Mandatory minimum sentencing.

[Mojotronica]

This weekend activists are assembled at Seattle's Folk Life Festival to gather signatures for Initiative 833, a "One Strike, Your Out," mandatory minimum sentence proposition for sex crime offenders.

Here's a short piece on it:
http://www.komotv.com/stories/25006.htm

If passed into law, this would mean that anyone convicted of a sex crime in WA state would go to prison for life. It's in response to some cases where criminals serve out their sentence but are still considered at high risk to re-offend.

I personally DETEST mandatory minimum sentencing laws, because I feel that judicial discretion is very important to fair sentencing. More and more in this country, the judge is becoming obsolete.

I think that this proposal is way too broad and I would hope that the state supreme court would throw it out with impunity -- but they have upheld "Three Strikes, You're Out" laws for violent and drug-related crimes in the past.

I see two nightmare scenarios emerging f/ this legislation (besides the probability that at least a few innocent people are going to be convicted and given this Draconian sentence.)

a) Some unlucky 18-yr old is going to CONSENSUALLY get his 15-yr old girlfriend pregnant and the state will have no choice but to prosecute him (state law,) and he will end up serving a life sentence.

b) Faced with the possibility of life imprisonment for a sex offense, some predator or predators will murder their victim to minimize the chance of getting caught, instead of just violating them. After all, murder carries a penalty of 20 to life. Better odds.

I hate these sex offenders running around after serving their time but this is not a reasonable solution. Increase penalties for Lvl 3 sex offenders, but don't put more mandatory minimums on the books. Good lord!

 

[gr8ful wes]

They should just hang them

 

[Akka]

And tear each of their limbs apart while dissolving them in acid.

 

[Toasty]

It's moments like these I think that the "sheep liberals" at least need to be prodded in the right direction .

It's impractical because of our judicial system, and if you think our judicial system is perfect, you've got another thing coming.

 

[MrPresident]

I agree with you Mojotronica that mandatory minimum sentencing laws are a bad thing. One case can be very different from another case and so require a completely different sentence. Also I firmly believe in the principle that people can change. Life in prison without the chance of parole should be restricted to only those criminals who have no chance of changing whatsoever or whose crimes are so great that they deserve it.

 

[Kinniken]

Originally posted by MrPresident
I agree with you Mojotronica that mandatory minimum sentencing laws are a bad thing. One case can be very different from another case and so require a completely different sentence. Also I firmly believe in the principle that people can change. Life in prison without the chance of parole should be restricted to only those criminals who have no chance of changing whatsoever or whose crimes are so great that they deserve it.

For the second time this week-end I wholly agree to one of your post, MrPresident. Something fundamental in this Universe's equilibrum is shifting, I fear

 

[Ancient Grudge]

Originally posted by gr8ful wes
They should just hang them

I totally agree with you

but lacking that i dont agree with mandatory minimum sentencing IF murder has a lesser sentence so simple kill the murders and imprsion or kill the sex offenders rapists molesters etc...

 

[Akka]

Originally posted by Ancient Grudge

I totally agree with you

but lacking that i dont agree with mandatory minimum sentencing IF murder has a lesser sentence so simple kill the murders and imprsion or kill the sex offenders rapists molesters etc...

You mean, no tearing limbs nor acid ?

 

[MrPresident]

Originally posted by Kinniken
For the second time this week-end I wholly agree to one of your post, MrPresident. Something fundamental in this Universe's equilibrum is shifting, I fear

And all it took was sex offenders to bring us together.

 

[redtom]

All the research I've read in the newspaper say that:
-Ppl commit crime knowing full well that they are going to prison, the actual length of time in prison doesn't seem to effect whether they commit the crime.
-Prisons are currently over-filled at the moment and the numbers are rising in both the UK and USA. In USA, since 1985 the numbers in prison have rose expentially to double the number of prisons.
-Crime is commited out of desperation. Desperation could only be increased by prison.
-Prisons are breeding grounds for crime. Many ppl have gone in prison for petty offences like shoplifting or taking class C's and have come out hardened criminal.
-Prisons are a knee-jerk reaction to crime. Research conclusively shows that poverty and greed cause crime. By making a more egalitarian state.

I could go on stating examples of why prisons don't work.

I believe that criminals should pay for there own crime by community service - not the forced labour that is happening in US at the moment - its simply stalinistic forcing criminals into labour.

