OzzyKP
Emperor
Another issue, if this is still under development, is that when you decline to recruit a founding father the option keeps coming up every turn and you aren't able to recruit any other founding fathers.
[MODMOD] PTSD v.2.6.x for We The People 4.1 - NEW: More or Less More or Less!
- Thread starter Ramstormp
- Start date
Ramstormp
Warlord
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I am getting close to having a sort of backpaddled version that fixes those and other issues somewhat.
I got tired of walking the treasures around all over the map, so I lowered the odds of getting any, but I am not seeing any either even in my fixed version, so maybe they need higher odds.
OzzyKP
Emperor
Yea, I've not seen a single one. I'm currently playing on the gigantic america's map so I've had a ton of chances.
mine_turtle_cv
Chieftain
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- Oct 30, 2024
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Hiya Ramstormp,
Finally got around to installing this modmod (PTSD v2.5.7) and some graphics are missing. Default WTP 4.1 working without issues.
Would you know what I can do to investigate why this is missing? The issue gets more aggravated (also buttons start missing) after I install PTSD_ART v.3.1 .
I am suspecting some OS component on my system may not be installed. Reinstalled PTSD 3 times already following instructions from the second post in this thread.
Finally got around to installing this modmod (PTSD v2.5.7) and some graphics are missing. Default WTP 4.1 working without issues.
Would you know what I can do to investigate why this is missing? The issue gets more aggravated (also buttons start missing) after I install PTSD_ART v.3.1 .
I am suspecting some OS component on my system may not be installed. Reinstalled PTSD 3 times already following instructions from the second post in this thread.
Attachments
Ramstormp
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Did you install it in the Colonization game folder creating a new folder named 'Mods', or did you stick it in the Mods folder that is automatically created in My Documents/My Games/Civ4 Colonization? It looks like you may have done the latter based on the look of the fonts.
Another thing you need to make sure you do is set the Beta version to Original_Release_Unsupported in Steam.
Also you could try playing the vanilla version a short while and then go back and try the mod again.
I am not seeing the same problems you do on my other computer, but I have a tendency to deceive myself into thinking that everything in life is purring along perfectly, when in actuality it is a complete dysfunctional mess.
mine_turtle_cv
Chieftain
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I have the GOG Civ 4 Complete version.
The path is: drive_c/GOG Games/Civilization IV Complete/Civ4Colonization/Mods/
It contains 'We The People' directory with 'Assets', 'PrivateMaps', etc.
Made a zipped backup of it, and renamed the original directory to PTSD.
Downloaded PTSD v2.5.7 and extracted it in PTSD above (former We The People) overwriting existing stuff.
The Documents path is: drive_c/users/USERNAME/Documents/My Games/Civ4Colonization/
MODS there is empty, and there's a CivilizationIV.ini which was edited from:
Mod = Mods\We The People\
to
Mod = Mods\PTSD\
The main menu looks good, but as you see, something is wrong.
Ramstormp
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There is also the clearing of the cache, which you should be able to do by holding down the SHIFT key while starting the game; or to make really sure clear it directly in Users/USERNAME/AppData somewhere (may sometimes be two different places). Users/USERNAME/AppData/Local/My Games/Civilization IV Colonization on my computer
What happens when you play a really old version of the Mod, like v1.5.3?
Other than that I have no idea. I'll try to figure out how to make a Github release of PTSD for you to fetch, and see what that does.
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mine_turtle_cv
Chieftain
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Appreciate the effort.
Emptied the cache in drive_c/users/USERNAME/AppData/Local/My Games/Civ4Colonization/cache/ - no improvement.
Mind you, I am playing all this on Linux, via Wine, so I'm wondering if this modmod maybe needs a specific dependency.
I have Visual C++ 2003, Python 2.6.2, MS XML CS 3.0 and 4.0 currently installed - which makes running WTP without issues.
Do I need anything else for this mod?
Emptied the cache in drive_c/users/USERNAME/AppData/Local/My Games/Civ4Colonization/cache/ - no improvement.
Mind you, I am playing all this on Linux, via Wine, so I'm wondering if this modmod maybe needs a specific dependency.
I have Visual C++ 2003, Python 2.6.2, MS XML CS 3.0 and 4.0 currently installed - which makes running WTP without issues.
Do I need anything else for this mod?
Ramstormp
Warlord
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Maybe try pasting in the Dll sources and recompiling yourself. I know nothing about Wine... other than that I get a 2 day hangover each time I have some .
OzzyKP
Emperor
Do you know what these variables do in the iYieldInfos file?
Also, it looks like you can set the buy price for goods, but the sell price can't be set independently of it. It is always X off from buy. Is there a way to separate those two values?
More importantly, is there a way to prevent the selling of certain products in Europe without affecting the ability to buy them? I'd love to better model mercantilism where the mother country refuses to buy manufactured goods from the colonies.
