Nerfing RA's

[Helmling]

The customization forums intimidate me, so I'm going to ask here if there's an easy way I can modify an ini file or something to nerf RA's.

I'm thinking I'd like to limit them to DoF partners only.

 

[thadian]

i like your idea, it would show there is a measure of trust already in place before engaging this kind of a deal. and it would help against some of the slingshots but let me ask this of diety players.

Is it "dooable" on immortal and diety without RA slingshot manipulation? I know the map sizes increase difficulty, how much does this factor in? If there are 12 civ's thats 11 RA's each AI could make in addition to its own increased buffs.

 

[Calouste]

See the June/July patch notes thread:

Research agreements now give a tech boost instead of a free tech. Tech boosts start at 50% of the median value of all techs you can research. Can be boosted to 100% if you both start Rationalism and build the Porcelain Tower.

Note that it is the median value, so if you have more cheap techs than expensive techs available to research, you'll get 50% of a cheap tech.

 

[King_Course]

Yeah, Firaxis is on the ball thank God. Now maybe we can compare scores in GotM games in a meaningful way and not have these scores be completly useless.

 

[M_Sparkle]

looks like your nerf request has been answered

 

[spfun]

Yeah nerfed lots early, but with Porcelain Tower & 1st point in rationalism you get 150% of the median which is a buff for late game where RAs are the most unbalanced, now it will be worse with this combination which can be used as early as hitting Renaissance... Its just delayed the RA spam imo instead get by with GL+NC start & beeline to Renaissance while building the Porcelain Tower.

My occasional OCC games are still looking pretty good for the easy tech lead haha...

 

[BobDole]

Yeah nerfed lots early, but with Porcelain Tower & 1st point in rationalism you get 150% of the median which is a buff for late game where RAs are the most unbalanced, now it will be worse with this combination which can be used as early as hitting Renaissance... Its just delayed the RA spam imo instead get by with GL+NC start & beeline to Renaissance while building the Porcelain Tower.

My occasional OCC games are still looking pretty good for the easy tech lead haha...

Research agreements now give a tech boost instead of a free tech. Tech boosts start at 50% of the median value of all techs you can research. Can be boosted to 100% if you both start Rationalism and build the Porcelain Tower.

Will at worst be only as good as it already was, and I guess that's fair enough if you manage to build the Porcelain Tower and go into Rationalism.

Anyway, we all knew RAs have been overpowered since the game came out. This change should've been made a long time ago, but better late than never. They'll still be great, but not obscenely powerful, to the point where you sign them with EVERYONE, even if you think they might waste it with a DoW later.

 

[spfun]

My mistake, yeah just 100% increase with both, this change makes me very happy. I hated how good RAs were.

I will still probably try to get Porcelain Tower now & will still spam em abit, but won't go as overboard as i did ( like 95% of all money on RAs )

 

[MadDjinn]

I'm thinking I'd like to limit them to DoF partners only.

i like your idea, it would show there is a measure of trust already in place before engaging this kind of a deal. and it would help against some of the slingshots but let me ask this of diety players.

Is it "dooable" on immortal and diety without RA slingshot manipulation? I know the map sizes increase difficulty, how much does this factor in? If there are 12 civ's thats 11 RA's each AI could make in addition to its own increased buffs.

Aside from the actual patch change:

DoF only might be viable in a Deity game post-.275 given that the AI war with each other enough to ensure they aren't all friends. Actually, it might prevent the annoying RA signing 'right after I took your city' annoyances between AIs. (let alone becoming friends...)

It also means that breaking the RA = backstab, so a diplo hit ensues. So not a bad idea.

As is, before the next patch, RA spam scales with map size, so if there's 12 civs then the tech game is over once you can manage to sign RAs with each civ twice. (takes time to get the cash) -- unless the Arabian AI is in the game; they'll hit Future Era by turn 150.

edit:

so, even given the current change to RAs, the 'DoF' only concept might help prevent stupid AI RA spam and let you try to catch up.

 

[Agent Cooper]

Its just delayed the RA spam imo instead get by with GL+NC start & beeline to Renaissance while building the Porcelain Tower.

Shhhhh...!
If the developers read this, they will consider this another strate.. ahem, exploit
that needs to be nerfed into the ground.

 

[MkLh]

Yeah nerfed lots early, but with Porcelain Tower & 1st point in rationalism you get 150% of the median which is a buff for late game where RAs are the most unbalanced, now it will be worse with this combination which can be used as early as hitting Renaissance... Its just delayed the RA spam imo instead get by with GL+NC start & beeline to Renaissance while building the Porcelain Tower.

It may not be that easy to be first on Education anymore, at least not on Deity.

Besides once all early strategy options are removed, the early game may be so boring that no one bothers to play to the midgame anymore. I guess that fullfils the devs intentions.

 

[Randall Turner]

If someone had come to me and said, "Randall, write an algorithm to halve the benefits of Research Agreements", I might have come up with something like this.

I assume it's applied immediately on completion, ie, to your currently researching tech, I assume, with the normal science point "overflow" applied to the next one you select. Seems reasonable.

The only subtle part is that it "stacks". That's a new mechanic, ie, that the Porcelain Tower and Rationalism SP can modify RA output.

Porcelain Tower and Rationalism just got more powerful.

Edit: I think they're making it more important to stay "friendly", certainly like the positive modifiers. (Also the negative nuke modifier, we needed that.)

 

[Helmling]

I play on Mac, though, so it'll be a while until we get the upcoming patch. I'd still love to be able to limit the availability of RA's--maybe even after the forthcoming patch.