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Maps with realistic starting positions for all civs

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Pre-made Maps' started by The_J, Mar 7, 2010.

  1. The_J

    The_J Say No 2 Net Validations Retired Moderator Supporter

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    29,946
    Location:
    Germany / Netherlands
    This is not a map, but people will search for it here, so i place the thread here:

    BtS: Download

    Warlords: Download

    Maps with realistic starting positions for all civs
    We all know: We can't play a earth map with realisitc starting positions and have free civilization and leader choice, because the civs have to be set in the .wbs file.
    Now, this mod changes it. All the included maps (which are NOT mine) can be played with every civilization, with every number of civilizations, with every leader, etc., and every civilization will start at the correct positions!
    You can start one of the included world maps only with america and russia, you'll have the choice what leader will be in, and america will start at the east coast of america and russia will somehow around the position of moscow.
    Or you can start the same map with all european civs in, and all will start at the correct positions, so that europe will be full and the rest of the world will be empty. That's your (or the computers) choice!

    Below you can see 2 pictures of the same map, but with different civs:
    Spoiler :






    The maps, which are in this mod, are not created by myself, they were created by the great map creators of this and the german forum, thank you all :goodjob:.

    Included maps:

    Playable civ list:
    Spoiler :

    Earth 100X56(Standard-Clean)-by-strategyonly : every civ
    Europe90X90-by-iuvavus:
    - England
    - Germany
    - France
    - Holy Roman Empire
    - Spain
    - Portugal
    - Vikings
    - Netherlands
    - Celts
    - Russia
    - Mongoli
    - Persia
    - Byzantines
    - Greece
    - Ottomans
    - Carthage
    - Rome
    Earth-Neutral-by-sr: Every civ
    EnlargedEuropeMap-by-lonewolf: Every civ
    EurasiaPlus-by-jabarto:
    - NOT Zulu
    - NOT Aztec
    - NOT Maya
    Gallia25X30-by-iuvavus:
    - France
    - Germany
    - England
    - Celts
    - Holy Roman
    - Spain
    - Netherlands
    - Rome
    - Vikings
    medSeaNorthAfriaArabia-by-good-sauce:
    - Arabia
    - Babylon
    - Byzantines
    - Carthage
    - Celts
    - Egypt
    - Ethiopia
    - France
    - Greece
    - Holy Roman
    - Mali
    - Ottomans
    - Persia
    - Portugal
    - Rome
    - Spain
    - Sumeria
    Old World (17) 68x34-by-aokces:
    - NOT America
    - NOT native america
    - NOT Inca
    - NOT Maya
    - NOT Aztec
    - NOT Zulu
    old-world-by-MrWurf:
    - NOT America
    - NOT native america
    - NOT Inca
    - NOT Maya
    - NOT Aztec
    - NOT China
    - NOT India
    - NOT Japan
    - NOT Khmer
    - NOT Korea
    - NOT Zulu
    SmallEurope-by-el-hidalgo:
    - England
    - France
    - Germany
    - Holy Romans
    - Netherlands
    - Celts
    - Spain
    - Portugal
    - Rome
    - Greece
    - Carthago
    - Egypt
    - Vikings
    - Byzantines
    - Ottomans
    - Persia
    - Babylonia
    - Sumeria
    - Russia
    - Mongolia
    SouthEastAsia55X55-by-iuvavus:
    - China
    - Japan
    - Mongolia
    - India
    - Korea
    - Khmer
    - Persia
    - Russia
    Tiny Europe-by-Rhye-And-Fierabras:
    - England
    - France
    - Germany
    - Holy Romans
    - Netherlands
    - Celts
    - Spain
    - Portugal
    - Rome
    - Greece
    - Carthago
    - Egypt
    - Vikings
    - Byzantines
    - Ottomans
    - Persia
    - Babylonia
    - Sumeria
    - Russia
    - Mongolia
    - Ethiopia
    - Arabia
    WesternEurope38X48-by-iuvavus:
    - England
    - France
    - Germany
    - Netherlands
    - Holy Romans
    - Celts
    - Vikings
    - Rome
    - Spain
    - Portugal
    - Carthago
    Mediterranean_Bonuses-by-wcis:
    - Arabia
    - Babylon
    - Byzantines
    - Carthage
    - Celts
    - Egypt
    - Ethiopia
    - France
    - Greece
    - Holy Roman
    - Mali
    - Ottomans
    - Persia
    - Portugal
    - Rome
    - Spain
    - Sumeria
    MiddleEast 1.01-by-sr:
    - Arabia
    - Babylonia
    - Sumeria
    - Persia
    - India
    - Greece
    - Byzantines
    - Ottomans
    - Egypt
    - Ethiopia
    - Mali
    - Mongolia


    If you like one of these maps, then please comment in the thread of the maps, because they are not my work, and i do not deserve any comments for creating the maps.

