Monopoly technologies

[JulesDogg]

Could somebody please provide a list of the techs that are most valuable in terms of trading them to the AIs?

Thanks

 

[revengeofmakno]

I don't think there is a standard list. The most "valuable" for trade from the point of view of other civilizations are the expensive ones that they don't have at that particular point. From your own point of view, you hope to trade a low cost, less dangerous one in hopes of getting something useful in return.
That being said, there is the irony that an expensive, less useful tech is "good" for trade. I think the prime example is Divine Right. It is not very helpful and even if you get it first and found Islam, it comes later than the other religions and has less impact. On the other hand, once you have it, you can trade it away quickly without any fear at all. But would you research it just for trade bait when there are other more useful techs to get?

 

[Unconventional]

Could somebody please provide a list of the techs that are most valuable in terms of trading them to the AIs?

Thanks

I think value of a technology generally depends on the situation you are in. I mean let's suppose you have discovered aesthetics and you want to build a wonder with that tech then of course its very valuable, but if you are not interested in those wonders then aesthetics is not so much valuable and you may not even research it yourself.Nevertheless some techs are always valuable like alphabet, religion founding techs like CoL,fission and spaceship techs. Or let's suppose you play on continents and on the other continent you meet a maniac like Montezuma or Shaka or both who are much stronger than you. In this case if you have Astronomy and nobody else has it then it becomes a very valuable and crucial technology and you shouldn't trade it to anybody as long as you can because if those maniacs get it you may be in danger.But if someone else also has Astronomy then you should trade it to other people to get more techs like chemistry or rifling. As I said it mostly depends on the situation but one tip for sure, if you trade a new technology to someone else then trade it to others as well at the same turn because if you don't the AI you've traded with will sell it to others and get other techs.But if you do this first then you prevent that AI becoming more advanced than you and become more advanced yourself It also depends on the level you're playing. On levels like warlord or below you generally have a tech superiority so you don't have to worry about techs so much but on prince and above you have to be careful about tech trading. And one more tip: NEVER GIVE THOSE MANIACS I MENTIONED ABOVE ANY MİLİTARY TECHS!!!!

 

[Farm Boy]

If you can research a tech that multiple AIs don't have, and those AIs have different techs that you don't have(and want), and if trading said techs will not cause an inconvenient war declaration in the future, then that is generally a good tech to trade. Unless that tech also comes with a wonder that you are attempting to build but have not progressed significantly on or it comes with a military advantage that you are planning to leverage in short order.

Remember that AIs trade techs amongst themselves too, so if you toss rifling to Ghandi he might decide to sell it to Ragnar, assuming of course Ragnar has something to offer to Ghandi.

Regarding not giving military techs to insane warmongers - generally speaking, perhaps good advice. However, sometimes giving ammunition to a small insane warmonger can be priceless aid in offsetting the growing power of a dangerous opponent. A non-runaway Shaka at Friendly diplomatic status, for example, can be an invaluable asset as an attack dog.

 

[coanda]

NEVER GIVE THOSE MANIACS I MENTIONED ABOVE ANY MİLİTARY TECHS!!!!

Are you kidding? Monty is a great choice to give military techs to... as a bribe in exchange for his DoW'ing on someone else. Lets you stop worrying about him and at the same time lets someone else deal with him.

 

[Ataxerxes]

Are you kidding? Monty is a great choice to give military techs to... as a bribe in exchange for his DoW'ing on someone else. Lets you stop worrying about him and at the same time lets someone else deal with him.

This is only temporary. Monty might just have a phony war for 10 turns and then turn on you. I've also noted that the psychos have a tendency to prioritize the military techs themselves. I notice Genghis usually techs poorly but gets military techs about the same time as everybody else until later in the game. I usually wind up getting certain military techs FROM the psychos.

All this changes once he's your attack dog. Then he's great to give military techs to.

 

[Unconventional]

Are you kidding? Monty is a great choice to give military techs to... as a bribe in exchange for his DoW'ing on someone else. Lets you stop worrying about him and at the same time lets someone else deal with him.

As far as I know Monty is equally quick at both declaring war, and at making peace when he sees that things are not going well. However when he makes peace he begins looking for a new target and he's not playing to win, he's only playing to create more trouble for you. So I would prefer him to have swordsmen and catapults rather than cannons and riflemen when he DoWs on me in the future. Until the end of the renaissance era, to make him declare war on others I'd give him civil techs (rather than military techs) and after that era he becomes a backward power (on noble level of course, I have no idea about higher levels) and it's really easy to take him out then with rifles and cannons

 

[Framesticker]

The AI generally views a tech as a bunch of of unseperatable beakers, once researched or traded. As you go up in levels, they become much more demanding in trades (rarely will you get an actual "fair," trade, where you get about a 1/1 beaker/beaker ratio for your techs). Thus, getting generally unuseful techs (Aesthetics is the first to come to mind, but there are plenty more, usually game-dependent) for monopoly (then for trade for all neccesary techs post-Alphabet) is a very critical strategy to master, especially on the higher levels.

