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Moff Jerjerrod's WW2 Global - Reloaded

Discussion in 'Civ3 - Completed Scenarios' started by Moff Jerjerrod, May 19, 2010.

  1. RKP

    RKP Regent

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    Guys:

    Well, last night I decided to play a game with the music in place that I had made. For fun I chose Sweden. Figured that it would be short and fast if I went to war with anyone. It is now the first quarter of 1940 and I am still in the game! Not only that, but I am kicking Finnish butt all over the place. I presently have taken Kemijarvi, Vassa, and Tornio. It was a bit rough at first. Since I had German bombers hitting any target they could find. But on turn 3 of 1939, the world exploded.

    Russia declared war on the Axis. Turkey declared war on Russia and the Axis. The Allies are at war with Thailand. Spain and Portugal went to war against the Axis. Yugoslavia is at war with the Allies. Argentina and Brazil are at war. Norway-Denmark are at war with the Axis. Mexico and the rest of the South American countries are the only ones at peace. I think the Finns are just holding back the Russians and letting me take the cities. So that they do not become a Russian puppet state.

    Moff: Need to find a way to get rubber to Sweden. Does not have it and so far I can not get any nation to trade with me that I can trade with. Certain units need it and so Sweden is penalized with out it. My thought is if you want to place a rubber resource in Sweden. Why not put it under a city. Since Sweden is too far north to have rubber trees. With it hidden under the city, you can claim the rubber originates from recycling or something of that nature.
     
  2. Kubko

    Kubko Chieftain

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    Loads just fine until it gets to the game screen, it says "configuring scenario" forever.. help?
     
  3. RKP

    RKP Regent

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    Guys:

    Moff likes the music/speeches track I did. So I thought I would share it with you at this time. Its a big file and so you will have to go to here to get it. http://www.megaupload.com/?d=IBGLMZIW

    I put in instructions for those that need it. It will repeat some songs, but that is just how it works. Let me know if you like it.

    Russ
     
  4. superbounce7

    superbounce7 Augustus

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    @Kubko
    How long did you wait? Its a very large scenario so the load time is quite long.
     
  5. RKP

    RKP Regent

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    That is true. Even with my new computer. It can take up to 5 min or so to completely load up.
     
  6. superbounce7

    superbounce7 Augustus

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    Its really worth the wait though.:)
     
  7. Moff Jerjerrod

    Moff Jerjerrod Chieftain

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    Kubko, did you install the patch from post 1 of this thread? I had that same problem as you do now and I think I addressed it in the patch.


    RKP, thanks for sharing the music with everyone. I'm really digging the added atmosphere it brings. Tom2050 you did a great job helping RKP put his music together. Much thanks guys!


    Update: fixing some missing unit sounds and features. Working on the navies still. It's a slow progress but only because my free time is limited these days. I'm planning on trimming the fat out of the tech tree as well to allow for a smoother tech progression. Still working on the guides to help you plan what techs to go for and what those special units do.
     
  8. Kubko

    Kubko Chieftain

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    Ok thanks, i'll try waiting some more time now :)
     
  9. cemo1956

    cemo1956 Chieftain

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    You haven´t tried out this have you ??

    To "separate" fighter/dive-bombers from long-range bombers (Lancasters,B17) I have played with the idea of not only having the stats changed but make them different even in this way.
    Give the close support bombers BLITZ and 2 MOVES. Of course lesser bombing strength will make the AI build fewer, but this could end up having just fighters and long-range bombers. I hope that this extra feature for the close support bombers (P-51, P-47, Mosquito, Stukas, Typhoons) will make these aircrafts new abilities.
    The Lancaster, B-17 are truly much stronger payload, but the less expensive fighterbomber can now have a certain place to hit enemy units close to the airfields.
    Perhaps even add the CHARM stuff on those longrange bombers, to make them truly city bombers.

    You did change some in the aircraft stuff. Please explain the Argetnyx.

    By the way I was wondering if you got something wrong with the Canada Infantry Div. Starting the game as Great Britain most of India, Singapore and Australia prefer to create this unit. I guess it should be handled like the British India Div. Only to be produced in Canada. Aussies in Australia and India and Gurhkas only in India. Am I correct ?
     
  10. tom2050

    tom2050 Chieftain

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    Playing as France (Demigod); took Freiburg on Week 39, 1939 :) and Stutgart on Week 42, 1939.

    Transports can't move.
    Subs are either way too useful and overpowered, or are of no use at all.
    1. If basic subs are along with groups of other ships, they are great. They can bombard strong ships all the way down, and then DD can take out CL, CA, and BB.
    2. If basic subs are by themselves, they can't do anything; and can only take a target out in rare circumstances (with their 1 attack).
    3. AI uses them pretty well.

