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[GS] Mali and victory

Discussion in 'Civ6 - General Discussions' started by craney1987, Mar 14, 2019.

  1. craney1987

    craney1987 Warlord

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    What is the best victory condition for Mali to meet? I've been enjoying playing them, but can't seem to settle on a preferred strategy with them.
     
  2. Datian

    Datian Warlord

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    Mali's core strength is buying stuff - especially in the middle game. I find that in the end game, every civ is crazy rich in faith and money.
    In the medieval era, your money makes you king of the world, free enquiry gives you an edge in science, and that's when you have your unique knight.

    Things you can buy :
    - apostles, with a discount, and since you tend to build lots of holy sites with Mali...
    - military units, again with a discount, and the knight

    In the end, dominiation and religious victory seem best.

    Science victory relies on production, and even though you can buy your spaceports, you still have to build the projects, so your low production will hamper you.
    Culture victory will rely not on wonder (again, low production), but faith bought naturalists, and since there's not much to do with desert tiles, I suppose it's an adequate path.
     
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  3. bonafide11

    bonafide11 Worker

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    I played them once and decided to go for Diplomatic Victory because it was my first time going for it, but I think they are fairly good at getting any of the victory types. They're a great Civ.
     
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  4. Searing7

    Searing7 Chieftain

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    I actually think Mali is great for culture, you will be so rich in faith and gold you can actually just buy all the districts and buildings you need with Reyna/Jesuit Education. You find you have nothing to build and will end up making lots of wonders.
     
  5. OmegaDestroyer

    OmegaDestroyer Prince

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    I found myself wondering which way to take Mali after a certain point, similar to the Cree (although with much greater emphasis on Religion). Due to your money and faith, there really isn't any victory you can't actively pursue. In my current game, I'm just throwing troops at Egypt with little regard for their safety since it is so easy to replace them. Now I'm debating if I want to go full on domination or religion on a huge map; both are not that appealing.
     
  6. Sagax

    Sagax Emperor

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    You can spend gold on anything, and it will help and feel good for any VC - that’s true.

    However, the only VC that can potentially tap into your gold income infinitely is Domination - be that unit purchase/upgrade, unit maintenance, or buying strategic resources that you lack. For other VCs, you eventually simply run out of stuff to buy.

    The only thing holding Mali’s domination is the fact that their early game is weak, and high-efficiency players preach early warmongering above all.
     
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  7. Brutus2

    Brutus2 Prince

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    Not if you build the Royal Society and buy workers to rush the projects.
     
  8. Softly

    Softly Warlord

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    I would definitely say that they are most suited for religious victory.

    (a) If you can settle next to 3-4 dessert tiles and save your faith then very easy to secure a religion even on deity by faith purchasing.
    (b) Songs of the Jeli + guaranteed early pantheon + incentive to build holy sites means you will always have strong raw faith generation, which is the #1 factor for religious victory other than securing a religion.
    (c) The areas where Mali is weak (production, science and culture) are less important in religious victories then in the other victory types.
    (d) 20% cheaper religious units is no joke.

    Alot of people talk up Mali's domination game but I really don't get it. Is the number of units really the bottleneck for domination victory for anyone in the 2nd half of the game? Mali struggles with early production, science and culture so not sure why they would be considered good at domination.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2019
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  9. craney1987

    craney1987 Warlord

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    I feel domination suffers from the lag in early game. If that's my intended path, with most civs I'd be well on my way before Mali could even think about beginning to play dom.
    I am now leaning towards religion and culture also, but the ability for them to just buy everything is what make me almost feel lost mid game. It sort of blurs the goal posts for me a little, and I don't like it.
     
  10. Karmah

    Karmah King Supporter

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    buying rock bands being quite a viable strategy, Mali can go for a VC
     
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  11. Troy Bruckner

    Troy Bruckner Prince

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    Mali is great for all of the victory conditions and only the early game depends on desert land. After that you want rain forests aplenty.
     
  12. Leucarum

    Leucarum Prince

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    I got one of my fastest religious victories with them... Songs of the Jelly can make quite a lot of faith from dessert. Or something...
     
  13. Sostratus

    Sostratus Emperor

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    Are you optimizing your Sugubas?
    >See my signature

    If you are getting high adjacency on sugubas, then free inquiry is massively superior to monumentality in the mid game. It's not even close. Like 6-8 science per suguba in the classical.
    I also find a great counterweight to the insane science output is to pick choral music since you'll have a holy site in every city; this means another 6 culture per city.
    Plus outside of golden ages, it means you can focus on campus-holy site-suguba and cover science, culture, faith, and gold.

    The science power really lets you do whatever you want. Since you should end up with a dense blanket of cities even if you don't conquer, I think they have natural leaning toward cultural (can generate many more GPP and slots) and religion.
    But science still seems faster if you don't blitz a religion win. I mean all you have to do is let your absurd science from free inquiry and then campus spam carry you to the end, and all that desert aluminum means you can bang out a bunch of laser space stations and wrap SV up in like, 10 turns.
     
  14. Troy Bruckner

    Troy Bruckner Prince

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    Once Mali gets Democracy they really can't lose a war.
     
  15. Cherenkov

    Cherenkov Chieftain

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    With a good capital you can do anything with Mali.Checkout the Gotm59 Mali start. This is beyond OP. Unfortunately you are limited to a diplomatic victory though so waiting around with 33,000 gold and almost 10,000 faith and nothing to do with it is kind of annoying. But if you wanted you could easily do a sub 200 SV and probably 150 DV on this map.
     
  16. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    Any victory at all.
    Apart from relics, a religious victory is easy and fast. Just faceroll, I hate it, so simple.
    Best? What does that mean? Most fun is what you like playing so an SV for me, that gold is crazy
     
  17. Troy Bruckner

    Troy Bruckner Prince

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    Impressive, but you should run your trade routes from cities with a majority of flat desert tiles.
     
  18. craney1987

    craney1987 Warlord

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    I should have said "most suited"
    Korea is a science civ.
    Hungary a dom civ etc.
    Mali doesn't sseem to have an obvious strategy to me.
     
  19. Sagax

    Sagax Emperor

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    Which, in a sense, is one of Mali's strengths in itself. You are good at whatever VC you pick, and you don't get shackled by the picked VC either.

    Wanted to go for SV, but realized that Seondeok was running away on the other end of the map uncontested? Switch!
    Wanted to go for CV, but Peter, Mvemba, and Kristina are all in one game? Switch!
    Wanted to go for DomV, but got tired of unit management? Switch!
    Wanted to go for RV, but realized that playing on Huge map for this VC was a mistake? Switch!
    Wanted to go for DipV, but realized that it feels like torture? Switch!

    Too late in the game to change your strategy? Stockpile nukes / buy GDRs and finish the game.

    I mean, not every game needs to be a speedrun that snowballs from turn 1.... and domination is a path that doesn't make you feel lost with all that gold overflow. Once the gold-churning machine starts running, buy all the units you want and go to war on all fronts and in all directions - because you can afford it.
     
  20. Midgardsormr

    Midgardsormr Warlord

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    I just finished my Huge/Pangea/Immortal Mali game, and I bought a Science Victory. I didn't even really decide which direction I was going until halfway through the Industrial Era—I just balanced my science and culture output while putting most of my effort into making the Super Suguba (screwed up a city placement and could only get 5 Holy Sites around it, unfortunately).

    I had so much Faith and nothing to do with it by the end that I was buying Rock Bands just for the heck of it. Could easily have gone for a Cultural Victory, and I was within a point of a Diplomatic Victory. I briefly considered seeing if I could get all three Victories done by the time the Score timed out.
     
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