    BtS: Download

    Warlords: Download

    Version:
    - BtS 3.19. Should also work for 3.13/3.17
    - Warlords 2.13
    Mac: Compatible (was tested by Keinpferd)
    Multiplayer: Hotseat works, PBEM should, no idea about Pitboss

    Installation:
    The file is a .zip file, and can't directly be used. Every computer should be able to handle a .zip file. If not, download winzip and install it.
    Rightclick on the startingpoints.zip, click "extract here". Cut the new folder "startingpoints", and paste it in your BtS\Mods directory (for Warlords sure the warlords directory ;)).
    This directory should be under C:\Program Files\Firaxis Games\Civilization4\BeyondTheSword (if you installed it elsewhere, you should know where to look).
    In the same folder the other BtS mods, like Afterworld or Road To War (for Warlords e.g. the barbarian or Vikings mod), should be located, if this is the case, you're right.
    The name of the folder MUST be "startingpoints".

    Starting the mod:
    Load BtS, go "advanced", "load a mod", "startingpoints" and load it.
    To make it easier, i recommend using just another mod chooser, so that you don't have to load BtS.



    Questions a player might have:

    Cool, can you add this map here?
    Yes, i can, if you provide me a link. The map can have preplaced civs, that's no problem.
    But i can't convert maps with many preplaced cities, or maps from mods with other terrain/bonuses.

    This starting position is crap and unrealistic! Why did you do that?
    Some positions are not perfect, i know.
    I will not change the maps any further, because they are not mine, so i can just place the civs there.
    On some points there can't be done anything. I can't let the byzantines and the ottomans start at the same point, so i let the ottomans just start somewhere in turkey at a good position. Same also for europe and mesopotamia, all civs must be able to found a city, and the positions are set so that they can do this.
    Edit: This has not been readjusted for Warlords, sorry.

    I also did not work with a atlas, and was sometimes really free with the positions.
    For example, the native americans just start somewhere in the great plains, because i have no real idea, what the historically acurate position could be.
    Also on the europe map by iuvavus i've place the persians in eastern turkey and the mongols in eastern russia to include more civs.
    If something here is really arguable or just wrong, then please correct my, it was not out of purpose.

    If you have a better suggestion, so that all civs fit better in, please suggest it :).

    Can i play this with the 40/50 civs mod?
    No, the maps are not compatible, but can converted.
    But i will not do this at the moment.
    I can explain how to convert it, if somebody requests an explanation.

    What will happen, when the aztecs appear on a europe map (or something similar)?
    If a invalid civ will appear on a map, the placing algorithm will replace this civ with a valid one, you will not notice it. Edit: This is not possible in the Warlords version, the civs will instead just be killed and you get a notice about the number of killed civs.
    If youself start with an invalid civ, this can't be done, and no civs will be replaced, you have to restart then.

    Will this mod make the game slower?
    Only the start will be a bit slower, but this mod will not affect the speed of the game turns.


    Questions a modder might have:

    How do i merge this with my mod?
    Python: There are 2 changes in the CvEventManager, both labeled with "starting points", both changes have to be merged.
    In the second part, there's 2 times "startingpoints" mentioned. This is the name of the mod folder, so you will have to change it to your mod folder.
    The second python file, the startingpointsutil.py can just be dropped into the same folder like the CvEventManager, and you don't have to change anything there (only if you removed the units settler, warrior, worker and scout, then you have to adjust the starting units, just search for these unit types).

    XML: In XML\CustomXML\mapname_startingpoints.xml are the civs mentioned. If you added a civ or changed the key for one, then you have to change the entries there.

    Note: In the maps i've set the mod path, you also should change it there.

    How do i add a map?
    For every map in the PrivateMaps folder there's also an XML file in XML\CustomXML\. The XML file is named mapname_startingpoints.xml, the mapname without the file extension.

    How do i make a civ invalid for this map?
    Just set the values for the starting position in the XML both (or one) to -1.

    Baah, searching for starting positions is horrible, i can only guess!
    You don't have to guess. In the CvEventManager.py, there's the line AddPositionsToMap = False. Change this value to True, and every tile will be labeled with X and Y coordinates, so that you can see, what values you should put into the XML file. The labeling will make the start very slow (can be up to 6 minutes, depending on map size), but you'll only turn this on 1 or 2 times ;).
    Note: The XML for this map must already exist! There's a Dummy_startingpoints.xml included. Just copy this file, rename it, and you'll start at the position 1,1 on the map.