    France is a little strong. France, although they were very strong in reality, suffered from not using mobile warfare tactics. All french troops should probably have 1 move point to reflect this until later in the game. Retreat makes a huge difference in the game for combat.

    Tough to know what does what without civilopedia. All-in-all looking good.
     
  11. Moff Jerjerrod

    Moff Jerjerrod Chieftain

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    Thanks for the feedback Tom. Interesting idea regarding French troops. I'll have mod that in the next version because what you say is right.

    As for the troopships not being able to move, I've fixed that by adding the 'Go to' command checkbox in the editor. Seems like I left that out for some reason.

    All Subs will have lethal sea bombardment but they will die horribly if you try to attack a target directly that has more than one hitpoint.

    You'll be happy to see a lot of those new Japanese ships you've made included in the next version as well as a total Navy revision for most of the big boys and a few of the minors as well. I've also added RKP's new soundtrack additions as well as cleaned up a few bugs and missing unit sounds.

    All I have left to do is install a few more units for France, Norway, and maybe Sweden. Hopefully the next version will be available within the next 3 weeks.

    As for a guide to the units, that will be my next goal. I intend to hand out an Excel table listing all the units, their capabilities, and their requisite techs/resources. I'll include a breakdown of which countries can build what as well.
     
  12. Moff Jerjerrod

    Moff Jerjerrod Chieftain

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    Hi cemo,

    Nice ideas you suggest there. I will need to experiment with your proposals just to see how the Ai behaves with blitz ability and bombers.

    Argetnyx is a Civfanatic member who published a formula a while ago on generating aircraft attack, defense, and shield costs. Although his formula is not perfect I've been somewhat happy with his results. Some hand tweaking is required though because for example I noticed that there is no difference in combat performance, other than range, between an Me109E and an Me109F.
     
  13. AnthonyBoscia

    AnthonyBoscia Chieftain

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    Hey Moff, I figured I'd get you an update on the game I was playing as Germany. I used your first version so as to have the non-bombarding subs and destroyers, and it worked great. Unlike the game as Russia where I had time to build infrastructure, I needed to get right into the fight. For Germany, this meant air power. My priority was to neutralize the Allied air threat by having interceptors in all the key bombing locations. Also, Germany has a great one-two punch with the Ju-88/Stuka combo, so building these in large numbers had precedence over making tanks.

    Poland fell on turn two, and continental France was overrun by the end of '39. Allied air forces were severly depleted by unsuccessful raids. To beat France, I used heavy bombardment to capture the strong cities, and then exploitation units to seize lightly defended cities relatively intact. At sea, I had to quickly wear down the Royal Navy. I concentrated all my attrition attacks on the British Battleships. I must've lost 35 subs, but was able to sink 10 BBs, 2 carriers, and 4 cruisers. Subs I can rebuild, but they couldn't recover from a hit like that.

    As I secured the continent, I bumped up my Z plan and started getting ready for Sea Lion. The S-boats are great for taking out those immobile defense ships, and the German transport planes are a great way to get infantry across the Channel. The blitz on London was so fierce that they were reduced to a 1-sized city with no buildings! My landing forces pushed forward with heavy air support and were able to capture the UK within about 6 mos. Airborne and Marine operations grabbed Scapa Flow and Ireland.

    Britain responded by sending all their fleets from the Med and elsewhere in a huge counter attack. We're talking some 70 destroyers, 40 subs, 15 cruisers and battleships! It took about all my air power and naval forces to counter that, but the Royal Navy was finally broken. Meanwhile, those sneaky Soviets attacked Sweden, conquering it quickly and putting huge forces on my northern flank. As I rebuilt the west so that it could start contributing to the war effort, my German cities built up and started churning out tanks, infantry, and artillery. I then launched a massive attack on Norway to try to grab it before war broke out with Russia.

    But once again the Finnish alliance started a war. I think it was a sub bug, actually. Soviet bombers pounded Poland, and their tanks swarmed in. My forces in Norway had to stop operations and quickly turn to face the massive Russian armies still in Sweden. These were my best units though, and mostly elite, so I was able to force a long campaign up Scandinavia. In the East, I used long range bombers to destroy Soviet bombers in their bases, and then mounted an armored thrust right through the center. By 1941, my production was high enough that I could really start countering their enormous numbers, plus I make sure to let wounded units heal before sending them back to the front. At the start of the Eastern war, I had 24 Panzerdivisions, 18 mechanized divisions, and about 60 infantry. The Red Army, in contrast, had 58, 56, and 234 respectively! Air power was the key. After driving to Smolensk, I finally built up enough units to split my forces a little. One Army Group swung south of Moscow and gathered heavy artillery to counter the fortresses there. A second Army Group gathered strength to encircle the Ukraine and cut it off. A third was formed by having new units link up with the forces that had captured Scandinavia. With land- and sea-based assaults, they closed on Leningrad and are now driving north to Murmansk. In the center, Moscow was captured and my forces are forward of the Urals now. In the Ukraine, only huge concentrations of heavy artillery are enabling me to reduce the pocket.

