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Mexico Forever: A DOC Game

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Stories & Tales' started by Lokki242, Apr 3, 2017.

  1. ChineseWarlord

    ChineseWarlord Chieftain

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    Why should you care?
    You're not wrong about that. However, my goal is to get democracy back in working order again. And to do that, we need to get rid of Diaz.
     
  2. Bautos42

    Bautos42 Chieftain

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    If the next election is fair, it does not matter whom I vote for, as Chevero will win anyways.
    If it isn't, it does not matter either, as Diaz will win anyways.
    Therefore, I conclude that it does not matter.
    As a consequence, I will vote for Zuniga, cause in the purely hypothetical case of him winning, it'll be lots of fun. :lol:
     
    Lokki242 likes this.
  3. ChineseWarlord

    ChineseWarlord Chieftain

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    Why should you care?
    If everyone votes for one candidate that's not already the person in power, then there's a higher chance that everyone will realize the election is fraudulent
     
    Lokki242 likes this.
  4. Bautos42

    Bautos42 Chieftain

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    Then maybe you should vote for Zuniga. You argue that there should be an unitary candidacy opposing Diaz, yet you never explain why this candidate should be Chevero. Even if you'd convince me that Zuniga is the wrong candidate, this would still not rule out the Californian Party. Anyways, as long as no one votes for Diaz, it is completely irrelevant for whom I vote. If Diaz is reelected without anyone having voted for him, it is obvious he commited election fraud no matter whom I vote for. If someone decides ti vote for him, you should rather try to convince that person. Additionally, it would be interesting wether you are arguing as an observer of the story or out of the perspective of an hypotetical Mexican elector inside the story. As you are trying to unveil the election fraud to the readers, that would be highly redundant as we are all aware that Diaz cheated. Therefore, you are probably trying to convince hypothetical Mexicans of the situation. But I am merly acting as a representative of the voting habbits of a certain percentage of the population. So the question remains, why should they vote for Chevero. Therefore, you don't only have to convince me you have to convince over 10% of undecided Mexican electors, why Chevero is the better candidate. And the argument "Everyone should know that Diaz commited voter fraud", cause in order for this argument to work, you'd have to convince them he cheated in the first place. So either it is already obvious he did not play fair, in wich case this entire discussion is redundant, or it is bot obvious and there is no proof easily aviable to the hypothetical Mexicans. In the latter case, you'll need another argument, cause would you vote for a candidate instead of your preferd candidate because some stranger (considering the amount of people my vote represents, most of them would probably be strangers) belives a third candidate has cheated and wants to expose him.
     
    Lokki242 likes this.
  5. ChineseWarlord

    ChineseWarlord Chieftain

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    Why should you care?
    A respected member of the academic establishment is more likely to be respected than a local eccentric.
     
    Lokki242 likes this.
  6. Lokki242

    Lokki242 El Presidente

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    I'm loving all this debate right here :thumbsup:
     
  7. Lokki242

    Lokki242 El Presidente

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    Sorry guys, but this is going to be on temporary hiatus. I am going through some things right now, and I'm not in a great place.

    I expect I'll be back in a month or two at most. Sorry. :(
     
  8. ChineseWarlord

    ChineseWarlord Chieftain

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    Why should you care?
    Well, I hope you'll be alright. Take as much time as you need.
     
  9. Gruekiller

    Gruekiller Back From The Beyond

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  10. Glorious Leader

    Glorious Leader Chieftain

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    Take all the time you need. Also sorry I was gone from voting for a few weeks.
     
