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Most underrated civs

Discussion in 'Civ5 - General Discussions' started by inthesomeday, May 9, 2016.

  1. blitzkrieg1980

    blitzkrieg1980 Octobrist

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    Okay so you think are the best Civ on maps where they spawn next to tons of mountains with tons and tons of hills everywhere. But, for example, in my game where there are only about five or six hills adjacent to mountains and the rest of the land was pretty food starved except for one city spot maybe, they were okay. Mid tier IMO. And I'm not sure I understand the whole no maintenance paid for improvements on hills. I don't pay maintenance on improvements LOL except for roads. So that's really not a crazy boost IMO. Is the UA really all that crazy for warring?
     
  2. Red Menace

    Red Menace Prepare to be Menaced

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    stop asking questions.
    I do, I played an arctic start as the Incas pure tundra/snow amazing game 6 cities 20+ pop each, I sat in my arctic mountains watching as the AI's attacked eachother a very interesting game and that's why the Incas are so awesome, also in Vanilla civ most improvements cost maintenance so it made a big difference.

    I think their the best that's my opinion, I found Babylon boring and one-dimensional and Korea a bit better, didn't care for Poland much either.
     
  3. blitzkrieg1980

    blitzkrieg1980 Octobrist

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    Interesting. I don't really have a favorite Civ or leader so I guess I just found the Inca to be so so in my game. Perhaps if I had a game with so many mountains and hills it would be different.

    As for the maintenance and improvements... I don't play modded ciV except for enhanced UI and infoaddict. But I don't see any difference in Gold when I plop down improvements...
     
  4. inthesomeday

    inthesomeday Immortan

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    The roads are what it saves on and wide roads are a big expense. If you go commerce left then your roads on every tile are completely free and you can build a road on every single tile in your borders for defensive purposes if you want
     
  5. blitzkrieg1980

    blitzkrieg1980 Octobrist

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    I figured that was it. I was just confused as to why they didn't just say roads and rails are free. And don't forget that's only for tile improvements on Hills so you really can't build roads and rails on every tile just the hill ones. Still very cool though and I didn't think about that. I didn't realize that the Commerce bonus stacked with the UA.

    Edit: I actually didn't realize they were half cost roads and rails anywhere and totally free on Hills. I just thought it was free on hills and that was it. I guess I didn't read the UA that closely. So these guys really are great for wide play. Man I did play them wrong then! Half-price roads or free roads is a pretty strong bonus. The Terrace is really cool and I liked it a lot but it just seems it was so situational and I just didn't have enough Hills or Mountains for it to be that great. Maybe I'll roll them again in a map that has more Hills.
     
  6. noto2

    noto2 Emperor

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    Inca best civ? Thanks for the chuckle. I suppose you could generate maps with an insane number of hills/mountains where they would be one of the best.
     
  7. Matthew.

    Matthew. Deity

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    Inca were seen as the best generalist Civ. Well, they were before Poland was added to the game :p. The boost in food, hammers, and gold give an all-around strong empire to go after any of the victory types.

    Underrated may not be the correct term... more just ignored, but I will throw out Austria. CS bonuses scale rather poorly come mid to late game (when you are actually purchasing CS's). A Maritime's +1 food on your secondary cities is a rather weak incentive to keep it as an ally.

    The overall pros far outweigh the cons IMO.

    --Austria is one of the few Civs which can "expand" in mid game and still benefit from it. Most everyone else settles their core cities early on and stick with those until the end. It takes too long for later settled cities to catch up. Not with Austria. You start with a decent population and many of the core buildings already finished.

    --You get easy access to naval units. CS's love spamming naval units. This is potentially important, because when you unlock frigates/privateers you are often too busy trying to get up schools and factories or trying to win World's Fair to try and pump out a navy. And once you have them, it is just as easy to keep them upgraded to battleships/destroyers.

    --There is typically one dominant CS-hoarder who starts buying up all the CS's towards the second half of the game. If you get early rep from a quest or one time purchase gold dump, you can remove that CS from the game ensuring that same CS-hoarder has less dominant control over WC, can't declare war and flip CS aggression as easily, etc.

    The major con for Austria is they are basically forced into either a domination win or science win. It is easy to understand why they are ignored, since their domination perks tend to be focused towards mid and late game, and people would rather clear a map with horse archers than wait that long. For science, a lot of people prefer the straight up, clear, easy to read bonuses of extra science on specialists for Korea, as opposed to Austria's indirect late-game increase bulk science rate through mass horizontal growth for ridiculous GS bulbs. Despite those reasons, Austria performs surprisingly well on both fronts.
     
  8. Red Menace

    Red Menace Prepare to be Menaced

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    stop asking questions.
    Yes Inca best civ, and that map is called highlands its not the one I was using though, You say Korean (as a general Best Civ in most rankings) I say Inca.

    I was mostly sarcastic when I said the Inca were underrated just want to clarify I think that Denmark is Underrated, I dont like Poland I think there overrated as with the Zulus, Austria is cool though and Russia, I like bigger maps and tend to go for Civs that are good at expanding or are really Unique like Sweden.

    also In vanilla more improvements had maintenance I think so that also makes a difference as to there UA.
     
