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More of the same district

Discussion in 'Civ - Ideas & Suggestions' started by Kabba QuzAi, Nov 10, 2016.

  1. Kabba QuzAi

    Kabba QuzAi Chieftain

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    V.2 - Specialized Cities
    When I watched the first videos and teasers I really thought this would be a thing.
    But it's not.
    It's kinda boring to think you are playing a specilized game but when you reach modern era every city has every district and that's it.





    Premisse:
    Specialized cities would make the game more realistic! The idea is to have cities with intention.
    Instead of reaching Modern Era with most cities having all districts and that's it. No differentiation!


    Right now we can only build one of each district in each town. Which really sounds vanilla good if you think game mechanics.
    But in reality it makes no sense at all! We should be able to build more of the same district in the same city!

    So we kinda pretend we are playing a specialized city game during the first eras. But when we get to the later eras it's evident
    how "the future" was not intensively tested or thought through! Checking the Atomic Age tech tree covered that early for us.

    At around 1500~1600 A.D. I get the feeling I'm playing with copies of the same city throughout my empire.
    Which is neither fun, nor realistic. Why can't we have a seriously specialized city? One that is 100% focus on science.
    The other one that is most far away bordering the enemy should be able to have more encampments, so it can build units even
    faster and REALLY provide enforced borders with the extra walls and district artillery (who has every built a fort for that? ¬¬)

    Some other examples would be a city with no rivers not bothering building commercial hubs, while one at the coast wanting to
    build 2 harbours and 2 hubs for example. It's so unrealistic to have us build many aerodromes scattered, when obviously
    real countries have huge specific airbases to produce airships. But it would still be up to you, if you want 2 cities each with one
    Or a single city with two districts that would have the plane done sooner, due to bonus production from both aerodromes.



    ------------------------o------------------------

    Specialized, but still complementary:
    At first it may seem like it could ruin the game by rushing a victory!
    Going all-in in science and reaching the stars sooner than anyone.

    But can our people really only live off our science output?


    Of course this mechanic would need to apply to every civilization in the game. I'm not looking for an easier game, but a more
    enjoyable one! Any rule, when applied to everyone will give no priviledges (hence it's meaning).


    And we have many fields to cover in the game. Civilization isn't only about science, or religion or culture. It's about, ok,
    having a focus, aiming at a victory but still being able to withstand the militaristic, the productive and most of the other aspects
    the game has. So having for example, every city only build campus districts may rend you open to a cultural approach or an
    invasion force.

    So to have a strong empire you would still definitely need to work on the other areas of the game. But that's when you think of
    your empire as a whole! Being ABLE to build many campi in a single city would simply make the land even more valuable, like
    the devs promised. With this change a city by the coast can specialize at commerce, and with the right adjustments a city
    can emphasise religion by being in the desert, or the tundras (which right now is not wanted terrain).

    By the mountains I'd want to build a city truly focused on science. On a city that I've already constructed two or three
    wonders why not have more theatres? And like the tile says this would be complementary, because we are not playing the
    one-city challenge, we are a civilization.



    ------------------------o------------------------

    Trading enhanced:
    Our inside network would be much more active, like in real life.
    Probably all our cities would get connected and not only for design purpose!
    Cities would actually need each other!


    Like the topic above said, cities would now be complementary. I'd probably want a trade route from my cultural focused city
    to a city I have that is filled with mines, industries and encampments to get all that significant production bonus these
    districts give to trading routes.

    And I'd not want to build entretainment districts in each city to help with growth and yields. I'd have a specific city designed for
    that. A center of fun and a possible great city to come get food from! Combined with theaters, campi or holy sites this city could
    provide great amount of food in internal trades. And could be a good invitation for other nations to trade with me.

    As the game is right now I don't really feel the need to create trading routes with another civ. The production I get from
    internal trade routes makes up for any other deal (Only Egypt has potential). I'm only sending one of my trade units away if I
    want higher diplomatic visibility/friendship.

    With this new mechanic having an international trading route can really help you meet your meta! If you are after culture,
    science or faith you have a better target now. A city that will be worth trading with!




    ------------------------o------------------------

    How would it work:
    City location would be more valuable, our planning and strategy would be more diverse and rewarding.
    Now we think which distric to plot first. But we already know how a complete city looks like!


    This change in the game mechanics will not disrupt harmony, the game will balance itself. There is no need to worry with the
    downsides. In my opnion it would simply be consequence of a more realistic approach, soon to be incorporated in our tactics.
    The population cap and the number of city tiles should handle the rest.


    Basically all that would need to be done is to allow cities to build more of the same district. And that's it, no fancy codding.
    It's this simple.