    Meanwhile, the damned Americans haven't been idle. I've formed some sea battle groups and spread out a web of subs, but still they slip through. I tried making carrier groups but they take a long time to assemble. The U.S. sunk two of my carriers, one with aircraft and another by sub. Two carriers, four elite Me-109s and four elite Stukas lost! They even managed to sneak an amphibious attack through and briefly captured Plymouth! Right now, they're mostly being contatined, but they keep it interesting. My next step is to decide where to go next: East through Asian Russia, south to Egypt and India, or West and invade Canada.

    Anyway, it's plenty of fun. Sorry to write a book about it. :) Here's my humble suggestions:

    -Stay with your original, non-bombarding stats for subs and destroyers
    -Increase fighter aircraft ranges at least to four. The Me-109s have it but nobody else does, and it makes them practically useless for anything beyond one square air defense.
    -Reduce early game French effectiveness as Tom mentioned. I would suggest using Wyrmshadow's Maginot unit and have these replace the fortresses in eastern France. They could have lower stats and would look more distinctive.
    -Consider adding some air units to the auto-production for the major powers. They don't seem to be keen on making them.
    -Remove Finland from the Axis alliance. That's 2 for 2 that they got me into a war :)

    Looking forward to your new version, Moff! RPK, the new music is great. But every time I hear Edith Piaf I think I'm going to get stuck in a dream fighting ski troops with Leonardo DiCaprio.
     
  14. Moff Jerjerrod

    Moff Jerjerrod Chieftain

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    Hi Anthony,

    This is very useful feedback and I love the length of the post!

    I definitely will restrict naval bombardment to the big ships only so no more destroyers and light cruisers flooding the seas in search of coastal tiles to bombard. ;)

    I'm very pleased to hear that you had so many good naval battles. Wait until the next version is out. I think the seas are really going to heat up with my latest mods courtesy of RKP.

    I might indeed have to implement air auto production for the Ai. Even with my latest changes I still don't see the Ai building anything other than the best bombers available to them.

    Remove Finland from the Axis? You do have a point there as in my Germany games I've also been dragged into early unwanted wars with the USSR. Maybe I can make Finland neutral but lean towards the Axis somehow.

    I agree with those Maginot line fortresses currently being too strong. You have a good idea there and I'll try implementing it and seeing what happens.

    I have to run now but thanks again for your input!
     
  15. RKP

    RKP Regent

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    Anthony Quote:

    Looking forward to your new version, Moff! RPK, the new music is great. But every time I hear Edith Piaf I think I'm going to get stuck in a dream fighting ski troops with Leonardo DiCaprio.




    Thank you Anthony. I took a lot of time thinking and worrying about what to put into the list. Wanted to make sure I kept the flavor of what Moff had started off with. Hummm...DiCaprio...Ski Troops......Edith Piaf. Almost sounds like a On Ice Musical! :lol:

    Moff: You should see the German Navy List-OOD in your email now. Just the Italians left.

    Guys: For anyone interested in what the German Navy could have been. If the war went in their favor and Hitler was not such an idot. Here is some information for you. One about the Z-Plan and the other about other Carriers other than the Zepplin and Seydlitz. So if Moff likes it, you could have CVE's and the Odin Class of CV-BC hybids. I have Wyrmshado's Odin Unit and sent it to Moff


    Plan Z was the name given to the planned re-equipment and expansion of the Nazi German Navy (Kriegsmarine) ordered by Adolf Hitler on January 27, 1939. The plan called for a Kriegsmarine of 10 battleships, four aircraft carriers, three battlecruisers, eight heavy cruisers, 44 light cruisers, 68 destroyers and 249 U-boats by 1944 that was meant to challenge the naval power of the United Kingdom.

    The plan as it came about would have seen the completion of the two battleships under construction (Bismarck and Tirpitz) to an interim design, as well as three heavy cruisers (Admiral Hipper, Blücher and Prinz Eugen), plus a further two launched in 1939, before the major construction work began. The plan was then to have the majority finished by 1945:
    * Four aircraft carriers, (two of the Graf Zeppelin-class, plus two others)
    * Six H-Class battleships
    * Three "O Class" battlecruisers
    * 12 "Kreuzer P Class" Panzerschiffe (Pocket Battleships)
    * Two further Hipper-class heavy cruisers (Seydlitz, and Lützow)
    * Four "M-Class" light cruisers
    * Two "Improved M-Class" light cruisers
    * Six "Spähkreuzer-class" large destroyers

    Construction began on the aircraft carrier Graf Zeppelin in 1936, with a second planned to begin in 1938. In mid 1939, following the launch of both Bismarck and Tirpitz, the keels of the first three improved battleships were laid, while orders were placed for the modified Messerschmitt Bf 109T fighters and Junkers Ju 87C dive bombers to equip the aircraft carriers. However, with the outbreak of World War II, it was decided that the large and expensive construction projects required too much of the materials vital to keep the Heer (the German army) and Luftwaffe up and running. As a consequence, work on the battleships was halted, and the materials were diverted to the construction of U-boats. Some Bf 109Ts were completed, though later stripped of their carrier equipment and stationed in Norway.