  11. Lokki242

    Lokki242 El Presidente

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    Hey everyone! I am back earlier than anticipated, though things may be slow for a little while. I hope none of y'all have disappeared. :)

    1896 Election: Results

    National Re-Electionist Party: 8 (80%)
    Porfirio Diaz: 8 (100%)

    Cultural Preservation Society: 2 (20%)
    Alfredo Chavero: 2 (100%)
    The Zuniga Party: 1 (10%)
    Nicolas Zuniga y Miranda: 1 (100%)

    Amidst baseless accusations, President Diaz scores his fourth term in office!
    Degenerate rebels respond with protests.
    Spoiler :

    Though voter turnout for the 1896 election was significantly reduced, El Presidente was able to still secure his rightful place as the leader of our nation, despite conspiracies and plots by insurgents. Diaz has expressed an interest in finally destroying the various communist, anarchist and other rebel organizations who are at fault for the instability, many of them funding bandit organizations in rural areas.

    President Diaz's rivals for office, however, have refused to accept defeat, both claiming to be the true president of Mexico. This is to be expected from the eccentric Nicolas Zuniga, who still patrols the center of Mexican City with his homemade Presidential sash while shouting about Diaz's use of voter fraud and military intimidation. President Diaz has expressed potentially sending Zuniga to a mental ward for treatment, fearing for the beloved man's safety.

    Lies coming from the mouth of Alredo Chavero, however, are much more disconcerting. Echoing the calls of the insane Zuniga, Chavero too has accused Diaz of voter fraud, and has named himself the true president of Mexico, crafting a small parliament in the Yucatan. Supported by Zapotec rebels and communists sympathizers, Chavero seems to be sparking a civil war, as he has ignored all of Diaz's attempts to negotiate. The people of Oaxaca and Merida are likely suffering under "President" Chavero's power-hungry rule, and Diaz has promised to relieve them from their suffering.

    Across the country, various urban centers have erupted into rioting, likely funded by foreign communist organizations, and labour unions arranging strikes. Los Angeles has almost completely shut down, and Pico, another traitor, has refused to take action.
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2017 at 6:09 PM
  12. DKVM

    DKVM Basileus of the Romaioi

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    Your nightmares
    Good luck Lokki. I do not believe we have been introduced. I am DKVM, returning from my absence from this board. Nice to meet you. You have a very nice story here
     
  13. Lokki242

    Lokki242 El Presidente

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    1896-1902: The Three Presidents
    The obvious fraud of the 1896 Mexican election left Diaz's rule over the nation shattered, with all three of his political rivals calling out his actions, publicly or otherwise. Alfredo Chavero, who claimed to be the legitimate president, built his own congress in Tuxtla Gutierrez, creating an "opposition government". Zapotec and Mayan nationals, alongside many commoners and some soldiers, rallied behind him as they took control of the Yucatan. All attempts by Diaz to intimidate or negotiate were ignored. Zuniga's harmless proclamation of Presidential status would be ignored by most.
    Spoiler :

    Los Angeles, while not actively rebelling against President Diaz, was in complete shutdown. Riots and strikes seized most of the city's industrial or mercantile districts, with Celestino Pico quietly encouraging such "displays of democracy". Not yet ready to address Chavero's revolt and launch an official civil war, Diaz instead set troops to restore the peace in California by arresting the most troublesome protesters.
    Spoiler :

    Spoiler :

    Though Mexico was facing internal crisis, their puppets in the Republic of Mali took a page from Diaz's more aggressive attitude, and captured the weak former European port of Elmina, expanding the influence of their African state.
    Spoiler :

    Disorder rapidly spread through the more volatile Mexican territories. The Caribbean and Spanish Guyana, full of recent acquisitions, entered a period of chaotic riots and revolt against their foreign oppressors. Cracking down on these displays proved much more difficult, as troops could not move by rail to quickly restore order.
    Spoiler :

    Exhausted Mexican troops returning from China saw no rest thanks to the Second Civil War, often called the War of Three Presidents. Reinforcements were pumped into the returning force, alongside equipment upgrades, and they were quickly sent to battle Chavero and his supporters. Across the rest of the nation, the revolutionary bug had spread in small circles, leading to riots and strikes across the nation. Some even began to rally behind Zuniga as their president, using him a symbol of the mockery Diaz had turned Mexican democracy into.
    Spoiler :

