Miscellaneous questions

[0rion79]

Hi all, I would like to use your experience for some more questions.

1 - how do you use great persons? Tirggering golden age? As super-specialists? Building special buildings? And for corporations? Do you "store" the first one that you get, waiting for them?

2 - there are a couple of abilities for units that I don't understand very well. Assuming that I have a foreign version of the game, there should be one named "fisrt strike" or "sneak attack" or similar: what does it do? Is it better or worst than the one that gives +10% of power?

There is a promotion, "march", that allows "healing when moving", but how does it work? If I create a unit with the promotion "medic 1" and "march", does that unit heal all the others in the same square even when moving? Or only units with "march" promotion may be healed when moving?

3 - What is your best "combo" for corporations? I've read the walkthrough here on civfanatics, but which cone do you use together in the same city?

4 - how do you deal with silly requests from other tribes, when they ask for silly requests like gifts, tributes, stop trading with foes or when they ask you to declare war against somebody else? Even playing as a pacifist, I often refuse to give gifts/tributes, declaring war or stop trading but in this way I get all other tribes barely friendly and never entusiastic toward me, so that almost always every other tribes abstain when voting for UN president! Any hint?

5 - no matter how stupid this question may be, but why Pyramids are considered so powerful? what kind of government to you use after building them?

Thank you! If I have other questions, I'll ask later

 

[Refar]

1 - how do you use great persons? Tirggering golden age? As super-specialists? Building special buildings? And for corporations? Do you "store" the first one that you get, waiting for them?

One GS will make a Akademy in the city you choosen to be your Super-Science-City. Often this - but not necessarily - this will be the first GS i pop. The first Great Prophet should make a Holy Shrine - if you have a Holy City. The Rest is VERY situational. Settling (super specialist) is very good, especially early in the game, as you will have the benefit for a long time. But depending on what (and how badly) you need right now you might bulb a tech (with GS) or speed up a Wonder (GE).

Keeping them sleeping for a long time is rarely a good idea - you are missing the benefits. It is better to plan ahead and control - its possible at least to some extent - what type of GP you pop, then you dont need to worry that much about having the riht one for Corps.

2 - there are a couple of abilities for units that I don't understand very well. Assuming that I have a foreign version of the game, there should be one named "fisrt strike" or "sneak attack" or similar: what does it do? Is it better or worst than the one that gives +10% of power?

Drill promotions give first strikes. Generally it helps you more when you are bout even odds with the enemy, or alredy has a good odds of winning. And again what is better, depends. Most of the time specific promotions to counter specific enemy will be the best in the field, While City Raider line is i.g. good for city attacks.

The March unit will heal only itself when moving.

I skip 3 and 4 as i am more into Staate Property (no Corps) and generally bad at diplo (Allways refuse, so everyone hates me)

5 - no matter how stupid this question may be, but why Pyramids are considered so powerful? what kind of government to you use after building them?

The one that benefits you the most This will often be Representation (Extra for bigger cites + extra for specialists). But the power of the Mids is not a specific Civc - its the avaiablity of them all... Running lots of Specialists -> go Rep. Got a pile of Gold from a trade and need to rush some Infrastructure -> Uni.Suffrage. Stuck in a prolonged war and WW- mounts up -> Police Staate. (Tho i wouldn't switch too often, unless you are spiritual)

 

[Diamondeye]

1 - how do you use great persons? Tirggering golden age? As super-specialists? Building special buildings? And for corporations? Do you "store" the first one that you get, waiting for them?

Very few corps are worth it, imho. I usually run SP. GPs, I use for GAs, Academies, rushing (engis) or culture pop artist. Prophet ofc build shrines.

2 - there are a couple of abilities for units that I don't understand very well. Assuming that I have a foreign version of the game, there should be one named "fisrt strike" or "sneak attack" or similar: what does it do? Is it better or worst than the one that gives +10% of power?

Drill I: 1 First strike chance
Drill II: 1 First strike
Drill III: 2 First strike chances
Drill IV: 2 First Strikes

I like the drill promos - they're good at making sure your very strong troops take less damage (by having them elliminating enemies before real combat starts), or have weak units inflict a bit of damage. Drill II, III and IV each provides 20% protection frmo collateral damage, by the way.

There is a promotion, "march", that allows "healing when moving", but how does it work? If I create a unit with the promotion "medic 1" and "march", does that unit heal all the others in the same square even when moving? Or only units with "march" promotion may be healed when moving?

March means that the unit itself heals even if moving. Normally a unit has to fortify / skip to heal. It affects only the unit with the promotion.

3 - What is your best "combo" for corporations? I've read the walkthrough here on civfanatics, but which cone do you use together in the same city?

Sid's Sushi, Sid's Sushi, Sid's Sushi. Sorry, only corp really worth using imho.

4 - how do you deal with silly requests from other tribes, when they ask for silly requests like gifts, tributes, stop trading with foes or when they ask you to declare war against somebody else? Even playing as a pacifist, I often refuse to give gifts/tributes, declaring war or stop trading but in this way I get all other tribes barely friendly and never entusiastic toward me, so that almost always every other tribes abstain when voting for UN president! Any hint?

