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Militaristic Civs

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Strategy & Tips' started by BretP, Apr 9, 2003.

  1. BretP

    BretP The Lightbringer

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    I have been playing the new patch for PTW and it seems to me that the appearance of great leaders is more rare than it was in other versions of the game. Any one else notice this? I am playing my third game as a militaristic civ, and in my current game I have been at war for 300 yrs with france. I have taken 6 cities and had countless open field battles. I have not had any leaders produced, and most of my open field victories have been with elite units. What gives? I thought civs like the Celts and the Aztecs, where supposed to produce leaders more often. Isn't this the appeal of those civs. I mean cheap baracks are worthless if you build Sun Tzu, right?
     
  2. ButSam

    ButSam King

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    I had the same problem when I played Japan, Regent level, NOT PTW, v. 1.29f.

    I used the militaristic advantage like crazy, but until around 1900 when I wiped out the Babylonians, I never got a leader! This is after war to elimination with:

    Chinese
    Indians
    Persians

    And a lot of other skirmishes, especially when I had the Samurai. Most of my units were elite, needless to say.

    Sam
     
  3. cwood

    cwood Chieftain

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    Same here with Civ 3. i thionk that you have to have a unit that wins lat of battles without dying. so that what i think.
     
  4. Galcador

    Galcador Chieftain

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    The militaristic trait does not directly affect the chances of producing leaders. It can help indirectly, since it increases the chances of promotions, thereby helping to get more elites. But the chance of an elite victory producing a leader does not vary from civ to civ.
     
  5. bewareofgnomes

    bewareofgnomes Back Again

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    even so, in my game with the persians i have conquered 3 civs, but no great leaders. argghh. no sun tzu for me
     
  6. switch

    switch Chieftain

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    I find that if you get a leader, build the Heroic Epic, I find it improves your chances greatly, and you get many more after that. That way you can hurry wonders and get other small wonders. But the trick is getting the first one.
     
  7. cwood

    cwood Chieftain

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    ok so if you build this heroic Epic how would you construct it. i have taken out 6 civs down to the last civ. and i still don't have a great leader.
     
  8. ^Qudos

    ^Qudos Anti.Flag Superstar

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    hmmm it is odd, im playing as scandinavians right now and im beating germany with berserkers (god they own), got like 10 elites, no gl yet :( i guess ill have to try building artillery then sending my elites o.o
     
  9. Anti-EUA

    Anti-EUA Prince

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    it's just like that, BretP really. my last game i played egypt, and got !7! leaders! my first one in 3150 BC! i didn't know what to do sometimes. it's just pure luck!
     
  10. ses777

    ses777 Chieftain

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    The only way i have ever got a great leader (since i play as the babylonians i dont fight to much ) was thanks to a barbarian upsrising. I had an elite warrior that was fortified out in the wilderness and there happened to be an uprising of 20 barbarian horsemen. After i defeated them all, japan landed a regular warrior and a settler that i took out causing me to get a great leader. So the best bet is to sit by a barbarian camp and wait for an uprising then go find a lonely unit to destroy.
     
  11. bewareofgnomes

    bewareofgnomes Back Again

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    uprisings only occur when 2 civs enter a new age.
     
  12. Renata

    Renata homicidal jungle cat GOTM Staff

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    It's just chance. I've gotten a great leader with my first elite victory in a game, and I've had games where I win 50 or more elite battles without getting one.

    @cwood - In order to build the heroic epic small wonder (and the military academy, for that matter) you need to first get a leader and build an army with it, and then that army has to win a battle. (Just like with getting a leader in the first place, that battle has to be against another civ, not versus barbarians.)

    Renata
     
  13. cwood

    cwood Chieftain

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    ok
     
  14. BretP

    BretP The Lightbringer

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    So, if I understand everyone, the chances of getting a leader are not significantly improved by choosing a Militaristic Civ. That STINKS, I thought that would be one of the major draws of those civs. Do other people that play with Military based civs build Sun Tzu? It is one of my favortie Wonders.
     
  15. jack merchant

    jack merchant Internationalist

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    Well, the odds are improved because, as has been mentioned, militaristic civs are more likely to produce elite units, and having more elite units fighting means a higher chance of getting GL's eventually. But still, it's possible to go without GL's for a long time; that just means you were extremely unlucky in that particular game.
    Like Renata, I have had games where my very first elite victory spawned a GL (you just can't beat the Pyramids in 2750 BC !).
     
  16. farting bob

    farting bob ThEy MaDe Me Do iT.

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    once you get a elite unit, theres still only a 1/16 chance of leader. 1/12 wityh heroic epic. is this crrect? anyway, so if you had more than 10 elite units fighing, then you would be very unlucky not to get a single leader fom them over a long war.
     
  17. nihil8r

    nihil8r space . . . madness

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    yes as bob says there is a 1/16 chance for a normal leader, 1/12 with a heroic epic.

    but if you have only 10 elites in a long war you are doing something wrong. build more barracks and when a unit is promoted to elite, don't let him die. protect him and only use him to attack wounded divisions.

    here's a snippet from another post of mine i am way too lazy to link to ...

    in my current (huge) game as a military civ i've spawned so may great leaders i've lost track. i'm in the modern ages now and have built the following wonders with a leader: sun tzu's, bach's cathedral, copernicus' observatory, newton's university, sistine chapel, theory of evolution, hoover dam, & seti program. i earned a leader the turn i built the theory, letting me rush build the hoover dam immediately afterwards. i didn't even have any factories made yet. i built the pyramids, leonardo's workshop and the great library from scratch. i have a leader waiting to rush the internet. and i'm pretty confident i will get the other wonders too, seeing as i have 125 tanks and 375 bradleys.

    so the moral is: unless it's a hyper-critical wonder (read - great library), build that army, get a victory, and build that heroic epic. not only does the epic churn out great culture (4/turn) but then you statistically will create a leader about every 12 elite victories.


    yay
     
  18. BretP

    BretP The Lightbringer

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    Thanks for all of the great info, I am really just frastrated about not getting a leader at all.
     

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