    Spoiler :

    The siege of Chavero's capital, Tuxtla Gutierrez in Oaxaca, only began in late 1897. The archaeologist and rival president was forced to flee to Merida for his safety, despite a bad case of pneumonia beginning to plague his health. As cannon fire tore Tuxtla apart, more common folks and revolutionaries began to rally in Merida, hoping to restore freedom or die trying.
    Spoiler :

    Shortly after this, inspired by Chavero's refusal to accept Diaz's lies any longer, a coalition of Communists and Anarchists launched the Black Rebellion, seizing control of Sacramento. The radicals were influenced by Karl Marx and Mexican thinker Ricardo Flores Magon, and managed to overturn the city's garrison and create an isolated Anarcho-Communist state under the "Guardian of the Revolution", Guillermo Latoya.
    Spoiler :

    Tragedy struck Diaz's opposition on February 5, 1898. After battling disease for months, Alfredo Chavero was declared dead. The figurehead of democracy in Mexico was dead, leaving the rebels to fight amongst each other for leadership, with no singular individual proving themselves. Several skirmishes between the Zapotec army and other rebels resulted in disorder and hundreds of deaths.
    Spoiler :

    Tensions at home did not stop President Diaz from continuing to expand trade, particularly focusing on cultivating an excellent relationship with their allies in the United Kingdom, who in exchange helped to fund the Re-Electionist Party's war effort.
    Spoiler :

    Spoiler :

    Spoiler :

    The battle for Tuxtla Gutierrez proved long and bloody as Zapotec forces, despite a lack of professionalism, refused to back down when facing the Mexican army. Over ten thousand were killed on both sides, but the loyalist onslaught eventually slaughtered most of the opposition, and seized control of the city.
    Spoiler :

    Spoiler :

    Spoiler :

    Though propaganda was playing a small role in maintaining the peace, it was the dedicated support of the Mexican Army that had ensured the entire nation did not turn against President Diaz, as their top leaders owed their career to him. The support of the average soldier, however, was rapidly being depleted as Diaz drafted minorities to fill the empty positions his constant wars had left.
    Spoiler :

    While fighting through the Yucatan jungles was slow-moving, warfare in the heavily improved hills of Cabrillo showed less resistance for the Mexican Army. Anarchist rule over Sacramento proved short lived, as the city was swiftly recaptured by Diaz's forces. Guillermo Latoya was promptly hanged for treason, screaming "Vive la Mexcio!" as his final words.
    Spoiler :

    Spoiler :

    The brutality of the Civil War seemed infinitely far away in some regions, such as Dakota. Rapidos, in fact, experienced a large population boom in 1899 following the discovery of gold in nearby Sioux territory, and President Diaz was more than happy to encourage prospectors to journey into and settle the area.
    Spoiler :

    The Civil War, which had come after years of build up, would abruptly end in 1899. Military policing had ended many of the riots, and the capture of Sacramento left Merida as the only hub of resistance. Though the fighting was bloody, the city fell easier than Tuxtla Gutierrez, and the Zapotec Army was extinguished. Diaz promptly had its remaining members wiped out, with ringleaders given public executions. Many women and children were also killed during the looting of the Yucatan, but Diaz's close military relationship was nearly at an end. Victorianao Huerta, had been elected the new Chief General by his fellow soldiers, and his disregard for his superior, Minister of War Ramon Corral, was well known. It was not long before General Huerta made a public statement implying that if civil war returned to Mexico, the military would no longer save Diaz's rule.
    Spoiler :

    Spoiler :

    Spoiler :

    With peace firmly established, the next few years of Diaz's term would prove surprisingly quiet. 1901 saw the completion of the Pentagon in Santa Fe, a centralized hub to house intelligence and government offices, which earned the city the nickname of the "Poco Capitolio (Little Capitol)". The building proved a center for everything besides the meeting of congress and public statements, housing military strategy, low-publicity diplomatic affairs, and homeland intelligence. Supporting military police with intel, it soon helped quell the last of the major riots in the nation, and provided information on other potential insurgents, leading to hundreds of arrests and executions.
    Spoiler :

