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Monarch Student^ XVIII- Ragnar

Discussion in 'Civ4 - Strategy & Tips' started by BigTime, Feb 23, 2010.

  1. BigTime

    BigTime Prince

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2009
    Messages:
    556
    Location:
    Chapel Hill, NC
    The week has passed, so it's time for another Monarch Student Prime! The leader which we will use to smear away the AIs? Ragnar of the Vikings!



    Horn hats for the win indeed. Ragnar has a good trait set: Financial and Aggressive. Financial is one of the most powerful traits in the game, making cottage spam that much more effective. Aggressive is not as good, but a handy warmongerer trait nonetheless, giving your melee and gunpowder units an extra lift. Quick barracks aren't bad either.

    His UU is the Berserker:



    A maceman that has a free amphibious promotion and an inherent 10% city attack bonus. On slower speeds, a powerhouse unique, and even on faster speeds a medieval war would become more effective. Also, since amphibious is a free promo, it stays after the berserker upgrades. This can add a fun touch to some early intercontinental warfare. Amphibious rifles anyone? :lol:

    His UB is the Trading Post:



    A lighthouse that gives all naval units built in that city a free navigation 1 promotion. Nothing special here. It mainly gives intercontinental invasions a little "umph" and helps you win the circumnavigation race sooner. Not that you really usually need help there anyway.

    The start:



    Only 1 resource visible, so there must be more in the original BFC. That's a lot of riverside grassland for a financial leader :) Decent start and would make for a strong bureau capital.

    No more maps in spoiler, too much hassle :p. If you want to know, it's a standard hemispheres map with 2 continents and tiny islands. Spoilers are just too much effort for me now. :p

    Huts and Events are OFF, add events in the custom scenario if you wish. (just make sure to cover the top part with your hand so you don't see the AIs :p)

    And a cut-and-paste from Meatbuster's Monarch Student games:

    Save the file and place it in your Documents/BTS/Saves/WorldBuilder folder. Then unzip it into your Documents/BTS/Saves/WorldBuilder folder. Then use Playing a scenario to play your desired level. Or use custom scenario if you want to remove huts and/or events.

    Recommended Checkpoints:
    *1000BC or 1AD
    *500AD
    *1000AD or Liberalism
    *Victory!

    Please remember to put the journals of your adventures inside spoiler tags.

    For Monarch+ players please try to add archery back to the barbs in WB. If you don't, AIs will capture cities with archers very early in the game, which is no fun. If you prefer easymode barbs, that's fine too, just don't go wondering why an AI captured a barb city in the very early BCs!

    Thanks go to TMIT for making an excellent map creation guide and to mjg5591 for getting this series back on track!

    And finally, the save!
     

    Attached Files:

  2. TCMIV

    TCMIV Barış Manço

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    Location:
    Oregon
    Is there a guide somewhere on adding archery to barbs?
     
  3. BigTime

    BigTime Prince

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Chapel Hill, NC
    ^

    No way without seeing map. I zoom in all the way, enter worldbuilder, cover minimap with your hand and go to the civ selection. Cover that and hit down like 20 times. Hit enter. Go to technologies and add archery. Exit worldbuilder. You don't see the AIs this way and it keeps the map blind.

    This is what I posted for lymond on MS^ Peter.
     
  4. lymond

    lymond Rise Up! (Phoenix Style!) Hall of Fame Staff

    Joined:
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    21,620
    Ha...yeah the zoom in on WB really helps as far as not seeing the map. The hardest part is not seeing the other civs when selecting the barb civ.
     
  5. BigTime

    BigTime Prince

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2009
    Messages:
    556
    Location:
    Chapel Hill, NC
    Immortal/normal to 1 AD

    Spoiler :


    Scout went 1 SE and saw irrigated rice, we are one off coast so I settled 1 SW. I saw Washington close, but decided to forgo a rush. Settled some pretty good cottage land and a few high food cities. Tech rate was abysmal with expansion, but once writing was in trade routes helped. Thank god the AI forgos Aesthetics for so long. I managed to trade it for Alpha, IW, and Math.

