Modern civilizations bet

[pisku]

My guess of the 10 modern age civilizations (including confirmed ones):

AMERICA
1. USA (Benjamin Franklin as a leader already showed in videos) CONFIRMED
2. MEXICO (Revealed in the spain video) CONFIRMED
EUROPE
3. FRANCE (Revealed in videos and photos, also showed in the Charlemagne reveal video) CONFIRMED
4. UNITED KINGDOM (Big chances since the normans are in the game) or GERMANY (Almost secure bet)
MIDDLE EAST AND AFRICA
5. BUGANDA (Confirmed in the Fireaxis website and hinted in videos) CONFIRMED
6. OTTOMAN EMPIRE (I think is almost safe to say is the natural evolution of the abbasid kingdom)
ASIA
7. JAPAN (Confirmed in photos and videos) CONFIRMED
8. MUGHAL INDIA (Confirmed in the official website and in photos) CONFIRMED
OTHER
9. SIAM (Could be as a natural evolution form the pacific civilizations like Majapahit)
10. CHINA (Almost secure but could be wrong)

 

[Zaarin]

Welcome!

I agree with your list, except I think #4 will be Russia as we've seen what looks like Russian architecture--but it could less likely be German. I think we can rule out Britain. Also Siam has been all but confirmed by the screenshot labeled "Siam Modern," and Qing China seems very likely based on the Chinese leak that predicted Confucius, Han China, Ming China, and Qing China (it's currently been correct about three out of four of those). The Ottomans make sense; I'm only hesitant because we've seen no trace of them--but then, we've seen very little of the Modern Age.

 

[foodyboi]

Seems about right.

I can't see Britain not being there and we have had some significant hints that it is.

Its either Russia or Germany.

Russia may not be in base due to current geopolitics. Germany feels less likely since Charlamagne's reveal.

 

[Lonecat Nekophrodite]

About Siam being Southeast Asian Modern Civ is confirmed. but with Sinic queen ruling is very off to me. I'm not sure why Kukrit Pramos is not chosen? since it is even possible to give him Ravana Regalia as graphical representation since he himself did a 'Political Khon' stage shows back in 70s.

 

[AriochIV]

Since we have seen several pieces of evidence for both Russia and Germany (Russian and German tank versions, and the leak from ESRB about leaders who fit the descriptions of Catherine and Frederick), and no direct evidence for either Britain or Ottomans (or any other Middle-Eastern modern civ), I think the safe money has to be on the last two being Russia and Germany.

That's not my personal preference, just what I think is most likely at this point.

 

[Zaarin]

Since we have seen several pieces of evidence for both Russia and Germany (Russian and German tank versions, and the leak from ESRB about leaders who fit the descriptions of Catherine and Frederick), and no direct evidence for either Britain or Ottomans (or any other Middle-Eastern modern civ), I think the safe money has to be on the last two being Russia and Germany.

That's not my personal preference, just what I think is most likely at this point.

I mostly agree with this, except that in Civ7 the presence of a leader does not imply the presence of their civ. It seems strange that we'd have two European civs in Antiquity, two European civs in Exploration, but three in Modern. With France already confirmed, I low-key expect Ottomans to replace Germany and Germany to follow in Crossroads of the World. And yet it's possible...

but with Sinic queen ruling is very off to me.

Leaders and civs are not connected. Tecumseh or Amina or Ben Franklin can lead Siam if you like.

 

[AriochIV]

I mostly agree with this, except that in Civ7 the presence of a leader does not imply the presence of their civ. It seems strange that we'd have two European civs in Antiquity, two European civs in Exploration, but three in Modern. With France already confirmed, I low-key expect Ottomans to replace Germany and Germany to follow in Crossroads of the World. And yet it's possible...

The leader mentions aren't strong evidence, but at least they are some evidence. A Middle Eastern civ like the Ottomans seems very logical; unfortunately there is zero evidence for them so far, and Firaxis has shown that they are very willing to make choices that we don't think are logical.

Of course anything is possible at this point, and I'm not saying that this is what will happen. But if we're betting, I have to go with some evidence over none.

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

We have seen Panzers, and they are far too detailed and identifiable to be a generic unit. This indicates Germany is in.

Similarly, @JNR13 dug up a Russian city hall that they posted here:

Modern Buildings Guide - Visual Variations - Let's guess the gameplay!

Currently incomplete but already posting to speculate together. Will update it with more info as it becomes available. Antiquity Building visual guide: https://forums.civfanatics.com/threads/antiquity-buildings-guide-gameplay-visual-incl-cultural-variations.692419/ Exploration Building visual...

forums.civfanatics.com

So, I don't think we are looking at Britain or Ottomans, as shocking as that might be to consider.