    ------------------

    Re-uploaded on March, 16th 2010, 11:05 AM forum time.
    Spoiler :

    Added 4 maps:

    - Replaced vikings to norway, if it was possible
    - Replaced celts to southern france, if it was possible
    - Fixed the positions on Huge Mediterranean Map my wcis
    - Added a textfile with a list, which civs are playable on which map
    Spoiler :

    Earth 100X56(Standard-Clean)-by-strategyonly : every civ
    Europe90X90-by-iuvavus:
    - England
    - Germany
    - France
    - Holy Roman Empire
    - Spain
    - Portugal
    - Vikings
    - Netherlands
    - Celts
    - Russia
    - Mongoli
    - Persia
    - Byzantines
    - Greece
    - Ottomans
    - Carthage
    - Rome
    Earth-Neutral-by-sr: Every civ
    EnlargedEuropeMap-by-lonewolf: Every civ
    EurasiaPlus-by-jabarto:
    - NOT Zulu
    - NOT Aztec
    - NOT Maya
    Gallia25X30-by-iuvavus:
    - France
    - Germany
    - England
    - Celts
    - Holy Roman
    - Spain
    - Netherlands
    - Rome
    - Vikings
    medSeaNorthAfriaArabia-by-good-sauce:
    - Arabia
    - Babylon
    - Byzantines
    - Carthage
    - Celts
    - Egypt
    - Ethiopia
    - France
    - Greece
    - Holy Roman
    - Mali
    - Ottomans
    - Persia
    - Portugal
    - Rome
    - Spain
    - Sumeria
    Old World (17) 68x34-by-aokces:
    - NOT America
    - NOT native america
    - NOT Inca
    - NOT Maya
    - NOT Aztec
    - NOT Zulu
    old-world-by-MrWurf:
    - NOT America
    - NOT native america
    - NOT Inca
    - NOT Maya
    - NOT Aztec
    - NOT China
    - NOT India
    - NOT Japan
    - NOT Khmer
    - NOT Korea
    - NOT Zulu
    SmallEurope-by-el-hidalgo:
    - England
    - France
    - Germany
    - Holy Romans
    - Netherlands
    - Celts
    - Spain
    - Portugal
    - Rome
    - Greece
    - Carthago
    - Egypt
    - Vikings
    - Byzantines
    - Ottomans
    - Persia
    - Babylonia
    - Sumeria
    - Russia
    - Mongolia
    SouthEastAsia55X55-by-iuvavus:
    - China
    - Japan
    - Mongolia
    - India
    - Korea
    - Khmer
    - Persia
    - Russia
    Tiny Europe-by-Rhye-And-Fierabras:
    - England
    - France
    - Germany
    - Holy Romans
    - Netherlands
    - Celts
    - Spain
    - Portugal
    - Rome
    - Greece
    - Carthago
    - Egypt
    - Vikings
    - Byzantines
    - Ottomans
    - Persia
    - Babylonia
    - Sumeria
    - Russia
    - Mongolia
    - Ethiopia
    - Arabia
    WesternEurope38X48-by-iuvavus:
    - England
    - France
    - Germany
    - Netherlands
    - Holy Romans
    - Celts
    - Vikings
    - Rome
    - Spain
    - Portugal
    - Carthago
    Mediterranean_Bonuses-by-wcis:
    - Arabia
    - Babylon
    - Byzantines
    - Carthage
    - Celts
    - Egypt
    - Ethiopia
    - France
    - Greece
    - Holy Roman
    - Mali
    - Ottomans
    - Persia
    - Portugal
    - Rome
    - Spain
    - Sumeria
    MiddleEast 1.01-by-sr:
    - Arabia
    - Babylonia
    - Sumeria
    - Persia
    - India
    - Greece
    - Byzantines
    - Ottomans
    - Egypt
    - Ethiopia
    - Mali
    - Mongolia



    Edit: Re-uploaded on april, 17th, 5:18 PM forum time.
    - Added Earth map by carter.

    Edit: Re-uploaded on juli, 3rd, 5:02 PM forum time
    - Added mediterranean map by veBear
    - Fixed indian starting position on Jabartos eurasia map

    Edit: Re-uploaded on April, 4th, 2012, 04:16 forum time.
    - Fixed a bug, which lead to the custom script running out of civs if multiple maps were tried in one session. Thanks to Xyth for reporthing this bug :).
     