Code:
<bIsExportYield>1</bIsExportYield>
<iPriceChangeThreshold>1000</iPriceChangeThreshold>
<iPriceCorrectionPercent>1</iPriceCorrectionPercent>
<iEuropeVolumeAttrition>-5</iEuropeVolumeAttrition>
<iNativeConsumptionPercent>20</iNativeConsumptionPercent>
<iNativeHappy>0</iNativeHappy>
<iPower>0</iPower>
<iAsset>1</iAsset>Also, it looks like you can set the buy price for goods, but the sell price can't be set independently of it. It is always X off from buy. Is there a way to separate those two values?
More importantly, is there a way to prevent the selling of certain products in Europe without affecting the ability to buy them? I'd love to better model mercantilism where the mother country refuses to buy manufactured goods from the colonies.
Ramstormp
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What do I know, but lets see if I can figure it out...
- <bIsExportYield> has something to do with setting up automatic trade routes. Presumably it means that the yield will be set to be a default export from a city if set to '1'.
- <iPriceChangeThreshold> is used as denominator in a formula when changing overseas prices, with the numerator being the total amount of a yield bought in Europe (and I think Africa + Port Royal). So if you buy 2000 cotton/1000 iPriceChangeThreshold = 2; then add the 2 to: iBuyPriceLow + a random value within the range of: 'iBuyPriceHigh - iBuyPriceLow + 1' ... So if a yield's iBuyPriceHigh is 12 and the iBuyPriceLow is 5 then the random value is somewhere within 1 to 7 which is then added to the iBuyPriceLow of 5 and then add the '2' you calculated with the iPriceChangeThreshold... Something like that, chuckle.
- <iPriceCorrectionPercent> A random value within 1 - 100 needs to be less than this value times the result of the abovementioned formula minus the original iYieldBuyPrice in order to trigger a price-change. So lets say you rolled a 6 up there then adding it up to a total of 13. Then remove iBuyPrice>5< again from the 13 (who knows why!?). Well, 8 x <iPriceCorrectionPercent>1<... is of course still 8. so you would have a 8% chance of the yield price changing that turn. So set iPriceCorrectionPercent to a higher value and that should change the prices more often, if I am understanding it correctly... I mean the word 'correction' makes you think that it is supposed to be helping it get on the right track in some way and it doesn't appear very 'percent' like to me either, so I might be confused.
- <iEuropeVolumeAttrition> is supposedly used to get the prices to slowly move back to the how they were originally set, but I am not understanding how it is doing that exactly. It is used as the value-changing parameter in a function called changeYieldBoughtTotal, but I am not sure what sense changeYieldBoughtTotal(-5) makes. Aha! I guess if you quit buying a product the game will eventually act as if you never bought any, and thus influence the prices to return to closer to original value. Buy 100 tools, prices go up, then don't buy any tools for 20 turns, and it is as if you never bought a pair of plyers in your life, prices move back towards normal.
- <iNativeConsumptionPercent> is another not very percent-like tag (but maybe I don't even know what percent means... it means per-eighty!... Do I look like someone who didn't get a B- in Calculus 1!?). The natives will lose yields each turn at a rate of Total amount of all yields stored/ (storage capacity x number of cities per tribe x iNativeConsumptionPercent / 80). So lets say they have 2500 non-food-stuff stored total / (normal game speed would make max per storage slot 100 x 10 villages x 20 iNativeConsumptionPercent / 80) = 10 of each yield is sacrificed to the wind.
- <iNativeHappy> affects how likely a yield will become the desired yield of a native village. It will be added to a random value between 1-100.
- iPower and iAsset running out of brain power and mental assets to analyze
Q: Also, it looks like you can set the buy price for goods, but the sell price can't be set independently of it. It is always X off from buy. Is there a way to separate those two values?
A: Yes, shouldn't be too hard
Q: More importantly, is there a way to prevent the selling of certain products in Europe without affecting the ability to buy them? I'd love to better model mercantilism where the mother country refuses to buy manufactured goods from the colonies.
A: Yes, sounds like a good idea... I'll try to make it happen
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OzzyKP
Emperor
Awesome, thank you!!!
OzzyKP
Emperor
Here are my thoughts on a more robust, accurate mercantilism system:
1. A greater spread between the buy and sell price for goods in general.
2. Prices are less volatile overall.
3. Manufactured goods for Europe & Africa begin as 'boycotted'. The whole point of the colonial system, and the reason it was so lucrative for the mother countries, is that they imported lots of cheap raw goods, then their domestic (i.e. European) industries produced all the rum, cigars, clothes, etc and made a huge profit. The fact that this game directly rewards the colonies to set up coat factories and sell them to Europe is exactly backwards from history.
4. Let's say 5,000 gold to unlock each good. This could represent lobbying expenses to convince Parliament to allow the sale of X good. The Dutch, whose Civ trait should be renamed from Mercantilist to Free Traders, would have a discount on unlocking goods. Maybe 2,500 gold instead of 5,000.
5. Since the mother country benefits from raw goods, I'd love to see a positive relationship modifier with the King for selling raw goods to Europe and a negative relationship modifier for selling finished goods. Maybe +1 for every 1,000 raw goods, and -1 for every 1,000 finished goods. Also a positive modifier for buying finished goods in Europe.