    Spoiler :

    By the end of Diaz's twenty-fourth year in office, peace seemed to have returned. The nation was strong once more, and the President had firm control. Cracks, however, had begun to show.
    Spoiler :
     
  14. Lokki242

    Lokki242 El Presidente

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    1902 Election
    Few in Mexico hold out hope for a fair election, but the nation is exhausted nonetheless. Without Chavero, and with the bloodshed of the civil war, the Cultural Preservation Society has faded into obscurity.

    National Re-electionist Party
    A party formed from the merger between the Old Liberal and Conservative parties, with the Moderate Nationals later joining the coalition. It has lost the pro-European nature of the Conservatives and the secularism of the Liberals. The Alliance is protectionist and will do whatever it takes to grow the Mexican economy to improve quality of life. A strong military is key to their platform, as is a firm international presence like those of many European powers. Supports a strong executive branch. Pro-union, but does not wish to strangle the economy with nationalization. Re-election is key to a strong, consistent nation.
    Spoiler :
    Porfirio Diaz (age 72)
    Spoiler :
    Incumbent President. Meticulous planner. Boasts a shrewd tactical mind and compelling presence. Keep Mexico "strong and stable". Continue to expand free trade then pour money into technology. Put more scientists, professors and other intellectuals in office and cabinet. Heavily tax the rich, but emphasize collective, fair ownership over nationalization. Spend 6 years of peaceful development

    California Party
    Regionalist party, focusing on Californian interest. Its interests lightly extend to the Pacific, Cabrillo, and Galiano. Supports an extremely free economy and massive trade deals. Promotes the use of client states similar to China and Mali to pursue economic interests, rather than direct control. Highly libertarian. Strong navy. Some party members support Californian secessionism.
    Spoiler :
    Celestino Alverado Pico (age 40)
    Spoiler :

    Former Governor of California. Businessman, invested in several industries. Grandson of former president Pio de Jesus Pico. Does not support secessionism, but is willing to hold a referendum upon victory. Expand Mexican trade deals, including a higher focus on imports. Denationalize all industries. Highly reduce the number of active troops, but expand the navy. Reduce the power of the Mexican Intelligence Bureau. Reduce research spending. Remove all of Diaz's electoral reform. Take power away from the executive branch and federal government. Settle much more of the Pacific and the Pacific Northwest. Legalize opium. Have Diaz arrested, and preferably exiled. Promote state rights.

    The Zuniga Party
    A party founded by Nicolas Zuniga y Miranda, to represent Nicolas Zuniga y Miranda. Technically illegitimate, but popular among some rural and urban members of the lower class.
    Spoiler :
    Nicolas Zuniga y Miranda (age 37)
    Spoiler :

    Eccentric from Mexico City. Well-dressed. Claims to have invented a machine that can predict earthquakes, supported by predicting one that struck Mexico City in 1887. Wants to introduce these earthquake machines to every city. Undo Diaz's electoral reform, as he believes it is fradulent. Cut military spending, and cut research spending. Follow the interests of Mexican people, and improve rural infrastructure, which has been neglected since the old Liberal regimes. Provide a daily ration of bread and milk to all Mexicans. Have Diaz arrested, with the option of exile or trial.

    Spoiler Political Chart, 1902 :
     
  15. Bautos42

    Bautos42 Chieftain

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    It's great to have you back. I vote for Pico.
     
  16. Gruekiller

    Gruekiller Back From The Beyond

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  17. DKVM

    DKVM Basileus of the Romaioi

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    Your nightmares
    I vote Zuniga
     
  18. ChineseWarlord

    ChineseWarlord Chieftain

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    Why should you care?
    How ironic to have Bautos supporting the "favored" candidate, and me supporting the wild card Zuniga
     
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