  9. yung.carl.jung

    yung.carl.jung Hey Bird! I'm Morose & Lugubrious

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    How could Poland ever be overrated? Everyone knows exactly what they do, everyone has examined it a thousand times. Poland is what Poland is. They have the best finishing times together with Babylon and Korea. They are objectively one of the best Civs for a peaceful Science Victory, no matter the map type, game speed, opponents, climate, starting position..

    Poland are strong for every single victory type. You get to finish Honor or Liberty faster for DomVs. You get to finish Rationalism faster for SV, CV and DV. You get your Aqueducts and your growth bonus faster than other civs. It doesn't matter what path you take, Poland will always offer a consistent, gamechanging bonus.

    They aren't overrated, they aren't underrated either. They're simply one of, if not the strongest Civ. I think there is no debate about this, it is pretty much unanimously agreed upon. If you look up the HOF stats for SVs, chances are all the top ones are with Poland, Korea or Babylon, because those are considered top Civs for a reason.
     
  10. Japper007

    Japper007 Prince

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    Nope, I've went Liberty with Gandhi multiple times and succesfully too. Sure its harder due to the lack of happiness but butter up a few city states and you're golden. Maybe it's because I mostly play Epic Speed/Huge maps and can therefore expand slower and have more time to fix unhappiness issues though.
    While I'll admit a castle isn't the most exiting build ever, This UB becomes pretty strong when you get to the modern age (Flight tech give two tourism per Mughal fort)and have two extra culture and tourism per city. In the early game the 2 culture yields as much as Amfi+Opera combo (they each have one culture), and this is before you have every culture city state on the map under your control.
     
  11. TheMeInTeam

    TheMeInTeam Top Logic

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    India is excessively underrated. UU is a guaranteed earlier composite bow that moves faster and costs fewer hammers. UA is quite good for conquest-oriented if keeping enough pop/capture, can quickly become a net happiness positive. This is not a top tier civ but shouldn't be scraping bottom or anywhere near it.

    Blast from the Civ IV past :p. If it were IV nobody would be laughing at the routinely HoF-banned civ.
     
  12. noto2

    noto2 Emperor

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    Oh lord it's been over a year since I've played Civ4 I actually forgot about the ridiculous Inca. I actually hadn't played the Incas in many years because I hated playing them in Civ4, it felt like cheating.

    Yeah I don't get the hate for India, I had some of my best science games with them. You don't want to expand early anyway, so it's a perfect excuse to wonder-whore. I'd often get the Temple of Artemis AND Fertility Rights pantheon, for +20% food in all cities, on top of the Tradition bonuses. Sometimes I'd even get the Hanging Gardens. Sure, I wouldn't put down my first expansion until T55 or something, but it was worth it. I got comfortable playing India where I could have about 6 cities and by the mid game I had unlimited happiness. Even with maxing food bonuses as much as possible and growing like a weed, I still couldn't use up my happiness.

    On top of that, it's good design imo. The civs should be more unique, like India. Playing India is really different from any other civ. They should all be like that.
     
  13. Red Menace

    Red Menace Prepare to be Menaced

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    stop asking questions.
    The Inca in Civ IV, the Warrior UU that was known as the doom of archers before Praetorians, pretty awesome civ just don't do earth 18 as them unless you're doing some self-challenge.
    well it usually involves a lot of :nuke::nuke::nuke: Gandhi is a cruel leader.
     
  14. TheMeInTeam

    TheMeInTeam Top Logic

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    Still pretty easy below deity if you are on epic speed or marathon (which is better for those 18 civ maps). You definitely don't want to settle in place though, and a speed run at something like GLH or Colossus is a game-changer there since the land is pretty bad.

    The peak tile makes Aztec bug out (can't actually attack you ever) but you can often just take them out later at convenience and then you have excellent quality land.

    I think Mali is actually worse on that map.

    As for Civ V, India is amazing for ICS after early goings if keeping pop up. They can definitely tradition wonder spam, but they can also push out of challenging starts fast with UU and if on high levels AI will have some grown cities limiting the damage from taking them due to your UA.
     
  15. Sclb

    Sclb Emperor

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    India is definitely underrated. Sure they expand slower but you can still go liberty ICS expand mode. All it takes is 6 pop for it to break even without even considering policy bonuses. The recent India immortal alphabet series shows how much happiness and growth you can get with India. It's something crazy like over 200 happiness.
    http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=14261030&postcount=15
     
  16. Red Menace

    Red Menace Prepare to be Menaced

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    stop asking questions.
    Earth 18 is really fun for most civs, Europe especially is a mess with all of those civs right next to eachother.
    but more importantly I find your support for India and this gift of nukes suspicious, are you Gandhi?
     
  17. blitzkrieg1980

    blitzkrieg1980 Octobrist

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    Europe on Earth18 in Civ4? Easiest games I've ever played. All those resources and amazing land. Early rush to conquer western Europe and block Catherine and go whatever victory you wanted. Or start as Rome and just steamroll everyone. Lots of fun memories with Rome on Earth18. I had to bump up the difficulty even in my earlier years just for a challenge!
     
  18. jayjackson

    jayjackson Warlord

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    That's because you don't laugh at Huayna Capac.

    Huayna Capac laughs at you! :D
     

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