Microsoft stabbing Intel in the back?

[Gangor]

Microsoft has shown a full version of Windows running on chips usually found in mobile phones.

The desktop version of Windows was demonstrated working with three processors built around chips designed by UK firm Arm.

The demonstration is significant because before now Windows has been closely connected with Intel chips.

Microsoft would not be drawn on when the first products using these chips would go on sale.

As well as running Windows, Microsoft also showed the work it was doing to get applications such as Word, Powerpoint and Internet Explorer running on Arm chips.

Microsoft was doing the work to get a full version of Windows running on mobile chips in a bid to end the compromises people typically have to make when using portable gadgets, said Steven Sinofsky, president of the Windows and Windows Live division during the demo.

Also, he said, turning to Arm designed chips should mean lower power consumption and much improved battery life for future gadgets.

About 80% of all mobiles, including Apple's iPhone4, are built around chips made from Arm designs.

'Next Windows generation'

During its demonstration, Microsoft showed Windows running natively on chips made by Qualcomm, Texas Instruments and Nvidia.

Microsoft has a mobile version of Windows, known as Windows Phone 7, that already runs on Arm-designed chips. But, said Mr Sinofsky, Windows Phone 7 was aimed at smaller devices and the full version would be for larger tablets, slates and netbooks.

Mr Sinofsky would not say which version of Windows was running on its demonstration devices. He would only say that it was the "next generation of Windows". Many took this to be a reference to Windows 8, which is due in 2012 and is expected to support multi-touch interfaces - capabilities missing from Windows 7.

He also refused to speculate when the first Arm-powered devices running the full version of Windows would appear.

"We've got the chip work done and now we start talking to partners about what kind of devices we can make," he said.

Microsoft was also continuing its work with long-time partners Intel and AMD to get Windows working on the low-power processors they were producing.

The demonstration came during a briefing at the Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas held prior to the formal opening of the show. Microsoft boss Steve Ballmer will give the opening keynote and is expected to expand on the firm's plans for Windows on Arm.

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Will ARM now be looking to translate their success in mobile devices into the PC market?

 

[illram]

More market share for alternate chip manufacturers is great, down with Intel's monopoly!

 

[Mise]

As I understand it, Intel and AMD's operating model is to develop high power, high performance chips, and then scaling them down to capture consumer surplus by making basically the same product but cheaply differentiating them for different segments. That's worked pretty well on desktop computers, where power is ample, but on mobile platforms, it means that the chips aren't particularly power-efficient, and so drain battery life too quickly to be useful.

Intel and AMD have been trying to make processors specifically for low-power devices, such as netbooks, with some success. But it's clear that their business isn't geared to do this. Intel Atom chips, IIRC, just aren't very good. But they are still king on desktops, because they still excel at producing relatively high performance chips. It's just that they probably can't capture this growing sector of the market that demands low power processors for small/mobile devices.

Furthermore, whereas we in the West have a desktop in every house, and then possibly a smartphone or two between 4 family members, people in emerging markets don't have desktops but do have internet-enabled phones. Teenagers in South Korea don't use the family PC to go on the internet and chat to friends -- they use their internet phones. Middle-class Chinese people don't shop online using PCs, they do it on their phones. Indian farmers don't check rice prices and weather information on PCs, because they don't have one; they use their phones (mostly Nokia, btw). So the market for low power processors is going to grow massively as India, China, Brazil, and other Asian nations get richer, even if the West's new-found affinity for tablets and smartphones is just a fad.

So to answer the OP's question: No, probably not, but why would they want to? The growth market is in smaller devices with limited power supplies, so they're clearly not aiming for the desktop PC market where Intel and AMD are already well entrenched as industry leaders. Their processors are aimed at bringing desktop software to cheap, low-power devices, because that's where industry growth will come from.

 

[GoodGame]

More market share for alternate chip manufacturers is great, down with Intel's monopoly!

And Intel could just endorse Unix.

 

[MarineCorps]

More market share for alternate chip manufacturers is great, down with Intel's monopoly!

Not going to happen. ARM CPUs have a different instruction set then AMD and Intel so all these programs you use can't work on it. They would have to be written and complied for an and on a ARM CPU. And seeing as it's uncommon nowadays for a 64 bit program to come out, what do you think the odds of them releasing for a different type of CPU is going to be?

 

[Padma]

Microsoft's "problem" is that they cannot compete in the embedded/mobile device market (e.g., smart phones) because Windows only runs on x86 chips. As has been noted earlier, these draw way too much power in embedded/mobile situations. Until they make a version of Windows (and related apps like MS Office) that can run on ARM chips, they haven't got a chance of monopolizing/dominating that segment.