    Current Empire:





    Tech situation:



    I will be able to trade currency for calender and hopefully Monarch as well, after a quick detour to priesthood. After that it's COL-CS-Liberalism line. My tech rate should be solid once I get those southern jungles cleared. I lost that nice western gems spot to Washington, but I still got the eastern ones. Washington is in WHEOOHRN, but Shaka is his WE so I should be safe. Democracy will be huge here.

     
  6. TheMeInTeam

    TheMeInTeam Top Logic

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2008
    Messages:
    25,523
    I made a reasonable map into hell :p.

    IMM/Normal quick summary (will do a screenshot based writeup later).

    Spoiler :


    Met washington turn 5. Chariot rush!

    But

    1. Shaka dowed him in 1480 BC (!!!)
    2. I poached the cities first except Boston
    3. I decided to stab shaka after washington was gone because shaka is the bane of all civ players and a total ass. This did not work. Though I captured boston, at 1 AD he had a power stack of anti-chariot near it and I had to give it back for peace (or else just lose it and still not have peace).
    4. I spammed cities all the way to the southern tip of the continent, with shaka's DoW looming
    5. Shaka dows with a stack of elephants/cats/impi/sword/axe vs spammed axes/spears. I have to whip a lot in the target city but I hold.

    I'm much larger than shaka now, around 1600 AD. I'm just teching democracy on a beeline. AC had 1/4 of the world's land/pop and had temporarily capped cyrus, though cyrus is free again. Everyone is WAY ahead in tech, except the ass hat who causes more trouble for me than all other AI combined. I have castles and a bigger SoD lined up. Shaka is in war mode. If he DoWs me (probable, I'm his worst enemy), I will fight off his stack and this war won't be just defensive...I'll let my HE bur cap (washington) keep spamming treb + berserker and their superior #'s will crush him while I tech. I am definitely going to get demo + lib before going rifling.

    As I do have ~20% world land/pop I haven't lost yet. If I kill shaka, I have a good shot at backdoor UN (anyone other than AC builds the UN, and I can farm him for a vote and win). Additionally, if I don't have to kill tech rate too much vs shaka (though it has been a lot already), I can probably derail any space or culture attempts using nukes until I can catch up or slog a military victory. That would not be pretty, but it would be GREAT to come back after a botched backstab off of nothing but cottage + city + unit spam against shaka.

     
  7. TCMIV

    TCMIV Barış Manço

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2010
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    314
    Location:
    Oregon
    Monarch/Epic to 145AD

    Spoiler :
    Scouted south and spotted the rice, so I settled on the plains hill(1S of the starting position.) Teched agriculture and met Washington right next door, teched mining/BW next and found no copper so I went with archery for barb protection, didn't end up needing it much however because I decided Washington had to go and teched iron working next. As luck would have it my capital was on a source of iron which then linked to my second city via the river (second city was on the northern coast).

    At this point I basically pumped out about 6 axes and 4 swords, left my 2 cities on *axemen and *swordsmen, and rushed Washington. Had great luck capturing it as it wasn't on a hill and I had aggressive units + barracks. Took 2 cities and razed 3 more.

    Couldn't find his last city so I got 10 turns of peace to regroup and scout a bit, found his last city and captured it about 15 turns later. Got the great wall from his capital, not bad! After he was gone I built some settlers and workers and started on granaries/monuments to build up my cities. Deficit researched pottery with my war spoils and spammed cottages on my riverside tiles in a couple cities.

    Shaka claimed 2 of the sites to the south that I wanted, so after I get my economy going I'm considering bringing the war to him next. Couple barb cities available first however, and I need more workers to get my land up to par. Hopefully I can get around to attacking Shaka before my swords become obsolete, might just beeline for macemen/cats and go that route however.
     