    Attached Files:

  2. mamba

    mamba Chieftain

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    Definitely interesting :)
     
  3. mechaerik

    mechaerik Tuturuu!

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    Los Angeles
    Cahokia, the capitol of the NAE, is between where Missouri and Illinois would be, so you aren't too far off.

    However, it appears you put the Vikings start in Sweden. Nidaros is actually in Norway.


    Still, these are non-issues. This is an excellent thing. Can I give it six stars out of five?
     
  4. Keinpferd

    Keinpferd Chieftain

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    The_J! Excellent, useful, mac compatible! Thanks!
     
  5. The_J

    The_J Say No 2 Net Validations Retired Moderator Supporter

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    Thank you all :).
    @Keinpferd: Did you test it?

    Ah, okay, thanks for the corrections, i'll replace them next weekend, if possible.

    Igor has in the comments also mentioned the position of Bribracte as questionable, and after i've looked up now, where this city was, i have to agree. I think, i can change it on the mediterranean maps, but i guess not on the worldmaps :( .
     
  6. Keinpferd

    Keinpferd Chieftain

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    Yes, with Old World by MrWurf only, so far, working!! Thanks again:goodjob:.
     
  7. The_J

    The_J Say No 2 Net Validations Retired Moderator Supporter

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    Thanks to let me know, i've changed in the starting post :).
     
  8. The_J

    The_J Say No 2 Net Validations Retired Moderator Supporter

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    I've reuploaded the whole thing :):

    Added 4 maps:

    - Replaced vikings to norway, if it was possible
    - Replaced celts to southern france, if it was possible
    - Fixed the positions on Huge Mediterranean Map my wcis
    - Added a textfile with a list, which civs are playable on which map
    Spoiler :

    Earth 100X56(Standard-Clean)-by-strategyonly : every civ
    Europe90X90-by-iuvavus:
    - England
    - Germany
    - France
    - Holy Roman Empire
    - Spain
    - Portugal
    - Vikings
    - Netherlands
    - Celts
    - Russia
    - Mongoli
    - Persia
    - Byzantines
    - Greece
    - Ottomans
    - Carthage
    - Rome
    Earth-Neutral-by-sr: Every civ
    EnlargedEuropeMap-by-lonewolf: Every civ
    EurasiaPlus-by-jabarto:
    - NOT Zulu
    - NOT Aztec
    - NOT Maya
    Gallia25X30-by-iuvavus:
    - France
    - Germany
    - England
    - Celts
    - Holy Roman
    - Spain
    - Netherlands
    - Rome
    - Vikings
    medSeaNorthAfriaArabia-by-good-sauce:
    - Arabia
    - Babylon
    - Byzantines
    - Carthage
    - Celts
    - Egypt
    - Ethiopia
    - France
    - Greece
    - Holy Roman
    - Mali
    - Ottomans
    - Persia
    - Portugal
    - Rome
    - Spain
    - Sumeria
    Old World (17) 68x34-by-aokces:
    - NOT America
    - NOT native america
    - NOT Inca
    - NOT Maya
    - NOT Aztec
    - NOT Zulu
    old-world-by-MrWurf:
    - NOT America
    - NOT native america
    - NOT Inca
    - NOT Maya
    - NOT Aztec
    - NOT China
    - NOT India
    - NOT Japan
    - NOT Khmer
    - NOT Korea
    - NOT Zulu
    SmallEurope-by-el-hidalgo:
    - England
    - France
    - Germany
    - Holy Romans
    - Netherlands
    - Celts
    - Spain
    - Portugal
    - Rome
    - Greece
    - Carthago
    - Egypt
    - Vikings
    - Byzantines
    - Ottomans
    - Persia
    - Babylonia
    - Sumeria
    - Russia
    - Mongolia
    SouthEastAsia55X55-by-iuvavus:
    - China
    - Japan
    - Mongolia
    - India
    - Korea
    - Khmer
    - Persia
    - Russia
    Tiny Europe-by-Rhye-And-Fierabras:
    - England
    - France
    - Germany
    - Holy Romans
    - Netherlands
    - Celts
    - Spain
    - Portugal
    - Rome
    - Greece
    - Carthago
    - Egypt
    - Vikings
    - Byzantines
    - Ottomans
    - Persia
    - Babylonia
    - Sumeria
    - Russia
    - Mongolia
    - Ethiopia
    - Arabia
    WesternEurope38X48-by-iuvavus:
    - England
    - France
    - Germany
    - Netherlands
    - Holy Romans
    - Celts
    - Vikings
    - Rome
    - Spain
    - Portugal
    - Carthago
    Mediterranean_Bonuses-by-wcis:
    - Arabia
    - Babylon
    - Byzantines
    - Carthage
    - Celts
    - Egypt
    - Ethiopia
    - France
    - Greece
    - Holy Roman
    - Mali
    - Ottomans
    - Persia
    - Portugal
    - Rome
    - Spain
    - Sumeria
    MiddleEast 1.01-by-sr:
    - Arabia
    - Babylonia
    - Sumeria
    - Persia
    - India
    - Greece
    - Byzantines
    - Ottomans
    - Egypt
    - Ethiopia
    - Mali
    - Mongolia