    Kleiner Flugzeugträger (CVE)
    History Technical Data
    While the aircraft carrier Graf Zeppelin was still under construction, the German Naval Construction department started with design studies for other, smaller carriers. Besides a 12000t carrier (of which very little information is left), a even smaller design - a 6000t ship - was made. Called "Kleiner Flugzeugträger" - small aircraft carrier, this ship was only able to carry up do 15 aircraft of the size of a fighter aircraft. Without any armor protection and probably a diesel engine system, the ships would not be able to keep up the speed of other Kriegsmarine surface units, so their military use for the Kriegsmarine was very doubtful. They could be compared with the allied CVEs which were used to protect allied convoys in the North Atlantic in the later years of the war, but since the Kriegsmarine did not depend on such convoys as the allied did, the idea behind this design is questionable. Only a first design study was made, there were no plans to actually build ships like these.


    Flugdeckkreuzer
    During the year 1942, the idea of a hybrid warship appeared in the constructions department of the Kriegsmarine. The idea was to build a ship that could provide both, air cover for other Kriegsmarine units (including themselves) and were still usable for conventional commerce raiding. Therefore, a combination of an aircraft carrier and a cruiser/battleship was thought to be a solution for this task. Although these projects never had a high priority and never came even close to a possible realization, several design studies for this kind of ships were made. Two different types of ships were examined, a battleship sized "Grossflugzeugkreuzer" (Project A) , armed with 28cm (11") guns and a battleship protection system and a cruiser sized "Flugdeckkreuzer" (Project E) armed with 15 cm (5,9") guns and a cruiser like protection system.
     
  16. vmxa

    vmxa Chieftain

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    Thanks for the info RKP. Looking forward to seeing this mod up and running.
     
  17. Moff Jerjerrod

    Moff Jerjerrod Chieftain

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    Thanks RKP for the information. Check your email, I responded to your message. ;)
     
  18. RKP

    RKP Regent

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    Guys:

    Well Moff now has the German and Italian navies. That is it, unless he asks for more. So its now up to him to get a upgrade to the mod going. Will be fun to see the navies in some new locations. proper counts in numbers, some new classes, and never-were type of ships to build. Wyrmshadow for example made the German Merchant Raider Atlantis. Suggested that it be added in the game. With a few spotted at the start. Make them like subs, can not be seen unless you have radar. Suggested some MTB units. Russians and Italians loved to use them. French would get their Corsair Sub. And other things. Just have to wait and see what Moff does with it.
     
  19. vmxa

    vmxa Chieftain

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    Yes it will be interesting, but to me the pedia is nearly as important as it is hard to play without out information.
     
  20. Moff Jerjerrod

    Moff Jerjerrod Chieftain

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    Hey guys,

    Just a quick update. The next version of this scenario is due out soon. It's been slow going because of RL issues and Total War: Shogun 2 taking up my time, however I'm almost ready to release the next version.

    All that is left is updating some of the navy units thanks to Wyrmshadow and installing some of Tom2050's awesome new ships as well.

    What is done is a revised naval combat system. I'm returning to the original format where only battleships, CAs, and SSs can bombard, and sea lethally at that. Also many of the worlds navies have had there at start forces updated and repositioned thanks to the wonderful research RKP has provided me. Many thanks RKP!

    You will be pleased to hear that I've turned trade back on with only a slight delay in wait times between turns. This was accomplished by limiting trade to coast tiles only. There are now several sea lanes composed of coast tiles linking parts of the world together. What this does is enables the USA to ship lend lease resources to the allies so that they can build equipment such as lend lease Grants and Shermans. I've only playtested this for Britain however and don't know yet if it is working for Russia and France. So there is still some work to do here as well. Note that a sea lane can be blocked by positioning an enemy unit on a tile in the lane thus denying crucial resources from reaching the factories of your enemy. This means the enemy will be severely limited in what can be produced in the home country. All this means you really need to patrol the sea lanes for enemy submarines!

    I'm also working on a Maginot line rethink. It may end up being a simple graphics replacement exercise as the current bunker unit used doesn't fit well. But I'm also toying with softening up the Maginot line a bit to allow the German AI a chance to conquer France quickly and not get bogged down flinging 37mm anti tank guns at a strong point.
     

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