Give in if the enemy is very strong, very far behind in tech, or you think they will declare on you if you reject. Also, try to be the best on the power graph, that way less people will threaten you. I usually do this and then, everytime someone weak threatens me, I reject and threat them to gift me all of their gold. Not that the AI learns, but it feels nice to at least try to learn em.

5 - no matter how stupid this question may be, but why Pyramids are considered so powerful? what kind of government to you use after building them?

Normally, a SE (Specialist Economy) benefits most from representation (which also provides a good deal of ), and Hereditary Rule is fine aswell, although you can tech it easily. Someone runs pure cottage economy and goes Universal Suffrage with it, although that requires some ressources as you lack the from HR. Police State is adored by some warmongers and warmonger AIs.

 

[`DG`]

Hi all, I would like to use your experience for some more questions.

1 - how do you use great persons? Tirggering golden age? As super-specialists? Building special buildings? And for corporations? Do you "store" the first one that you get, waiting for them?

depends on strategy. Academies are very obvious choices for great scientists, it's probably only in the late game where doing anything else with them will net you better results. Though if you're at war or something advancing a tech might save you.

I leave golden ages until the late game as usually other options will accrue a much bigger benefit when there is a long time left.

2 - there are a couple of abilities for units that I don't understand very well. Assuming that I have a foreign version of the game, there should be one named "fisrt strike" or "sneak attack" or similar: what does it do? Is it better or worst than the one that gives +10% of power?

During the course of 1 turn, unit's take it in turns to attack each other until one is defeated. An attack is like a dice roll: a 10-strength unit get's to roll 10 dice.

If your unit loses 20% of it's health after an attack, it has 20% less dice to roll when it is your units turn.

First strike makes the biggest difference when you have a strong unit against a horde of weaker units.

There is a promotion, "march", that allows "healing when moving", but how does it work? If I create a unit with the promotion "medic 1" and "march", does that unit heal all the others in the same square even when moving? Or only units with "march" promotion may be healed when moving?

only units with "march" promotion may be healed when moving

3 - What is your best "combo" for corporations? I've read the walkthrough here on civfanatics, but which cone do you use together in the same city?

too dependant on strategy.

4 - how do you deal with silly requests from other tribes, when they ask for silly requests like gifts, tributes, stop trading with foes or when they ask you to declare war against somebody else? Even playing as a pacifist, I often refuse to give gifts/tributes, declaring war or stop trading but in this way I get all other tribes barely friendly and never entusiastic toward me, so that almost always every other tribes abstain when voting for UN president! Any hint?

negotiate whenever possible. Otherwise it's a case of weighing up the +/- relations hit against what they want. If the other civ is at war the +/- seems to double because there's the "you gave us help"/"you refused to help us in war-time" category, which would mean usually helping but then they're usually asking for some big military tech you really dont want to give.

I find requests annoying TBH, on balance you nearly always lose out unless your gameplay is reliant on having friends.

5 - no matter how stupid this question may be, but why Pyramids are considered so powerful? what kind of government to you use after building them?

Again depends on strategy, it just means the bonuses from the different governments are available a *lot* earlier in the game.

Government again depends on your strategy. For me, representation! +3 happiness in biggest X cities to me means +3 population in your best cities. +2 per specialist is pretty good too.
I usually move off representation and onto Universal Sufferage for the hammer on towns and to rush buildings on my smaller cities that have lots of potential.

 

[Wolfshanze]

#5... the Pyramids... most folks jump to Representation once they get the Pyramids... Representation takes some time to get to by teching, and it's just easier to build the Pyramids... you can get a good jump on the enemy civs in techs if you can get a good government going early.

 

[MrCynical]

3 - What is your best "combo" for corporations? I've read the walkthrough here on civfanatics, but which cone do you use together in the same city?

Sushi and Mining Inc are generally the best combination in your own cities unless you're pushing for a culture victory (when Sushi/Civ Jewellers/Creative Constructions is better). The others can still be valuable to spread to foreign civs - if they aren't useful to you they probably aren't much good to the AI, but you still get the same HQ gold.

5 - no matter how stupid this question may be, but why Pyramids are considered so powerful? what kind of government to you use after building them?

Representation is generally the civic of choice in the early stages if you have the Pyramids - the extra happiness is worth a lot, and you might pick up a few extra beakers. The Pyramids also give great engineer points, which is quite valuable in itself.

 

[Solomwi]

On #3, I prefer Sid's Sushi/Civ Jewelers/CreateCon to the Sid's/Mining combo unless my empire is really production poor. I'll also try to found AlumCo for a few reasons: GS' other uses don't shine as brightly in the late game, denial to the AI, and to augment CreateCon (since aluminum is a CC resource). That's probably a function of the fact that I play mainly huge maps, so gathering enough resources to make CreateCon a significant production booster isn't hard. Going that route costs me a Great Artist over Sid's/Mining, but Civ Jewelers is such a cash cow that I find it worth the artist. I can usually use it to support my entire corporate enterprise without having to spread them internationally. I'm not saying international spread is necessarily undesirable, but it is reliant on the whims of the AI, who may decide to switch into SP or Merc, negating the effects of my corporations in his cities, or may already be in SP, in which case I can't spread it to begin with. Incorporating CJ removes that reliance on AI civics (or on changing them via espionage/diplomacy). CC's culture boost is nice, too, particularly when I go on late game conquest benders.