  8. BigTime

    BigTime Prince

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Chapel Hill, NC
    Immortal/normal to Liberalism

    Spoiler :


    Teched off while continent warred. Washington declared on Shaka, so that means any DoW is not going to be against me barring any RNG nonsense. Anyway, lib was won by a mile, none of my continent mates had education:



    Emancipation and US right away. Tech rate is going to fly. I'll take over my continent with cavalry then do whatever it takes to win, be it UN, Dom, or Space.

    Tech Situation:



    Shaka first for two holy cities and b/c I won't get any penalties, then on to Washington and Churchill. Washington has a lot of wonders, which will be nice to captured. Workers are automated with everything emphasizing commerce. Cottage spam ftw.:goodjob:


     
  9. gagnarath

    gagnarath Chieftain

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2009
    Messages:
    39
    Location:
    Manchester, UK
    Monarch / Normal 4000-750 BC

    Spoiler :
    Met Washington almost immediately, was going for Animal Husbandry, saw horses close but decided to go for BW and IW to see if there was metal. Made a second city to grab the 3 food to the north and eventually a third SW for pigs/elephants/horses, there was Iron in the capital so started chopping and whipping some swordsmen, had an axe and spear as well just in case but with all 3 cities having barracks getting the C1 CR1 swords just facerolled Washington. Razed one of his cities, kept the capital and his 3 food spot. I'll change mine in the north to cottages and have New York as NE/GP Farm. Teched Mysticism after IW to make monuments, then captured Stonehenge in Washington >.> After that Pottery for recovery and now almost have Writing done.

    Empire
    Spoiler :


    Overenthusiastic Dotmap
    Spoiler :


    I have one settler atm and another one in a few turns. Thinking send the swords down to the barb city and found the 2 red ones on the dotmap, then cottage up, whip libraries and wait to recover while teching to monarchy.
     
  10. mariogreymist

    mariogreymist Deity

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2009
    Messages:
    2,201
    Monarch/Marathon to 720BCE

    Spoiler :
    The top spots on my high score list are all Ragnar, so I come into the game with a plan. That plan? Berserkers early, berserkers hard, berserkers ftw. Sure, I will probably be upgrading them to rifles for intercontinental purposes, but I will take the continent with my berserker hordes, aided with black-clad siege.

    I settled 1S of the start on the plains hill. Not a bad spot, but I do prefer coast when I can get it with fw...oh well. Because one of the key advantages of the vikings are those fast galleys, I will want lots of coastal sites. And because I want those berserkers sooner than later, I will aim for the glh, which I manage to build in the wheat/FP/clam site with the aid of some whip overflow.

    The big gamble i made was for iron, which payed off right under Nidaros. I skipped archery, using some warriors to fog bust and crossing my fingers. Tech path was Mining/Ag/AH/BW/Sailing/Masonry/Pottery/Writing/IW->Monarchy. Along the way to Monarchy, built the Oracle and took CoL over MC. Both are needed for Berserkers, and MC is more expensive, but CoL will let me adopt Castes with HR and run Merchants in Upsala, which should let me bulb for MC well before getting to CS anyway. I want Berserkers by 100AD.

    In the meantime, the key is keeping Shaka angrier at Washington than he is with me, and building enough axes to survive if plan A fails. Also, building up enough Galleys to be a menace when the time comes to load them with Berserkers. But so far, aside from the late access to metal, everything here is according to the script I would write for Ragnar (whose name I actually share, hence using it in the game).

    Screenshots are Kingdom, diplomacy and demographics...all the keys for this game plan are in those shots. Current weakness is military, but that is easily and quickly correctable if necessary. The truth is, I will probably be killing Shaka's archers/Impis with Berserkers when the time comes...



     
  11. TCMIV

    TCMIV Barış Manço

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Oregon
    To a Liberalism equivalent :lol::

    Spoiler :
    After settling down and growing cities under HR, I teched towards civil service/machinery for berserkers. My tech is probably so far behind the other continent I didn't even want to make a run for lib, so a war on Shaka and possibly Churchill afterwards is the current plan. Built macemen/cats in all cities with decent production, deficit researching music just so I can use the culture slider to keep people happy.