 

[Paperbag_Hobo]

All these replies are tldr.

The answer is:

1) Aesthetics
2) Compass
3) Philosophy
4) Liberalism

There's others, but I can't think of them off the top of my head. Of course each of these are situational, for example don't trade off philosophy unless you're way ahead in the lib race.

 

[hexem3117]

The techs Paperbag Hobo listed are pretty good bets.

Here are a few more I've noticed can sometimes work wonders for you:

1. Metal Casting
2. Drama (Works surprisingly well. Saw Kossin do it [I think]. Tried it with success a few times)
3. Education (Only trade if you are a good bit ahead in liberalism race)
4. Biology
5. Astronomy is a big one if you aren't relying on GLH for commerce.

 

[Farm Boy]

All these replies are tldr.

Granted a couple replies ran verbose, but I like to think we have an above average forum community here. Summaries are good, but implications that folks here are standard skimmers & trolls are largely unnecessary and mostly incorrect.

Your list, however, is generally accurate.

 

[mariogreymist]

I've managed, when playing religious games, to get massive tech in trade for Divine Right (of all things). Since I only feel I need the wonders it offers if I am going to take a military approach, I can trade it away pretty much as soon as I get it, and I only go for it when I am comfortable I'll get Islam. The only downside is that it sometimes does cost me the Taj, by offering a path to Nationalism at a time when I am likely busy researching for liberalism and letting nationalism wait.

In the end though, I think it's mainly a matter of beaker count and monopoly that give a tech value to the AIs. Another good monopoly tech trade can be Education, traded within a few turns of discovering liberalism. I've managed to nab Gunpowder, Engineering and Chemistry (along with all the backfill on the Aesthetics path) in order to get steel for liberalism. This should only be done (IMO) when one plans on using the cannons on your brokering partners while you have a steel monopoly, as Education does tend to kick start the AIs tech rate.

 

[DNK]

Dunno, I wouldn't want to trade biology since it gives the recipient a pretty strong boost immediately. Even for CE AIs, it's probably an immediate +10% to their output; much higher for farm-dependent AIs. I hold on to that like I hold on to PP unless it's an AI with very few cottages.

Education is like giving them a 25-turn delayed +15% to scientific output. Why would you give that away? Paper is okay, though.

I don't think I'd ever trade Astronomy. Until Astronomy, you are denying the AI the ability to trade resources with intercontinental civs or get their trade income, and it's another (shorter-)delayed +15% to research.

imo:
Aesthetics once you're closing in on your wonders is #1 to trade

The entire post-IW line is pretty good, except Optics I might hold off on if there are a lot of AIs abroad since you don't want to be giving your opponents another delayed tech boost from discovering other AIs. MC... I think the production bonus is offset by the techs you can get from it.

Music, why not?

Paper, why not?

Philosophy: by all means, you want them to have pacifism.

After that point, I feel like things get so game-dependent that it's hard to start pinning them down. There are some obvious ones I won't trade:
Democracy
The military/space lines
Biology
Astronomy

Modern era gets difficult to negotiate.

 

[Sian]

on Panagea Astro is an interesting one

 

[Pangaea]

You called?

 

[Fleme]

^Nope, he said Panagea.

Good trade fodder early-mid are Aesthetics, Music, Metal Casting and Philosophy. Past renaissance just about everything is good for trading.

As far as adverse monopolies go, Alphabet is the number one. If you have it when no-one else does, you can be sure that you're subjected to all kinds of requests (most obviously, please give us alphabet) which in turn either result in the AI playing you for a fool in giving the tech or alternatively getting a diplo hit.

 

[DNK]

After my last game, I'm even more convinced Biology is never to be traded. There were two parts to that game: the part where I was behind in tech, and the part after I got Bio. It's so powerful to have in part because the AI never goes for it until late. I don't know why since it's so powerful an economic tech.

The problem I've found with Philo is that a lot of AIs go for it if only for the religion. It's not usually a monopoly tech in my games unless I'm already ahead. But a lightbulb is good for it.

 

[coanda]

Philo. is a good semi-monopoly tech - you generally see one AI get it early for the religion, then the rest avoid it like the plague. And since the one who got it sees it as a monopoly tech and won't trade it, you can pick it up and trade it to the rest of your competitors fairly safely. Doesn't help if the one tech you want to trade for is only available from the guy who also got Philosophy of course.

Also, I like getting Philosophy because of fond memories it in Civ2. Perhaps not the best strategic reason, but there you go.