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[GS] My latest wrinkle - Micro Trading

Discussion in 'Civ6 - Strategy & Tips' started by Mr_PeaCH, Nov 28, 2019.

  1. Mr_PeaCH

    Mr_PeaCH Chieftain

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    Want to preface this by apologizing in advance if what I'm on to here is something already widely adopted. But it feels new to me and it's absolutely changing how successful I am on higher difficulty. I tried searching a little but did not turn up anything here.

    I'm naming it "Micro Trading" and it's the way I am able to both accumulate more GPT in the early game while diminishing the GPT of the AI civs.

    Before I get in to the trading, I have to say it is highly dependent on some other, often random, successes that can be had early game. Ideally you want to quickly suzerain one or two CSes to get more Diplomatic Points rolling in. And you want to have quickly improved one or more Horse and/or Iron resources. Better still if you are not able to build Horsemen or Swordsmen yet and have no use for them.

    OK, so here's how it works. You're still in the early stages, have met the basic requirements in the previous paragraph, have met a few AI civs, and are working out your next moves. Who to try and befriend, who is going to sneak attack you, who is vulnerable to your taking them over. You start offering horses, iron and diplomatic favor for GPT.

    But wait, there's more! And this is the critical part. There seems to be a sweet spot, changes a bit with what era you're in, for the amount of your resources to trade. For example, you might outright offer 20 horses (assume to an AI who has room for 20) and they will give, say, 4 GPT. However, if you offer only 7 horse they will give 2 GPT. Offer 7 again, they respond with 2 GPT. Do it a third time; you've now parted with 21 horse but gained 6 GPT. Whereas if you'd sold 20 wholesale you'd only have gotten 4 GPT.

    If/when I have enough improved resource tiles and/or plenty of favor I find that I can bleed an AI civ dry in relatively few turns. I try to pick out the AI who has the biggest GPT to whittle down. In my current game, normal speed, I'm at turn 77 and have been trading with 3 AI civs for 10 or 15 turns. When I began, one, Spain, was generating over 30 GPT when I was at 3 GPT. After repeatedly offering them horses, iron, and dip they currently are earning 5 GPT and two other lesser earning civs are below that. I now have 43 GPT of which 33 GPT are from active deals.

    I sometimes have reservations about trading the Diplomatic Favor in particular, but there really isn't a great use for it early game most of the time, and lots of time still to make up for it. I will stop trading as many resources after I can build/upgrade my own units with them. But in the past I would simply let horse and iron fill up, top off, and you're prevented from accumulating more. So why not offer them up?
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2019
  2. Bangau

    Bangau Warlord Supporter

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    I do this all the time, but preferably not to the extent where I cripple the AI too much. Use it also to manipulate wars by trading the right resources to the weaker AI so the war will go on for longer. Like some countries do in real life. If I'm not gonna use the diplo points I mostly trade them away, there's often an AI or two who pay premium for it. I often stop doing this once my economy starts rolling, for it takes a lot of time to do it right and at a certain point it doesn't help you that much anymore. I recommend the Concise UI mod, specifically the trade screen part, for this: saves you a lot of clicks to make your trade deals.
     
    Mr_PeaCH likes this.
  3. Mr. Shadows

    Mr. Shadows Nomad of the time streams

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    You can sometimes get 11, 12 or even 13 gold (lump sum) for a single point of diplomatic favor. If you have the patience you can use the ai like an ATM. I frequently use deals like this to get the diplomatic bonus for favorable trade, but I don't have the patience to sell 50 diplomatic points one by one. You can make ton of money in the early game if you don't mind the tedium though.
     
    Fluphen Azine and Mr_PeaCH like this.
  4. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    Micro trading ruins my patience and my game.
    Pretty sad Firaxis allow it.
    1 trade per civ per turn and paltry amounts mean little to the rich.
    Dip favour trade seems part of the game design and am happy to trade it. Still coming up for medieval I’ll save some as that first vote may be 50% off science buildings if I can swing it.

    My big question is how the hell can one sell a commodity like diplomatic favour hundreds and thousands of years before the forum to use them has been invented :confused:
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2019
  5. Hrothbern

    Hrothbern Deity

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    yes indeed !

    And AI is so addicted to them that they will do anything to get those favs up to buying them on credit against hugely expensive interest rates cripling them in early game.

    At marathon speed:
    If you sell for example 3 favs at 19 gold, and 1 fav at 6 gold... and continue until they have less than 6 gold left:
    they will be happy to pay you for 1 fav 1 gold per turn during 30 turns which is in effect 30 gold per fav.

    It is the best way I know to hinder empire growth in the start of the game of far away AIs, out of reach of your armies or agressive encircling settling of your cities.
     
  6. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    yeah, as far as I am concerned this is a trading bug I do not use.
    The best way I have found to hinder and empires growth is go to war with them.
     
    Fluphen Azine likes this.
  7. Fluphen Azine

    Fluphen Azine What is Fluphen Azine?

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    I knew this was bad but geesh I didn't know it was this bad.
    I tried it in my current game and I basically took all 5 AI's lump gold that I met so far.
    Around turn 80.
    It also appears they will trade 1 DPT for 1 GPT.
    I went from little gold to +82gpt and a bunch of lump gold.
    It seems I could do this every few turns and they would do the same thing for Horses, Iron... etc etc.
    Talk about game breaking or immersion breaking.

    I don't look down on anyone doing this though.
    I would just like to know what people are doing when they play a game and share it with us.
    This way I can compare what I am doing wrong.
    When people get massive whatever so early I just want to know why am I not able to replicate what they are doing.

    I still believe that great players can get amazing benchmarks very early playing the game straight or somewhat straight.
    I read @Lily_Lancer 's game where LL got a fast SV with a bunch of special rules like no trade and no chopping not to mention others.
    Of course others complained that Warmongering was used and could be considered the worst exploit in the game.
    I don't want to get into a debate about what is an exploit or what is cheating.
    I am ok with however anyone wants to play or not play but I just want to know what they are doing to get things so fast :)

    Many times I see people post some amazing things but they don't explain what they did completely.

    I see what you are saying about the game being Dodgy @Victoria lol!!

    So I have to ask you all what is the answer?
    Do you just never trade Diplomatic Points with the AI??
    Should you just not Trade with the AI in general?
    If you trade with the AI should you attempt to make more reasonable trades??
    I guess it is all up to the individual but I see why players are posting threads with specific rules that they implement or play by.

    I have played the game with no trade and no chopping before but I find it boring or bland.
    However, I am starting to question myself if it is just a better way to actually play single player.
    I could never not warmonger as that is one of my favorite things to do in this game :)
     
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2019
  8. Fluphen Azine

    Fluphen Azine What is Fluphen Azine?

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    I kinda messed with this some more.
    Turns out if you liberate a Civ you can get 100 points of Diplo.
    Which translates to 1000 to 1500 gold depending.
    Of course the AI doesn't have that much that early but after you bankrupt them you can sell for 1gpt.
    I'm not advocating it but this is the topic and just mentioning it.
     
  9. Victoria

    Victoria Regina Supporter

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    The bug is to make an AI broke. Then they trade anything for 1GPT.
    If you do not do this approach then generally you are OK.
    There are some tricks around buying and selling as well, not sure how bugged this area still is.
     

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