    Empire the turn after DoW'ing on shaka:
    Spoiler :


    Main stack:
    Spoiler :


    I'm a little worried about the outcome of this, I have plenty of units and all, but I'm not really at a tech advantage and I had no way to get instant 5 xp units :( Lack of vassalage or theocracy is hurting a bit.

     
  12. mariogreymist

    mariogreymist Deity

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    2,201
    720BCE to 90CE

    Spoiler :
    First off, the monarchy/castes switch went off as planned, and I managed to get two GMs by 90 CE, while researching Currency and Machinery (1st GM bulbed MC, as planned)...which set up the second GM to bulb....Civil Service...on the turn I researched Machinery. 90 CE. That's right folks, it's 90 CE, and there be BERSERKERS! (Some words should be shouted)


    But wait, that's not all. You are the world leader, by a significant margin, in GNP. Your manufacturing capabilities are quite respectable, and you haven't even made the switch for Bureau yet! (And won't, until you finish researching Theo)


    And that's not all! If you examine the tech board, you will discover that no one even has Longbows yet! That's right...you won't face anything more daunting than axes and a few jumbos as defenders anywhere on this continent for some time to come! (though, a word to the wise would be to avoid big stacks of catapults)


    And we're not done yet...If you act now, you will find a world at war. That's right: those inferior troops are busy killing one another off, right now, just as you have the ability to make what will be the best troop on the continent for a millennium.


    Place your order today: BERSERKERS!
    Will finish on the morrow.
     
  13. gagnarath

    gagnarath Chieftain

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2009
    Messages:
    39
    Location:
    Manchester, UK
    Monarch / Noble 750 BC -> 1600 AD

    Spoiler :
    Managed to grab a reasonable number of city sites but Churchill weirdly got a few through before Shaka's culture closed him off and ofc settled one in the middle of mine >.> Was building up Berzerkers slowly and managed to get Liberalism for Democracy around 1350, built up a few stacks of Trebs/Zerkers, took a few cities in the first few turns but somehow I must have not got enough war success and it took a loooot of killing and 6 cities before Shaka would finally give in.

    Empire
    Spoiler :


    Zulu Land
    Spoiler :



    Thinking of giving Shaka some cities back and giving him techs to make him useful in any future wars, none of them are particularly impressive. Not sure what victory to go for, I should have warred sooner, I was waiting for a few last troops I would make with 7 XP after switching to Vassalage/Theocracy which was probably a waste of time, I should have just taken the 3 XP troops and old promoted swords and taken the losses.
     
  14. hzf

    hzf Chieftain

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2010
    Messages:
    39
    View attachment MSXVIII Ragnar AD-0001.CivBeyondSwordSave

    Normally play on emperor but playing this on monarch.

    Spoiler :


    I settle 2E on the coast, getting me ocean fish, coast clams, plains cow and g hill pigs. I build a worker first and tech AH. Washington is close to the west and there is some nice land to claim, includinh horses. I cant chop a settler though, so I build a workboat next and tech mining. I hook up cows before pigs and I meet Shaka scout west. First boat goes to fish, I train another, with second villager on a 3 hammer tile to start, I want this boat fast and once fish and pigs are hooked I can time city size 3 to cooincide.

    City size 3 and workboat out at 2720BC. Mine on plains hill and 1 turn from BW. Training settler. Washingto still hasnt claimed any land. I need 3 new cities to block what I want, so I train a total of 3 settlers, including a chop they will be out in 3-4 turns each. No barb worries here yet and my scout can bust animals in the relevant areas. I tech mysticism, agri and wheel.

    My capital builds another 5 workers, all new cities start on a monument.

