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[UNIT] Mighty Ships Et Al

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Unit Graphics' started by MightyToad, Mar 6, 2020.

  1. PPQ_Purple

    PPQ_Purple Techpriest Engineer

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    Both the grenadier and rifleman are dressed for the Napoleonic period in game. By that time nobody used grenades any more as musketry had gotten good enough that it would have been suicidal. Really grenades shined in the period where they could reach out about as far as the average musket and that means the matchlock era. By the early mid 18th century once you get decent flintlocks everywhere they disappear. And from than on it's basically just really big burly guys with cool beards to scare the enemy into retreating.

    So depending on how you look at it either the in game grenadier is dressed wrong and should look and be in line time vise with the musketeer unit rather than the rifleman or he is dressed and placed right in the tech tree but should have a musket.


    Or you can be like me and just accept with a smile that the makers of CIV4 made the best ruling from a rule of cool perspective and be happy that they did.
     
  2. MightyToad

    MightyToad Sith Lord

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    Well, whether the vanilla grenadier is historically accurate, well executed, or even realistically practical isn't really the point. The Chinese army fielding guys that look like they should be guarding Buckingham palace sticks in my craw. They are decidedly European. Too European.
    So, for our purposes we need an alternative unit that is a counter to the rifleman. That also uses grenades just to be consistent with the vanilla grenadier.
     
  3. Sword_Of_Geddon

    Sword_Of_Geddon Mysterious Jungle Warrior

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    The Firelancer. First Gunpowder type unit in history. Would fit on the tech tree earlier than Grenadier but who says all civs have to develop the same right?

    https://riseofnations.fandom.com/wiki/Heavy_Fire_Lances




    The Rise of Nations incarnation basically uses the fire lance as a grenade or javelin. Firing and then picking up another.
     
  4. Walter Hawkwood

    Walter Hawkwood RI Court Painter

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    Well, Chinese of the firelance time also used actual grenades, very much as per the actual Civ 4 grenadier unit:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thunder_crash_bomb



    Firelances as they are commonly interpreted were more like one-shot close-range firearms (that you could later also stab with). It is quite unlikely that someone would carry more than one, as they were actually quite heavy and unwieldy, and their main use was still as a melee weapon afterwards. A somewhat accurate firelancer can be found in RI, but of course it's multi-shot due to the nature of Civ 4 animations (but then again, Civ 4 musketman also shouldn't be able to fire shot after shot as if he had a bolt-action rifle).
     
  5. MightyToad

    MightyToad Sith Lord

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    I actually did a half-assed firelance unit for a request several months back.
    Anyway, I made a "prototype" unfinished unit using the ancient chinese cannon to show what I have in mind. I used the Civ 5 atlatlist for the model. It is actually pretty close to what I had in mind anyway.
     

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  6. Walter Hawkwood

    Walter Hawkwood RI Court Painter

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    And again, there is a separate ancient Chinese weapon for it! :lol:

    What you came up with is a Crouching Tiger Cannon:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hu_dun_pao

    "a small cannon that was propped up at the muzzle end and pinned to the ground to deaden the recoil. This setup supposedly resembles a crouching tiger, giving the cannon its name"; you did one better than Civ 6 unit designers though, who took the name literally and gave the cannon tiger features... :rolleyes:
     
  7. Matsuda123

    Matsuda123 Prince

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    There is also a firelance unit in Rise of Asia...

    I would like to note that the Civ 6 cannon actually does exist, though way later than when the unit would be from.
     

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  8. PPQ_Purple

    PPQ_Purple Techpriest Engineer

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    And now you have my artistic wheels turning... stay tuned.
     
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  9. Sword_Of_Geddon

    Sword_Of_Geddon Mysterious Jungle Warrior

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    82112e444eeec8c2dd1b7f3ba992e451.jpg

    Some ideas, not requests. Sometimes slumps are cured by ideas for other projects, then you return to whatever it is you were planning on before.
    Ancient Greek Galleass, Bakuel already made what-if Roman units all the way to the modern era. Why not? Of coarse artistic license is allowed, its just concept art

    5516ea114347ed89e9bf78ac2b33f584.jpg

    Early Steam Era, Unicorn Stream Frigate of somekind

    f19e311e4fe401c8814d0ed20ee57f55.jpg

    Steampunk type landship.I thought what the heck right? Seems to have lots of cannons.
     