    Primarily this would make the game more realistic. But I've tried listing the pros and cons, here they are:

    Spoiler Positive Side :

    • Specialization (+)
    • Terrain even more important
    • More planning
    • City targeting
    • Having to adopt different approaches each campaign
    • Change of mechanics makes us want to play the game for longer

    Spoiler Negative Side :

    • Specialization (+)
    • Terrain even more important
    • More planning
    • City targeting
    • Having to adopt different approaches each campaign
    • Change of mechanics makes us want to play the game for longer

    Proposed mechanics:
    The basic idea was drawn, but this could get even more interesting.
    In fact, forget the park... and the blackjack!


    Well, so it doesnt go completely out of hand, I suppose. I propose that we could be able to build 4 of each district in the same city.
    Following by 4 of the same 1st building (library for campus), 3 of the 2nd building (unniversity for campus) and 2 of the 3rd
    (research lab for campus). And the aiport being considered a 3rd (instead of the 2nd) building for the aerodrome.

    This would entice players to build at least 2 of the same district as a form of specialization, and would give a small penalty if you
    plan on going super specialized (having a not 100% functional district).


    @Ryika proposed that we make projects more desirable and part of the specialization innitiative. It's a great idea and I've added it
    to the main topic as a cool addition. The idea is to not have projects being based on production output, but each district yeild.
    Science for campus project, gold for commercial hub projects, faith for holy sites and so on.
    Each project finished will
    increase this city output of the yeild (values to be tested, possibly 2% per project finished and projects get 10% harder to complete).




    If I had any idea how to code I'd probably want to try doing it, but I have no clue where to start. But that's what I think that need to be done:

    Code:
    City can build 4 Campus instead of 1.
    City can build 4 Commercial Hub instead of 1.
    City can build 4 Encampment instead of 1.
    City can build 4 Harbour instead of 1.
    City can build 4 Holy Site instead of 1.
    City can build 4 Industrial Zone instead of 1.
    City can build 4 Theatre Square instead of 1.
    City can build 4 Entertainment instead of 1.
    City can build 4 Aerodrome instead of 1.
    
    City can build 4 Libraries instead of 1.
    City can build 4 Markets instead of 1.
    City can build 4 Barracks/Stables instead of 1.
    City can build 4 Lighthouses instead of 1.
    City can build 4 Shrine instead of 1.
    City can build 4 Workshops instead of 1.
    City can build 4 Amphitheatres instead of 1.
    City can build 4 Arenas instead of 1.
    City can build 4 Hangars instead of 1.
    
    City can build 3 Unniversities instead of 1.
    City can build 3 Banks instead of 1.
    City can build 3 Armories instead of 1.
    City can build 3 Shipyards instead of 1.
    City can build 3 Temples instead of 1.
    City can build 3 Factories instead of 1.
    City can build 3 Musseums instead of 1.
    City can build 3 Zoos instead of 1.
    
    City can build 2 Research Labs instead of 1.
    City can build 2 Stock Exchanges instead of 1.
    City can build 2 Military Academies instead of 1.
    City can build 2 Seaports instead of 1.
    City can build 2 Worship Buildings instead of 1.
    City can build 2 Power Plants instead of 1.
    City can build 2 Broadcast Center instead of 1.
    City can build 2 Stadium instead of 1.
    City can build 2 Airports instead of 1.
    
    Campus project requires science to be completed.
    increases +2%   to city science output
    increases +10% to project cost.
    
    Commercial Hub project requires gold to be completed.
    increases +2%   to city gold output
    increases +10% to project cost.
    
    Encampment project requires production to be completed.
    increases +2%   to city production towards land units output
    increases +10% to project cost.
    
    Harbour project requires gold to be completed..
    increases +2%   to city gold output
    increases +10% to project cost.
    
    Holy Site project requires faith to be completed.
    increases +2%   to city faith output
    increases +10% to project cost.
    
    Industrial Zone project requires production to be completed.
    increases +2%   to city production output
    increases +10% to project cost.
    
    Theatre Square project requires culture to be completed.
    increases +2%   to city culture output
    increases +10% to project cost.
    
    Entertainment project requires production to be completed.
    increases +2%   to city production output
    increases +10% to project cost.
    
    


    - "I also want a city that could hold the Broadway with all it's glory. Filled with museums and theaters."

    - "I want a holy city, that in fact feels holy AF!"
    ----------------------------------------------------


    So! Could I ask someone to do this mod!? Would be awesome! Thanks~
    Spoiler Many thanks :
     
    Last edited: Nov 11, 2016
    NameArleadyUsed likes this.
  2. OranHarken

    OranHarken Warlord

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    I think this would lead to run away science or religion victories. Imagine a guy sitting in his isolated corner of the map with three science cities with 3 campuses each running for a hundred turns. He would be on Mars by 1492.
     
