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Nationalization Broken?

Discussion in 'General Balance' started by Trogdor5617, Feb 13, 2020.

  1. Trogdor5617

    Trogdor5617 Chieftain

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    I took Nationalization last night in a game where I had a large empire (Immortal, Huge, Epic, playing as Assyria) and the Praxiteles Materials Corporation founded. 15 turns later, I had built offices in all my cities. Each of these counted as two franchises, and I quickly had 150+ science in all my cities. My science exploded and I rode it to a very easy science victory, despite being wayyyyy below the Celts in power level. Is this working as intended? There seems to be no downside at all, and the wiki mentions a Franchise limit, which this seems to be bypassing. Has anyone else tried this? Is it working as intended, and if so, is it too strong for a second tier ideology? I honestly think it just won me a tough game single-handedly.

    First post, let me know if there's anything else I need to include
     
    crdvis16 likes this.
  2. kenneth1221

    kenneth1221 Warlord

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    ...I think we just found a candidate for replacing Great Leap Forward as a 3rd tier tenet.
     
    crdvis16 likes this.
  3. pineappledan

    pineappledan Deity

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    It's also entirely dependent on how large your own empire is, so it is a force-multiplier on your prevous conquests and expansions. A Freedom player can have 5 cities and max out their franchises. The same player with Order and nationalization would only have 10 franchises

    Nationalization removes all your foreign franchises, so it removes a big potential tourism booster. I would like the 3rd slot to go to something that helps Order get a CV, rather than something that actively hurts its CV potential.
     
  4. Trogdor5617

    Trogdor5617 Chieftain

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    Cool, just want to make sure I hadn't stumbled on an exploit.
    In that case, I think Nationalization is hideously powerful for a big empire and the right corporation!

    Right now, 31 city empire, 122 science per city... yeah it's working for me
     
  5. crdvis16

    crdvis16 Emperor

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    It might just need something to tone it down on larger than standard maps where the number of cities is so much larger.
     
  6. pineappledan

    pineappledan Deity

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    Under default map and player number settings, a 31 city empire means you have already won. The game isn't balanced for larger maps
     
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  7. Trogdor5617

    Trogdor5617 Chieftain

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    I didn't realize that! The game is balanced for the standard map size only?
     
  8. pineappledan

    pineappledan Deity

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    You should play the game however you want, but the community is focused on standard number of players, standard speed, and standard continents map size. That's what Gazebo uses to test. There's tons of small ways that the amount of continents, players, available space to expand, and many other factors can affect games. Making the game balanced for all possible setups would be very limiting for how you could design civs and mechanics.
     
  9. crdvis16

    crdvis16 Emperor

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    There are things that scale based on map size, though, right? Or only things that scale for game speed (standard vs epic vs marathon)?
     
  10. pineappledan

    pineappledan Deity

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  11. Rekk

    Rekk Emperor

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    Larger map sizes expect everyone to have more cities, so the tech and policy cost increases are reduced compared to standard maps..

    Or at least that was the case at some point.
     
  12. crdvis16

    crdvis16 Emperor

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    Perhaps nationalization could inversely scale with map size using those same hooks then? Though I imagine there are higher priorities for Dev time.
     
  13. Drakul

    Drakul Warlord

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    May i ask you what are your specs and do you get CTD in the late game ?
     
  14. Trogdor5617

    Trogdor5617 Chieftain

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    Funnily enough, on this one I got a consistent CTD about 5 turns before the completion of my last spaceship part... I don't have a super fancy rig, but it runs pretty well through most of the game. I would say on average I was getting 30sec-1 minute for AI turns; but I kind of like it while I'm doing chores (wash a few dishes, take a turn, fold some laundry, take a turn). Its a nice adulthood game.
     
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  15. SilentReply

    SilentReply Chieftain

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    So I just noticed that nationalization only gives one franchise per office now. Did I miss when this was changed? I don't remember reading this in change notes. A much needed change, but a very unfortunate surprise in my current game..
     

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