    --------------------------------------

    I know, some maps do not really make sense, because you can easily place every civ on it, which are realistic, like the gallia map with only 9 civs, but you can play these maps with only 2, 3...up to 9 civs, and they'll start on the right positions and you're not limited to a specified number.
     
  9. Xyth

    Xyth History Rewritten

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    Location:
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    This is great and I've merged it successfully into my mod. However I'm getting an error whenever I start a normal random map game:

    Code:
    Traceback (most recent call last):
      File "BugEventManager", line 362, in _handleDefaultEvent
      File "CvEventManager", line 362, in onGameStart
    IOError: [Errno 2] No such file or directory: 'Mods/History Rewritten/Assets/XML/CustomXML/s_StartingPoints.xml'
    It appears completely harmless but is there some way of changing it so it doesn't try to find a file that obviously doesn't exist?
     
  10. The_J

    The_J Say No 2 Net Validations Retired Moderator Supporter

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    A normal random map game...this means, with a mapscript, right?
    I thought, it should not happen, because the first check i do is for a mapscript :confused:.
    Okay, i'll look into it this afternoon, is hopefully not difficult to fix :).
     
  11. Xyth

    Xyth History Rewritten

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    Yeah a mapscript. I did notice your check for .py files, it's odd that it's not stopping it. It happens on both Continents and Pangaea; I've not tried anything else yet.
     
  12. Lachlan

    Lachlan Great Builder of Civs !

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    A problem for me too, i downloaded a few once your thing "realistic starting points", it loads normally but when i click on scenario or custom scenario, it show no scenarios...

    What is the problem ?
     
  13. Xyth

    Xyth History Rewritten

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    For some reason on Mac BTS it only works from Civilization IV/Beyond the Sword/Mods/. It can't find the maps if installed in Documents/Civilization IV Beyond the Sword/Mods/.

    I've seen this in other map mods too so it's an Aspyr problem not something in The_J's mod.
     
  14. The_J

    The_J Say No 2 Net Validations Retired Moderator Supporter

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    I remember something from another thread, where it was said, that when you load a mapscript, the name will not have the file extension...that's something, which i did not think of.
    I've changed the "not '.py' in mapname" into "if '.civ' in mapname". I know, this is a lame fix :blush:, but it works :).

    I don't know, if installing this here into the My Documents would even work on a windows system. But i also would never suggest to do that.
    -> @Lachlan: Did you install it in the My Documents folder? If yes, it's the wrong place, it has to go in C:\Program Files\Firaxis Games\Civilization4\BeyondTheSword\Mods.
    If this is already the case: When you load the mod, do you have the option to start a normal game with a mapscript?
     
  15. Xyth

    Xyth History Rewritten

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    I'll try it out and let you know how it goes :)

    Lachlan has Mac BTS like me, we know each other from the CFC Mac forums. /Documents/Civilization IV Beyond the Sword/Mods/ is the place mods are usually installed on a Mac, but StartingPoints will need to be installed alongside the standard BTS mods instead.
     
  16. The_J

    The_J Say No 2 Net Validations Retired Moderator Supporter

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    :)

    er...all other mods should be installed in the same place like the standard BtS mods...is this really different on a Mac?
     
  17. Lachlan

    Lachlan Great Builder of Civs !

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    Problem resolved by placing on the only other possible location than My Documents ;)
     
  18. Xyth

    Xyth History Rewritten

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    Yup, we have the standard install option and an additional one. Btw, the change seems to be working fine, no more error messages.
     
  19. The_J

    The_J Say No 2 Net Validations Retired Moderator Supporter

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    This is nice to hear, thank you both for your responses :).
     
  20. UrsaMajor

    UrsaMajor Chieftain

    Joined:
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    I've been trying to make my own map using the 18Civ map, but I don't know how to add civilizations. All I want to know is how to add civs. Can you help me?
     

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