 

[Xandinho]

So, I don't think we are looking at Britain or Ottomans, as shocking as that might be to consider.

One hypothesis I've been considering is that the British will appear in 'Right to Rule' with a renowned historical monarch as their leader, alongside Big Ben, since this wonder hasn't been seen elsewhere. Although Oxford University was seen, I believe Big Ben is more iconic for the British Empire. Additionally, Oxford University might fit better in the Exploration Age, which would make more historical sense.

 

[Alexander's Hetaroi]

1. America
2. French
3. Germany/Prussia
4. Russia
5. Buganda
6. Mexico
7. Mughals
8. Siam
9. Meiji Japan
10. Qing China

 

[Eagle Pursuit]

One hypothesis I've been considering is that the British will appear in 'Right to Rule' with a renowned historical monarch as their leader, alongside Big Ben, since this wonder hasn't been seen elsewhere. Although Oxford University was seen, I believe Big Ben is more iconic for the British Empire. Additionally, Oxford University might fit better in the Exploration Age, which would make more historical sense.

Yeah, Big Ben (or more correctly, Elizabeth Tower) is most likely going to be the British wonder, unless they are introduced on Crossroads for some reason. Although, I wouldn't mind seeing St. Paul's Cathedral.

 

[Nic@Melbourne]

I was a big believer that Abbasid would go to Ottoman
This transition list by Cidmire convinced me otherwise.

Also, I think that having Chola -> Siam solves the puzzle of where the Abbasids go. my base game 30 at this point:

aksum > songhai > buganda
egypt > abbasid > mughal
greece > norman > britain
rome > spain > france
persia > mongolia > russia
maurya > chola > siam
han > ming > qing
khmer > majapahit > meiji
mississippi > hawaii > america
maya > inca > mexico

 

[Nic@Melbourne]

Hopefully an expansion gives us Hattusa-Byzantium-Ottoman

 

[sTAPler27]

My guess of the 10 modern age civilizations (including confirmed ones):

AMERICA
1. USA (Benjamin Franklin as a leader already showed in videos) CONFIRMED
2. MEXICO (Revealed in the spain video) CONFIRMED
EUROPE
3. FRANCE (Revealed in videos and photos, also showed in the Charlemagne reveal video) CONFIRMED
4. UNITED KINGDOM (Big chances since the normans are in the game) or GERMANY (Almost secure bet)
MIDDLE EAST AND AFRICA
5. BUGANDA (Confirmed in the Fireaxis website and hinted in videos) CONFIRMED
6. OTTOMAN EMPIRE (I think is almost safe to say is the natural evolution of the abbasid kingdom)
ASIA
7. JAPAN (Confirmed in photos and videos) CONFIRMED
8. MUGHAL INDIA (Confirmed in the official website and in photos) CONFIRMED
OTHER
9. SIAM (Could be as a natural evolution form the pacific civilizations like Majapahit)
10. CHINA (Almost secure but could be wrong)

Honestly while i'm glad Mexico is in the game It feels weird that they evolve from Spain. LIke I understand their connections but it would kind of feel like if the UK was the successor to Majapahit instead of the US. I get Spain has a lot more cultural influence in the region but I feel like the Aztecs seem like the more fitting evolution given they're indigenous to the land and I feel like modern Mexico is less tied to Spain than the US is to the UK. Mexico and Spain seem to have a relationship with colonization still looming in the background. The US feels more like it sees itself more inline with Europe because despite its differences it allies more with Western Europe than it does countries on its own continent.

Also I'd really like to see modern China being the current state of China, I know it's unlikely given their strict censorship but if Mao was the leader in the original anything's possible. The biggest worry is having to paint the country in a certain light to appease censors.

 

[Evolena]

My bet:
America, Britain, Buganda, French Empire, Meiji Japan, Mexico, Mughal India, Qing China, Russia, Siam

 

[Bast]

My guess of the 10 modern age civilizations (including confirmed ones):

AMERICA
1. USA (Benjamin Franklin as a leader already showed in videos) CONFIRMED
2. MEXICO (Revealed in the spain video) CONFIRMED
EUROPE
3. FRANCE (Revealed in videos and photos, also showed in the Charlemagne reveal video) CONFIRMED
4. UNITED KINGDOM (Big chances since the normans are in the game) or GERMANY (Almost secure bet)
MIDDLE EAST AND AFRICA
5. BUGANDA (Confirmed in the Fireaxis website and hinted in videos) CONFIRMED
6. OTTOMAN EMPIRE (I think is almost safe to say is the natural evolution of the abbasid kingdom)
ASIA
7. JAPAN (Confirmed in photos and videos) CONFIRMED
8. MUGHAL INDIA (Confirmed in the official website and in photos) CONFIRMED
OTHER
9. SIAM (Could be as a natural evolution form the pacific civilizations like Majapahit)
10. CHINA (Almost secure but could be wrong)

This but replace Ottomans with Germany/Prussia. I think Ottomans and Russia come in Crossroads of the World.

