Micromanaging my begging

[brianb1974]

I just learned how lucrative it can be to beg from your friends once you get currency. But short of doing reloading trials, I never know how much is optimal to request and how often.

There must be a formula somewhere that tells you how much you can squeeze a friend for. It seems to be roughly based on how happy he is with you and how much cash he has on hand. I would sure like to be able to have a guideline so I could calculate my demands.

Also, how often can you hit friends up? Does it very by game speed?

Do folks have a long term memory for what they've given you? Sometimes it seems to me that they get less generous over time.

 

[Refar]

I don't know about how much... I usually ask (and get) up to 100 - 150 Gold, whenever i think of it, see the AI having some money, and have the feeling that enought time passed.

For how often, i have read the following in the past (and so far it seems consistant with my experience):
If the AI is willing to give you what you want (i.e. does not decide to refuse for some other reason (Asked too much, hate you, etc ...)) then, there is a additional chance it will refuse 'randomly', based on the time since the last request (Regardless if they accepted or not). It's 100% Right after you asked for something, and it drops by 5% per turn.
So begging once every 20 turns, you are save from "random refusal", and will get what you want. Unless you asked for too much

 

[brianb1974]

OK, so not more than 20 turns between begging. I'd like to know if that 5% per turn scales by game speed? Does anyone know?

Also, how much do you ask for? I know the formula has to do with cash on hand. Once, I caught Mansa (my bestest bud) right after he sent a great merchant on a trade mission. He about 1000 gp on hand and was willing to give me 850. But I had to reload a bunch of times to find that out. It would be nice to not have to cheat.

 

[Refar]

I am quite sure it does not scale on gamespeed. Most things in diplo don't (treaty duration, voting frequency...)

 

[obsolete]

It's 100% Right after you asked for something, and it drops by 5% per turn.

I am pretty sure, the way most algorithms work in the game it does not drop 5% per turn. It just rolls 1 out of 20 each turn, and if it hits it hits. You could trade the very next turn, or not be able to trade for 200 turns.

And of course it is broken on non-standard speeds, but you are cheating if you need to play those speeds anyway.

 

[TheMeInTeam]

I am pretty sure, the way most algorithms work in the game it does not drop 5% per turn. It just rolls 1 out of 20 each turn, and if it hits it hits. You could trade the very next turn, or not be able to trade for 200 turns.

And of course it is broken on non-standard speeds, but you are cheating if you need to play those speeds anyway.

Cmon obs. It isn't cheating. It's just lowering difficulty when pursuing certain (or should I say most?) strategies. There's a difference. Settings placed at the game start can give a human or AI a handicap, but technically they're "agreed upon", as in you're not changing gameplay or rules once it starts. Definitely not cheating.

I bet if you rigged it just right, the slower speeds would be HARDER. Like, putting lots of demanding AIs that don't like trading next to the player, and possibly having the AI get a fast GW/barbs attack you. Demands don't scale with speed either, so the AIs can really rack up the -modifiers. Usually, one gets around this just by making sure you have a friend and that the others hate other people more, but sometimes it's a tad rough.

That said, I find marathon easier usually, and quick harder. I find minimal difference between normal and epic, actually (aka win %, war success, and time played actually winds up very, very close. I think I'm even 50/50 in terms of which speed I do better on immortal, which is my level ATM.). Probably because those are the two that are closest to each other in terms of scaling. God knows what would happen on deity though. I remember silverbullet saying something about blocking being much harder though because border pops take forever and those AI units just glide on by, but I guess that wouldn't matter in EVERY game.

 

[Gliese 581]

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=253208&highlight=pushing+begging

 

[royal62184]

If the AI has 200 gold in it's treasury should I ask for 200g then 190g then 180g if they fail or should i start more reasonable like 50g? What is a good begging practice because all i do is demand stuff from AIs I am more powerful than. I'd hate to beg for 90g and in reality i could've gotten 120g. I never beg so i'm curious.

 

[oyzar]

If you ask for gold and they refuse they won't give you anything that turn, so asking for too much is a bad thing, i am still curious how much you should ask for though...

 

[Gliese 581]

No because every time you make a demand the counter is reset (in fact added to any already existing counters). So just after you've asked for something you have 0% chance of success in successive attempts on the same turn. The only thing increasing your odds again are # of passed turns, as described in the other thread by Oedali:
http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=253208#12

Magnitude of gifts are also explained here. The longer you wait, the more gold you can receive. You can receive more from an AI that shares your landmass. YOu will receive less from more powerful AIs than weaker ones. The required attitude is pleased, a friendly AI will not treat you differently in this. Your gifts will always have zero effect on gifts and demands, it only affects their attitude toward you (our trade relations have been fair and forthright).