I also believe shorter prisons sentences for all crime could reduce the number of prisoners and thus reduce the cost. I believe also that by fining could also pay in-part for the prison costs

Civil liberties, above all, should be respected.

Should also remember that ppl can be wrongly accused.

 

[Ancient Grudge]

Originally posted by Akka

You mean, no tearing limbs nor acid ?

hmmmm hanging not a good hanging! where they make it last hours of pain and misery and then maybe then draw and quater them thats whta they deserve mayeb that would stop more of them

also i think the familys or the victim should choose the way of death

 

[eyrei]

If we stopped throwing so many small-time drug dealers in prison, we would have plenty of room for these poor, sick people.

 

[Chieftess]

I remember the over-crowded jail debates back in our highschool social studies class.

One problem in Baltimore seems to be a clogged legal system that puts offenders back ON the streets. Not only are the jails overcrowded, but the legal system as well. I think the problem really starts at home - a lack of parenting.

I saw a quote once that went something like: "The worst thing that people can do is nothing."

The more people run away from problems, the greater vacuum problems have to fill.

 

[EdwardTking]

A mandatory minimum sentence of life is a misleading expression because in states or countries where there is no death penalty it is actually the mandatory maximum.

And what is the definition of a sex crime?

You pinch your spouse's bottom. 'Oh - I did not consent on that occasion; because you would not pay for that new dress'.

You go to gaol for life!

 

[JollyRoger]

Originally posted by EdwardTking
You pinch your spouse's bottom. 'Oh - I did not consent on that occasion; because you would not pay for that new dress'.

You go to gaol for life!

And if, before you pinched, you offered to buy the dress in order to gain consent, then I guess they can bring you up on solicitation charges.

Mandatory sentencing laws are an infringement on judicial discretion. Just like zero tolerance policies lead to zero thinking, mandatory sentencing just leads to a mandatorily inflexible justice system. Prisons are overcrowded & monsters are being let free because of mandatory minimums for things as benign as drug possession. If you don't want the sex offender let out, then you are going to have to either give up some tactics in the war on drugs (mandatory minimums creates prison overcrowding which forces more liberal parole policies for inmates not subject to mandatory minimums), give up your dividend tax cut (to pay for increased incarceration costs & build & maintain more prisons) or both.

Can you imagine a rapist/murderer willing to plea bargain down to the murder charge if the rape charge will be dropped so that he can avoid the mandatory sentence? Many a prosecutor will accept that deal to notch an easy murder conviction under their belt. This would then not give the prisoner any judicially-motivated incentive to seek help for his problems related to the sex offense and, if and when he ever gets out, he would not even be subject to the normal monitoring that released sex offenders are subject to. It just creates more incentive to fight off sex offense charges at any cost and will result in less sex offenders being "judicially recognized" as sex offenders thus undercutting the goals of these well-meaning, but counter-productive strategies in dealing with the issue.

 

[gr8ful wes]

Originally posted by eyrei
If we stopped throwing so many small-time drug dealers in prison, we would have plenty of room for these poor, sick people.

YEP

 

[Ohwell]

Originally posted by eyrei
If we stopped throwing so many small-time drug dealers in prison, we would have plenty of room for these poor, sick people.

What if we made more prisons? Then we can put even more small-time drug dealers in prison with room for the sex offenders. Small-time drug dealers are a problem, they are the ones that sell drugs to kids. Our kids are probably the stupidest people on the planet due to drugs, and we have to stamp these drugs out with impunity. "Recreational" drugs aren't so recreational when you become addicted, drop out of high-school and become a prostitute or skell for the rest of your life.

 

[Lefty Scaevola]

Voters and legislaters love them. Judges hate them. I think the judges are smarter.

 

[kring]

Originally posted by Mojotronica
a) Some unlucky 18-yr old is going to CONSENSUALLY get his 15-yr old girlfriend pregnant and the state will have no choice but to prosecute him (state law,) and he will end up serving a life sentence.

In most states, a 15 year old can not give Consensually agreement. It is called stat. rape, even if the minor agreed to the sex.

I agree that mandatory sentences can cause problems. I also agree that a person would be more likely to kill a victim in such an instance. The person could then plead to murder, and the DA may not even try the sex crime since the person plead guilty to murder.

 

[allhailIndia]

Mandatory sentenceing might cause harm to the victim as the offender may kill her to destroy evidence