 

[Krikkit1]

America
Buganda
France
Meijii
Mexico
Mughal
Prussia?
Qing?
Russia?
Siam

? for the unconfirmed

 

[untitledjuan]

Honestly while i'm glad Mexico is in the game It feels weird that they evolve from Spain. LIke I understand their connections but it would kind of feel like if the UK was the successor to Majapahit instead of the US. I get Spain has a lot more cultural influence in the region but I feel like the Aztecs seem like the more fitting evolution given they're indigenous to the land and I feel like modern Mexico is less tied to Spain than the US is to the UK. Mexico and Spain seem to have a relationship with colonization still looming in the background. The US feels more like it sees itself more inline with Europe because despite its differences it allies more with Western Europe than it does countries on its own continent.

Also I'd really like to see modern China being the current state of China, I know it's unlikely given their strict censorship but if Mao was the leader in the original anything's possible. The biggest worry is having to paint the country in a certain light to appease censors.

Mexico, as a country, tried to build itself under a narrative centred around being the descendant of both the Aztec Empire AND New Spain/Spain. This is particularly true after the Mexican Revolution and after Benito Juárez became president. Before those two major events, however, Mexico was basically a country ruled exclusively by descendants of Spanish colonists (and even an Austrian Habsburg emperor). It was even briefly an "European-style" Empire of Mexico with an ethnically Spanish/Criollo royal family.

Moreover, most people, probably the majority of Mexicans, have Spanish ancestors, as well as indigenous ancestors. They speak Spanish and, arguably, the Mexican government, as did most post-colonial nations in the Americas, continued the Spanish Empire's policy of culturally assimilating the remaining Natives into a "unified" Mexican identity which leaned more on their Spanish/Western and Catholic heritage. This is true, especially, before the Mexican Revolution.

That's not the case, for instance, with Majapahit, which was an "indigenous" Indonesian empire which had no previous history of Dutch, British or any European migration, colonization and/or conquest, as Mexico did have. Modern Indonesia was formed after being just conquered by the Dutch, but Mexico was conquered and settled by Spanish people. In addition to that, Mexico, and Latin America in general, kept on receiving Spanish migrants after independence and up to the present-day, but especially during the Spanish Civil War.

Majapahit could, and did exist without any European influence, of course, but Mexico just wouldn't exist as it is if it hadn't been a Spanish colony/kingdom/viceroyalty.

Of course the Exploration Age Aztecs will lead to Mexico in the Modern Age in some DLC in the future, but them ALSO coming from Spain is actually historically correct and a very safe bet.

 

[Historrick]

One hypothesis I've been considering is that the British will appear in 'Right to Rule' with a renowned historical monarch as their leader, alongside Big Ben, since this wonder hasn't been seen elsewhere. Although Oxford University was seen, I believe Big Ben is more iconic for the British Empire. Additionally, Oxford University might fit better in the Exploration Age, which would make more historical sense.

As weird as it would be to not have Britain in the base game with all the previous talk about Roman > Norman > British London, this does make sense, and I agree that Big Ben is a much more sensible Modern-era Wonder for Britain. Given the theme of the pack, maybe we'd also get Scotland in this pack as an Exploration era civ providing an alternative route in to leading Britain.

 

[Evie]

I was a big believer that Abbasid would go to Ottoman
This transition list by Cidmire convinced me otherwise.

It's a plausible theory, then again I would argue that Mongolia into Mughal is equally plausible, and that leaves Abbasid to go into Ottomans. It could really swing either way.

As to art and leaders, the fact that there is generic art in this game and that we know leaders without civs are there rather strongly to me lean against reading too much into the hints of arts we've received. It could be germany (which would replace Britain as the Norman offshot to represent some kind of germanic continuation, as poor a link as that is), it coudl be Russia (as Mongolia offshot), but I'd still consider both cases extremely speculative and free of any meaningful evidence. We have hints that they might be there, and I would still say Ed Beach's Norman-Britain thing is a stronger hint than a few arts resemblance.