    Rup likes this.
  3. Kabba QuzAi

    Kabba QuzAi Chieftain

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    Not hard to currently reach space at 1500~

    It would just feel more realistic and even more specialized!
     
  4. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    Every district in every city? Nah Quite the opposite.

    I do not think you would have industry mixed with theater mixed with science all in the same city. I think they need to stop people mixing these 3. I mean new York has some science capability but is really the theater town with a theater district (not building) It would encourage spread and stop snowballing as well as being more realistic.
     
  5. Kabba QuzAi

    Kabba QuzAi Chieftain

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    I agree

    That's why I think that allowing us to build the same district more than once in the same city would help.

    Then we could have a NY with two or three theatre districts!!
     
  6. Namaspamus

    Namaspamus Warlord

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    I really would like more need for city specialization too. Not sure yet what would be the best way, but your proposal sure makes sense. Could you detail it a bit more?

    Maybe also more multiplicative local bonuses (like "+5% science in this city"), instead of additive ones, would incitate more to specialize... but I've not played enough yet to really form an opinion.
     
  7. Ryika

    Ryika Lazy Wannabe Artista

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    Having to build everything a second time sounds like really silly gameplay to me.

    For more specialized Cities I would rather increase the Population requirements per District to every fifth Citizen or so instead of being able to build multiple districts of the same type, and then rebalance everything from that PoV. You could even make it so that every time you complete the City Process associated with that district the District Yields increase a little bit. That way you can specialize a city heavily if you want (build district, do nothing but finishing the City Process over and over again and adding buildings to that district when they become available), but whenever you finish the process in a given city its costs go up.
     
  8. Kabba QuzAi

    Kabba QuzAi Chieftain

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    It's nice to see people interested. I'm surely going to work on this thread then! I'm happy with the feedback!


    That's a very nice idea!
    The problem with the "every fifth citizen" is that it will leave SO MUCH more room for farms and other improvements. And that will boost city growth to a point where we are not only back to the first problem, but now with huge mass productive cities.

    Spoiler :

    upload_2016-11-11_15-41-16.png

    upload_2016-11-11_15-41-47.png

    upload_2016-11-11_15-42-13.png

    upload_2016-11-11_15-42-40.png


    I think we need to keep on using the land, occupying it with districts. And if we want to have specialized cities there's no better way then allowing us to build the same district at least more than once!

    For example. A city founded next to a mountain range will probably end up having a campus and a holy site next to it. Which to me just seems SO dumb! I'd rather have a city with 3 campi.


    But the finishing city projects idea is great!
     
  9. Kabba QuzAi

    Kabba QuzAi Chieftain

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    Updated the first post!

    Thanks for all the feedback and ideas!
     
  10. civplay

    civplay Warlord

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    As of right now you may not have specialized cities but you have specialized areas of your empire. the way the game is set up, its best to build cities near each other and build industrial districts on top of each other. To be honest I think that's more interesting than having specialized cities.

    if you were to make unlimited of each district, you would need to nerf commercial and industrial districts. hammers are too important, and honestly the meta would be just massing commercial and industrial.

    first I would make food global, and all your cities grow based on that, with housing being the major indicator of growth. And I would make the environment even more of a factor on housing.

    I would combine religion/culture into one district, and add more bonuses from tiles, natural wonders, and wonders for religion and science. Additionally make it so science and cultural districts can't be built next to each other. So, you're really going to have to decide whether you want to specialize in Science or Culture/religion for that city.

    Next I would add some trade off between industrial and commercial districts. again increase environmental bonuses for both, and increase the adjacency bonus between harbors and commercial districts. This would make it so cities on the coast would be much better suited for commercial, and cities away from the coast near resources would be better suited for industry. Additionally I would make neighborhoods available much earlier in the game allow them to give huge bonus to commercial districts, maybe like +1 gold per 2 housing adjacency bonus. you shouldnt be able to build a housing district next to an industrial district.

    So this way the coastal areas of your civ would be more densely populated and more specialized for commerce and your inner cities would be less densely populated and more specialized for industry.

    You would basically have 2 sets of options, industrial or commercial, science or cultural/religious. That would give you 4 distinct kinds of cities you can build. I think this would be a good compromise between specialized cities and unspecialized.
     
    Kabba QuzAi likes this.
  11. Namaspamus

    Namaspamus Warlord

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    It's also the removal of National Wonders that takes away some of the need for city specialization. I wish they'd be back under one form or another (doesn't have to be like before). Also the switch from multiplicative to additive bonuses from all buildings.
    With multiplicative you want to stack them.

    And yes having specialized areas is good too
    I've not played much yet, does this work for other districts than Industrials?

    Agree with this, I like to have my "Venice" in my empire. Also I don't think sea trade routes are better than land ones any more, maybe they should.
     

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