    1400BC: I have 4 cities, 6 workers. Pottery is in and im teching writing. I am 5 turns away from having horses hooked up, and my barracks are finished or finishing. I have space secured for 2 more cities outside of the jungle. I have met Churchill and there is a barb city in the jungle.

    900BC: My chariots have dealt with the few barbs that attacked. My cities are all size 5/6 (ivory). I am teching alphabet. I will build two more cities shortly. Washington has archers, but perhaps no metal. I will get open borders to find out.

    525BC: I have 6 cities and 7 workers. Washington has 4 cities and no metal. I have alphabet and am 6 turns from HBR. I have specialist scienists working in most cities, and am just building research until HBR.

    275BC: I take IW, archery and mathematics before heading towards monarchy. Stables building in 4 cities. Washington has IW and an iron mine.

    1AD: Im now in hereditary Rule. Horse archers are gathering, Washington has expanded into the jungle and has built the mids in his capital. I traded him meditation for sailing and am teching calendar. I bulbed compass.

    Will finish later.

     
  15. NihilZero

    NihilZero WHEOOHRNY

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2009
    Messages:
    1,161
    Location:
    Dublin, Ireland
    Immortal, Normal. Early BCs:
    Spoiler :
    I hate the vikings on account of their useless starting techs. Ragnar is a early rushing kind of guy, but the vikings come with such useless techs that they get out of the gate very slowly in landlocked situations, impeding the rush horribly.

    AH -> Mining -> BW -> Wheel and that's as far as I get before my economy freezes under the weight of my chariot spam. Couldn't even get to pottery, dammit. I struggle badly to finance my rush.




    I lose a shedload of chariots but pillaging Washington allows me to tech Pottery and build a cottage or two!

    Boston ends up getting too fortified to take expediently, with the addition of walls and numerous archers, so I redirect my aggression towards New York instead and capture it, then make peace. I'll be back, of course.


    I'm doing terribly, in the worst tech hole I have ever been. I have eight techs, not including AG, and I am haemorrhaging money all over the place.

    The discovery of alpha and its subsequent trade to Churchill for IW and AG leads to the discovery of iron in two handy spots at Washington and Nidaros. Nice. Now to settle some Jungle, or maybe get some swords and use them on Washington...

    Meanwhile Churchill has DoWed Shaka in 450BC, which is excellent news and gives me a fighting chance.
     
  16. mrt309

    mrt309 Warlord

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2009
    Messages:
    278
    Location:
    Istanbul
    Monarch/Normal/4000 BC - 1 AD

    Spoiler :
    Settled in place, started to research AH and to build a worker


    Founded 2nd city near horses, a chariot rush seemed like a good strategy


    Declared on Washington


    He had 3 archers when i attacked. I lost 2 chariots, others won


    I took his other city and razed the last one


    Founded 6 cities. I should have expanded to south but i didn't have IW and i was afraid of maintenance


    Got CoL from the Oracle


    I am going for literature to build the great library. I converted to Judaism also. Tech situation seems fine. I will grab more land by founding a few more cities and go for liberalism. My plan is taking out other 2 civilizations by cuirassiers.



     

    Attached Files:

  17. mariogreymist

    mariogreymist Deity

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2009
    Messages:
    2,201
    monarch Marathon, 90CE to 620CE
    Spoiler :
    So the first Viking war is over. I awoke this morning with the urge to put on the Battle Hymn of the Vikings (AKA Led Zeppelin III) and wreak some havoc. Mission accomplished. First, had to get theology and make the civics switch to Bureau/slavery/theocracy. Then built loads of Berserkers (20 before the war began, and didn't stop production) and enough spies to take down defenses in the most established cities. Set the slider up for espionage, focused on Washington. Yeah...he was my buddy, but he was closest. It's much easier to defend one border than two, and I am taking all of this continent while in a total war economy, so there is simply no reason to waste time attacking the more hostile and advanced civs first. Washington also has some good coastal cities, something Shaka does not. A consideration with the glh.