  10. MightyToad

    MightyToad Sith Lord

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    Yeah, I was originally planning to do a whole Mesoamerican renaissance line up. But the ships have taken 10x longer than anticipated. Only land unit that is really needed is the grenadier, and I'm drawing a blank on how to approach it.
    Civ 5 has two steampunk units. I haven't bothered with them because I think they are too fantasy. Especially the air units. No way in hell they could fly.

    Anyway, so I'm just uploading the Mesoamerican ships. A galleass, frigate, SOTL, and a galleon. The I was stuck on the frigate and galleass for a couple weeks. Those are also my least favorite. I think the SOTL turned out alright.


    https://forums.civfanatics.com/resources/mesoamerican-renaissance-ships.28707/
     
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  11. tantanmen

    tantanmen Warlord

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    I love ‘em all :thumbsup: Fantastic blend of colors, really imaginative. The lizard / serpent / Quetzalcoatl on the bows is awesome. I really like the galleon with its long roof (quarters? sorry I'm terribly ignorant). And all those cannons on the SOTL remind me of dragon scales, looks like a prickly dragon belly.

    Thank you MightyToad for creating a spectacular full line of Meso Ships :goodjob:
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2021
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  12. Sword_Of_Geddon

    Sword_Of_Geddon Mysterious Jungle Warrior

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    Yeah I can't thankyou enough! Now wherever you go next is uncharted waters :)

    Grenades. Actually that reminds me of the Mayan blowgunner. Perhaps a Bazooka like weapon could be used. Possibly make a more primitive looking weapon used by the Anti-Air or Anti-Tank units.
     
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  13. PPQ_Purple

    PPQ_Purple Techpriest Engineer

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    Just do a meso themed infantry with grenades from the regular grenadier. They need to fit into the same general art styling as the rest of the game. And historically speaking the closest thing those civs would have gotten to grenadiers is taking grenades off the Spanish.

    Also by god I love those ships. I am totally going to adapt them for lizardmen ships for FFH as soon as they come out.
     
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  14. Sword_Of_Geddon

    Sword_Of_Geddon Mysterious Jungle Warrior

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    Doesn't matter to me.

    Yeah his ships are amazing. Now I'm using his for the Mesoamericans, and the ones Chugg did for the South Americans(Which was what they were based on anyway, S.American native ships).
     
  15. Darkator

    Darkator Chieftain

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    I don't know if such things are done here, but is there a mod or a model of the European Union commander somewhere on this forum?
    I mean the model of Donald Tusk, Herman Van Rompuy (although I know that this man model exists) or Charles Michel
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2021
  16. Sword_Of_Geddon

    Sword_Of_Geddon Mysterious Jungle Warrior

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    Go to unit(if its a unit you want) or graphics requests(if its a leaderhead). This thread is for Toad's unit discussions or suggestions/ideas. BTW welcome to civfanatics.
     
  17. Darkator

    Darkator Chieftain

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  18. Sword_Of_Geddon

    Sword_Of_Geddon Mysterious Jungle Warrior

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    Toad have you decided which way you want to go with the Mesoamerican Grenadier?
     
  19. MightyToad

    MightyToad Sith Lord

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    No, I was trying to convert Kamehameha. It is an order of magnitude more difficult than I imagined. So far I have only rigged the face up, but the results are grotesque to say the least. The eyes are the biggest problem. I chose to rig it to pacals skeleton because I love his furious animation.



    I thought one of the elephant riders for the Carthaginian elephant looked promising for a body for a maya unit.
     

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  20. tantanmen

    tantanmen Warlord

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    :dubious: Woooow, that is an indecent amount of facial muscles. If he can't find a spot in the next Body Worlds exhibition, he already has a place in my heart :love:

    Thank you MightyToad, Furious Kamehameha has never looked better! :king:
     

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