before the stack arrives, you can often even ask what this city is by asking for peace, as the city they ask for peace is the one they are trying to get.
     
  4. mariogreymist

    mariogreymist Deity

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    This is what I meant. It obviously should be a heavily armed city; the attack is coming. Up to the prince level, you really don't even need it to be on a hill (though it's highly preferable). It's best if it's a point where the early exploration of your aggressive neighbor would see it protects lots of open land (which you will fill in, of course).

    I have yet to be in this situation in a monarch game, and I probably wouldn't try it without a hill at that level. And it's not an excuse to not build an army...you just focus your army on the one spot you can count on your enemy to attack. I primarily like this versus Alex, as it is generally more efficient to attack earlier if you can. Alex is a tough nut to crack without Maces (for me anyway) so I plan my attack for later.

    Below is an early image from a prince level game (me playing portugal, Alex is my only neighbor on the landmass). I have established a city which I know Alex will attack. It's not on a hill, but it is on the coast, with mountains nearby and lots of one-wide paths up north that he won't use, and which would take so long I could regarrison my whole army before his SoD got anywhare near me. I probably should have named the city Thermopylae, just to taunt the Greeks. He would try to take this city (he already failed twice by this point) three times. The last time being right as I was able to build maces, and I whipped an army and began my attack as soon as his failed. I took everything east of, and including Athens (Which was a beautiful, fully developed cottage town when I took it). I then had an attack dog late in the game which I could use to whatever effect I chose.

     
  5. blitzkrieg1980

    blitzkrieg1980 Octobrist

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    Nice strategy! On monarch, though, I could see the other continent being vastly more tech advanced (being that warfare was a major focus, big expansion, and needing optics to trade techs). Unless, of course, they have been at each others throats the whole time ;)
     
  6. mariogreymist

    mariogreymist Deity

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    In that game, I got lucky and the other continent was far more warlike than my own. Monty, Hannibal, Julius Caesar and the Burger King were effectively holding each other back, though when Hannibal got the upper hand I had to go in and wipe out his productive capacity...but that is millennia in the future of the image.
     
  7. blitzkrieg1980

    blitzkrieg1980 Octobrist

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    Good stuff. I'll be employing the city-bait tactic in my next violent-neighbor game.
     
  8. mariogreymist

    mariogreymist Deity

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    The trick is timing your invasion right, so that your army is advanced enough to take what you want but early enough that your opponent is just on the verge of being very dangerous. Once they are your vassal, you can give them what tech they need to make good (tough) fodder for a coming war against another opponent. Generally this involves giving away some military secrets that other civs will want too, so I use it as an opportunity to shop around to see what I can get for Civil Service and Machinery before I give maces to my vassal.

    Fighting a total war (eradication vs subjugation) at this point in history too long and economically damaging a process, for reasons you stated above. So Capitulation should be the goal imo. Another thing: I've found I need to capture a capital before these guys will capitulate. And that's fine, because capitals tend to be very strong cities, and I want their best land. All they'll need from here out is a few production cities, and I can give them whatever tech they really need to serve my purposes.

    Edit: for tech considerations - Maces should be prioritized over longbows. Maces + Catapults own longbows.
     
  9. blitzkrieg1980

    blitzkrieg1980 Octobrist

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    It's a rare thing that I'll have machinery, civil service, AND feudalism with my target having none. I consider that level-up time.

    The rest of my strats, I'll stick to. But the idea of a bait-city is pretty cool. Will implement
     
  10. mariogreymist

    mariogreymist Deity

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    Usually the opponent will have feudalism, and I will be about to develop it myself. Maybe it is level up time for me, but the way I get there does involve some pretty significant sacrifices in terms of REX. I build fewer, better cities to get there, knowing that several good cities my aggressive neighbor is building will be mine in time to build universities, banks etc.

    Besides, it's sort of the whole reason for the bait...he'll focus on building units to kill the city, I'll focus on tech and build just enough units that he never succeeds. Maybe i'm just a tech whore.

    And enjoy the strat, for whatever purpose you deploy it.
     

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