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Making a Transition from SE to CE

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by LoopyLewis, Sep 18, 2007.

  1. LoopyLewis

    LoopyLewis Warlord

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    UK, Sunny Southport
    Hi everyone

    I heard somewhere on the forums that a specialist economy is good in the beginning of the game, but the cottage economy becomes better towards the end of the game. My question is, can it be possible to develope a SE at the beginning of the game and then change to a CE and so benefit from both?

    I'm a little confused with the Hybrid Economy theory but I don't think it's what I'm thinking of here (I thought a Hybrid Economy has a mix of both SE and CE?). To make it clear, what I have in mind is a SE which turns into a CE somewhere in the middle of the game (probably after democracy - when you get the 100% growth of cottages civic) and not a mix of the two throughout the game.

    Now I know it will literally be possible to do this, but I was wondering if you think the benefits will pay off? Has anyone else tried this? Do you have any tips? Btw, I play on Noble at normal speed, if you need to know.

    Thanks in advance :)
     
  2. Winston Hughes

    Winston Hughes Wrathful Warlock Retired Moderator

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    Yep, I've done this many times - usually when playing aggressively.

    In my experience food is the key to early warmongering (for whipping and working mines), so I'll be planting farms rather than cottages early on, and using bursts of scientist-powered research to keep up in tech. I'll always cottage at least one city to pay the bills, though.

    Most of my targets will have built some cottages, and as time goes on I'll switch from planting farms to building more cottages, keeping my earlier cities as GP-farms or production centres. As the cottages start to mature, usually post-Democracy, I'll start switching from scientists to merchants in the specialist cities, so as to keep the science slider as high as possible.

    ps. I see Southport is as sunny as ever atm:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/5day.shtml?id=3188

    ;)
     
  3. LoopyLewis

    LoopyLewis Warlord

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    So it is possible then. Do you only do it as you're conquering more cities or can you do it if you're not? Would you do it if you were at peace?

    Lol, the BBC actually got the weather wrong! There's a break in the clouds atm and I can see the sun (for once :crazyeye: ) don't think it'll last long though
     
  4. oyzar

    oyzar Have quit civ/forums

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    there are done at least one succession game on transition economy. Change around the time of lib/printing press/democracy cause emancipation/free speech and printing press cottages become way better as well as lightbulbs losing some of their effectivnes. I have done this to great effect myself. I think it was futurehermit who started posting most about this.
     
  5. UncleJJ

    UncleJJ Deity

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    It can be done and it can be the best thing to do in some circumstances but it is not something a SE should always do. A well run SE is just as good as a CE in the late game and a hybrid is usually superior to both. Whether it's worthwhile depends on your leader and situation in the game (geography and other civs)

    It is probably best to do the transition if you're going for a Space race victory (which is dependent on research speed) but less good if you intend on going for Domination (needs Police State and production) or Diplomatic (needs population). Also if you have a Philosophical leader it is probably best to stick with farms and specialists and emphasise Biology and food sources.

    I suggest you try in a game when you decide to go for a Space or maybe Cultural victory, and see if you like the result but don't feel obligated to do it in many games.
     
  6. Winston Hughes

    Winston Hughes Wrathful Warlock Retired Moderator

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    If the conditions called for it I would make the switch in a more peaceful game (I've done it once or twice to nail a space race win).

    But more often it's in games where I've run an SE to facilitate a few speedy conquests, and find myself with a load of captured villages/towns and (perhaps more importantly) workers.

    Incidently, I never make a 100% switch from SE to CE, since I'll always leave a few of my earlier cities running specialists. What I end up with is really a cottage-heavy hybrid.

    And, generally, I won't replace existing improvements unless the city in question is more suited to a different long-term role (eg. an early specialist city can often become a production monster later on if you replace some farms with watermills or workshops; similarly, some cities cry out for cottages, and others have too much food to be anything but a GP-farm). For the most part the transition involves building cottages on tiles that were previously unimproved.
     
  7. Snaaty

    Snaaty Deity

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    I still play mainly warlords, and lately I found myself more or less always doing the FE -> CE switch, regareless of space race or conquest, around 500 - 1000 AD (after or during expanison war), because I think now that in most cases it´s very effective (at least in my experience)

    Early whipping + specialists + lightbulbing are great, later cottages + buyrushing units are really effective
     
  8. ShadowKatana

    ShadowKatana Chieftain

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    That sounds right.

    Low pop cities are more effective running scientists than running cottages.

    So take a 3 pop city, with one food resource and a farm or two, and have it run 2 scientists. Thats immediately get some science flowing, rather than having to wait a bunch of turns for cottages to grow.

    And basically cottage everything else - the city will grow into working the cottages, and will be always be somewhat useful scientifically, and might pop a scientist once as a bonus.
     
  9. LoopyLewis

    LoopyLewis Warlord

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    Thanks everyone! I'm going to practice the transition in the nex few games and see how I do :)
     

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