6. This may be over complicated, but perhaps even have tax rates that are different for raw goods vs. finished goods. Again, to make it harder to sell manufactured goods to Europe.
7. More differences in prices between goods in Europe, Africa & Port Royal.
8. Maybe a ban on buying/selling goods with other colonial powers?
9. These changes would of course give a greater incentive for smugglers to trade with Port Royal. Just as it did in history. Your mother country also, of course, had an incentive to stop smuggling. Perhaps there could also be some events that either have a chance of spawning royal ships that hunted smuggling ships, or you just had a small chance to lose your smuggling ship during the voyage to Port Royal.
1. A greater spread between the buy and sell price for goods in general.
2. Prices are less volatile overall.
3. Manufactured goods for Europe & Africa begin as 'boycotted'. The whole point of the colonial system, and the reason it was so lucrative for the mother countries, is that they imported lots of cheap raw goods, then their domestic (i.e. European) industries produced all the rum, cigars, clothes, etc and made a huge profit. The fact that this game directly rewards the colonies to set up coat factories and sell them to Europe is exactly backwards from history.
4. Let's say 5,000 gold to unlock each good. This could represent lobbying expenses to convince Parliament to allow the sale of X good. The Dutch, whose Civ trait should be renamed from Mercantilist to Free Traders, would have a discount on unlocking goods. Maybe 2,500 gold instead of 5,000.
5. Since the mother country benefits from raw goods, I'd love to see a positive relationship modifier with the King for selling raw goods to Europe and a negative relationship modifier for selling finished goods. Maybe +1 for every 1,000 raw goods, and -1 for every 1,000 finished goods. Also a positive modifier for buying finished goods in Europe.
6. This may be over complicated, but perhaps even have tax rates that are different for raw goods vs. finished goods. Again, to make it harder to sell manufactured goods to Europe.
7. More differences in prices between goods in Europe, Africa & Port Royal.
8. Maybe a ban on buying/selling goods with other colonial powers?
9. These changes would of course give a greater incentive for smugglers to trade with Port Royal. Just as it did in history. Your mother country also, of course, had an incentive to stop smuggling. Perhaps there could also be some events that either have a chance of spawning royal ships that hunted smuggling ships, or you just had a small chance to lose your smuggling ship during the voyage to Port Royal.
Ramstormp
Warlord
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Should point 3 really be all or nothing? I mean you had situations like: The New World produced the best rum, and people bought and drank it in Europe; but the French did not like how it competed with their brandy, so they banned its production in New France, which caused sugar prices in New France to go way low, which caused the 13 colonies to have an unfair advantage over British made rum, which inspired an imposed tax hike on imported molasses.
So maybe some boycotts initially, then some come as an aftereffect of selling too much of a product, and the ones imposed by the king as punishment for refusing a tax increases should always be on a manufactured goods not on silver or fur like it is now.
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OzzyKP
Emperor
I was just thinking it'd be easier to do for the game. Over time you'd unlock various goods, but you have to pay to do it. The reality, of course, is far more complicated, as you pointed out, I just wasn't sure of a way to do it that was simple and fun. But if you can do it, go for it.
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OzzyKP
Emperor
Niller, you may want to make your comments here instead of the WTP thread in case those folks get upset.
Ramstormp
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@NillerDNK Yes, changing the last define to
Code:
<DefineName>ENABLE_RUSH_BUILDING_MATERIALS</DefineName>
<iDefineIntVal>1</iDefineIntVal>should change that... though I have not tested it to make sure, so please let me know if it doesn't.
[EDIT]
I see that it was coded wrong. Sorry about that... I fixed it and will post a bugfix shortly
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OzzyKP
Emperor
I'm working on rebalancing the prices of goods. I haven't touched any of those values yet, I'm still wrapping my head around those formulas, but another question I have is about the stock amounts you added. Do those affect prices at all? How do those fluctuate (besides me buying/selling)? What controls how they grow or shrink?
Another wishlist item would be that if you sell Europe a lot of tobacco, it'd be great to see the stock of cigars to start to rise.
Like this? Doesn't do any difference. Rush button is still greyed out.
<Define>
<DefineName>ENABLE_RUSH_BUILDING_MATERIALS</DefineName>
<iDefineIntVal>1</iDefineIntVal>
</Define>
</Civ4Defines>
OzzyKP
Emperor
Another question about prices. I monkeyed with the iBuyPriceLow and iBuyPriceHigh prices for everything. One thing I did was create a larger range between the two. I was surprised to see the actual initial values when I started up a game be all over the place.
For 32 goods, the initial price equaled the BuyLow price, for 16 it equaled the BuyHigh price, and for 51 it was somewhere in the middle.
How is that determined?
I guess I didn't look at PRICE_DIFF_MAN_TO_RAW, that could be affecting part of it.
For 32 goods, the initial price equaled the BuyLow price, for 16 it equaled the BuyHigh price, and for 51 it was somewhere in the middle.
How is that determined?
Spoiler Price Values :
I guess I didn't look at PRICE_DIFF_MAN_TO_RAW, that could be affecting part of it.