    My two stacks have no siege in them. None. Nada. Zip. Not a big deal for war #1, vs Washington. He will try to stop me with a mix of archers (which kill 2 berserkers), Axes (0), Swords(0), and HAs(0). I would also caution about using a two-pronged attack on monarch and above, particularly with BetterAI on. I only did it here to shorten the war, as I want to be done with the continent without seeing maces/Xbows, and that won't happen if I am not super aggressive with an advantage, which I have in spades over Washington.



    Within a few turns, my forces converge on Washington. Sadly, he hasn't gotten around to building a shrine yet...But I can do that without too much trouble.



    The war ends shortly thereafter. I extort Calendar from Washington...who lives, but has a single city surrounded by a hostile Shaka, and no strategic resources. I will either kill him as I do Shaka, or Shaka will do it for me before I begin the Zulu wars.


    The real challenge here will be Churchill, who will have protective longbows up to defend his beautiful coastal cities. I will probably need some catapults for Sir Winston.
     
  18. Inso

    Inso Warlord

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2009
    Messages:
    163
    Nice green start, I'd be tempted to settle 1S but that probably loses hills so in place it will most likely be. Scout moved south to check for hills down there.
     
  19. NihilZero

    NihilZero WHEOOHRNY

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2009
    Messages:
    1,161
    Location:
    Dublin, Ireland
    Continued up to approximately 1000AD:
    Spoiler :
    25 AD I tech Currency and it's time to start gearing up to kill Washington. He hooked up iron so I have a fight on my hands. Map looks like:



    I have to DoW Washington before I'm really ready when he takes up the last of the elephant spots (I need the dumbos) so I decide to raze the offending city fast and easy while it's still weak (and resettle the spot with the settler I had intended for it). Fortunately the GW I captured from him spawns a GS for me, who I would normally use for espionage but under the circumstances I take a golden age to boost my war research and production.

    I use the GA to tech construction and build catapults in a most sub-optimal manner. Shame on me, going to war without catapults! Shaka, now at peace with England, decides to get dogpilin' and DoWs Washington.

    After a long, extremely sub-optimal but quite entertaining siege, Boston is sacked. I could get peace but Washington becoming Churchill's vassal does not appeal to me, so the war goes on, only now I have ivory and the plunder cash from Boston gives me enough to finish Monarchy.

    Next target is Atlanta, the American iron city, after which they should be sitting ducks. Shaka is doing a nice job killing Washington's men but hopefully he won't take any cities.



    Philosophy bulb in 840 gives me Taoism and a little bit of trade capital, although Churchill is the only one who will trade with me.

    Situation circa 1000 AD:



    1040 Shaka knocks off San Fran and caps Washington. I could have capped him myself but I was hoping to finish him off and was just about to take Libyan. Ah well, never mind. I have a lot of nice land now.

    Any criticisms of my play so far are welcome as I am still completely clueless at Immortal and need all the pointers I can get.
     
  20. TCMIV

    TCMIV Barış Manço

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2010
    Messages:
    314
    Location:
    Oregon
    Monarch/Epic 1325-1435AD:

    Spoiler :
    Still no liberalism, but my economy is so terrible with units all over Shakas land that I still have no desire to settle down and tech yet. Shaka is basically dead and Churchill only has knights. As long as I can switch focus to Churchill before rifles, which should be relatively easy, I can take this continent no problem. Berserker losses have been few, just sacrificing 2-4 cats per city.

    Lost 3 highly promoted berserkers to a jumbo when I had 97% odds attacking however :mad:

    2 cities that really helped my war effort were finally captured:
    Spoiler :


    Temple of Solomon gave me some much needed gpt, and the Statue of Zeus which was previously killing my happiness helped a ton as well.


    And a shot of the land, Shaka and me could have been best pals, but I had to teach him a lesson in this game. Next time maybe he won't be so peaceful and wonder happy and instead build units like he's supposed to!
    Spoiler :



     

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