 

[illram]

Not going to happen. ARM CPUs have a different instruction set then AMD and Intel so all these programs you use can't work on it. They would have to be written and complied for an and on a ARM CPU. And seeing as it's uncommon nowadays for a 64 bit program to come out, what do you think the odds of them releasing for a different type of CPU is going to be?

? The article in the OP seems to say the opposite--MS is trying to move outside the Intel box.

My definition of "the market" is admittedly broad. Intel will likely control desktop computing for the foreseeable future--but what is the future of desktop computing? And if a shift away from desktops for the average consumer's computing needs means less dominance by MS, even better!

As Mise pointed out, we may be heading in the direction of smaller devices doing more of our computing than before. I would add we may also be moving towards more integration of things computers mainly do now--like streaming video--to household appliances or things like Tivo, Roku, video game systems, blu ray players, etc. If Intel can't keep up, I don't see a problem with that as a consumer. The more quality chip manufacturers that are trying to compete with one another the better--you can avoid things like Intel's announcement that they want to partner with media license holders to develop HD streaming content that works exclusively with intel chips.

 

[Zelig]

I don't see much news here, Microsoft and Intel are both huge, with many different divisions. They're pretty cooperative overall, but with two tech companies of this size, there are bound to be some issues where they have different goals for the same market.

edit: Nvidia also seems to be hopping on the ARM bandwagon: http://news.bigdownload.com/2011/01/05/ces-2011-nvidia-announces-plans-for-project-denver-arm-based/

 

[MarineCorps]

? The article in the OP seems to say the opposite--MS is trying to move outside the Intel box.

My definition of "the market" is admittedly broad. Intel will likely control desktop computing for the foreseeable future--but what is the future of desktop computing? And if a shift away from desktops for the average consumer's computing needs means less dominance by MS, even better!

As Mise pointed out, we may be heading in the direction of smaller devices doing more of our computing than before. I would add we may also be moving towards more integration of things computers mainly do now--like streaming video--to household appliances or things like Tivo, Roku, video game systems, blu ray players, etc. If Intel can't keep up, I don't see a problem with that as a consumer. The more quality chip manufacturers that are trying to compete with one another the better--you can avoid things like Intel's announcement that they want to partner with media license holders to develop HD streaming content that works exclusively with intel chips.

Ever year the desktops demise is predicted and every year those predictions fail to come true. As for intel's dominance they have been a monopoly for so long because they are a a monopoly. The ignorant masses know Intel and because they know the intel brand they trust the intel brand and hence they buy intel.

Microsoft's "problem" is that they cannot compete in the embedded/mobile device market (e.g., smart phones) because Windows only runs on x86 chips. As has been noted earlier, these draw way too much power in embedded/mobile situations. Until they make a version of Windows (and related apps like MS Office) that can run on ARM chips, they haven't got a chance of monopolizing/dominating that segment.

Microsoft has a long uphill battle there. With Android and iOS both having a firm grip in the market place it's going to be nearly impossible to dislodge them at this point in the game

 

[Mise]

No-one's predicting the "demise of the desktop", just that it clearly isn't a growth market. That's especially true in emerging markets, where smaller, mobile devices fit into budgets and lifestyles there far better than bulky, stationery desktops. The market for desktops may well grow over the next decade, but desktop processors will no doubt shrink as a proportion of the total market for processors, as the market for smaller, less power-hungry devices grows so much faster.

 

[illram]

Right, I don't think desktops will die off. Desktops are here to stay, but the desktop, and even the laptop, may be doing less "stuff" than before, depending on how consumers begin to adapt to and use more mobile devices and other alternate hardware for things that traditionally you could only use a computer for.

That's happened already with general internet browsing--lots of people surf the web on their phones and now their netbooks or ipads, and android and iOS seem to be shooting for a "second internet" where you don't jump from web site to web site, as much as you jump from app to app. (Which allows them a lot more control, also.) But that's maybe digressing a bit...

MS knows this, hence their desperate moves to make win 7 a mobile platform.

 

[civ_king]

Right, I don't think desktops will die off. Desktops are here to stay, but the desktop, and even the laptop, may be doing less "stuff" than before, depending on how consumers begin to adapt to and use more mobile devices and other alternate hardware for things that traditionally you could only use a computer for.

That's happened already with general internet browsing--lots of people surf the web on their phones and now their netbooks or ipads, and android and iOS seem to be shooting for a "second internet" where you don't jump from web site to web site, as much as you jump from app to app. (Which allows them a lot more control, also.) But that's maybe digressing a bit...

MS knows this, hence their desperate moves to make win 7 a mobile platform.

I still like (2560 ×) 1440p