 

[Willem]

2 - there are a couple of abilities for units that I don't understand very well. Assuming that I have a foreign version of the game, there should be one named "fisrt strike" or "sneak attack" or similar: what does it do? Is it better or worst than the one that gives +10% of power?

Basically the unit with First Strike gets in a free shot against an opponent before it gets the chance to make it's attack. So by the time it does, it might already have some damage against it, making it easier to defeat.

 

[0rion79]

I think I've understood... and it looks like an ability to use only AFTER building up an unit power. If the unit is weak, improving its first strike makes it not of a great use, except for weakening other units.

 

[Willem]

I think I've understood... and it looks like an ability to use only AFTER building up an unit power. If the unit is weak, improving its first strike makes it not of a great use, except for weakening other units.

Not at all. Having First Strike can make even more of a difference with a weak unit. It helps to even the odds against a more powerful opponent by causing it some damage before it actually attacks. If you build up a unit's strength first, you don't really need that promotion. Although it's more of a defensive promotion than anything else. It's good to give to your secondary Archers/Longbowman who are guarding your cities, especially since they already start with one.

 

[Diamondeye]

Not at all. Having First Strike can make even more of a difference with a weak unit. It helps to even the odds against a more powerful opponent by causing it some damage before it actually attacks. If you build up a unit's strength first, you don't really need that promotion. Although it's more of a defensive promotion than anything else. It's good to give to your secondary Archers/Longbowman who are guarding your cities, especially since they already start with one.

You can argue that it is a protective promotion, but try playing Churchill and swarm pro/chm redcoats, and I'll guarantee you'll be loving the drill promo for attackers as well.

Btw, concerning the above, does anyone know what the defender will be in a stack with Drill IV redcoats and Drill II Combat I Medic I redcoats?

 

[Solomwi]

The problem with first strike on a weaker unit is that the chance of the first strike doing damage is the same as the unit winning a normal round of combat. Ergo, the weaker the unit (relative to the opponent, of course), the less chance that the first strike makes a difference. If you can get it on up the drill line, though, a weaker unit with several first strikes has a decent shot at taking out a stronger unit, because 1 or 2 successful strikes evens up the number of "round wins" needed to kill the enemy, which is the biggest factor in evening the odds of a fight. On a stronger unit, first strikes are all about coming out of the battle with as many hp remaining as possible.

 

[0rion79]

hmm.... so, I.E., when i get a unit that I want to keep alive, like the one merged with a great general, it is a good idea to focus on first strike to prevent it from dying by casualities in war, right?

I even use it when I'm preparing an army: I usually build a doctor unit, another unit that is trained to be stronger upon hills, another into trees and another one with first strike to rexist assaults where no other defense is available, but I never used it when assaulting.

So, do you believe that it would be worthy of giving it to copters or tanks?

 

[Solomwi]

It can be good on both. For instance, a "drill only" gunship facing a tank without combat promotions is fighting at 48 vs. 28, and has a R of 1.7. The odds of it winning a particular round are, if memory serves, 48/(48+28), or approximately 63%. Its odds of winning a first strike round are the same, i.e., 63%. So if the gunship has three first strikes (as opposed to first strike chances), on average it will get about 2 rounds per battle in which it does damage at no risk of taking damage if it loses. That, of course, helps it survive the battle with fewer hp lost than without the first strikes.

If, on the other hand, you have a drill-only archer going up against an unpromoted tank, the odds of winning an individual battle are 3/31, or about 10%. You'll need 10 first strikes to average just one "free victory" per battle. In all likelihood, the archer's first strikes aren't going to make any difference, because the archer is unlikely to win any of those rounds, so when the first strike rounds are over, it's likely to still be a full strength tank fighting the archer. If the archer does win a FS round, the damage it does isn't going to make much of a difference, either. If it still takes 8 rounds to kill the tank, your first strike win was meaningless with regard to that battle.

Where you may get in trouble giving a GG unit first strikes is that the calculator figures them into the odds of winning, and that may bring that unit up to defend earlier than you want him to. For a GG-medic, I wouldn't even give it first strikes unless it was far, far weaker than my other units. Even then, the first strikes would act as just a desperate hope, since a stack capable of wiping out or wearing down the stronger units probably won't be slowed by a far weaker unit, even one with first strikes.

By the way, note that first strikes change the victory odds, but not R. XP gained from combat is based completely on R and whether you're attacking or defending (XP = 4/R if attacking, 2/R if defending). So, generally speaking, a drill-line unit will gain more XP from a battle than a similar combat-line unit with the same victory odds (since the combat unit gets the odds from increasing its strength, and thus R).