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Neutrinos faster than light confirmed?!

Discussion in 'Science & Technology' started by Loppan Torkel, Nov 18, 2011.

  1. Samez

    Samez ION GUNNER

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    Well I guess with infinite mass you will have some kind of singularity where the space time continuum is so distorted that faster than light won't make any sense at all.
    For faster than light you should be neither particle nor wave.
     
  2. ParadigmShifter

    ParadigmShifter Random Nonsense Generator

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    Guessing is not a good way to solve the equations ;)

    As your speed tends to c, your mass tends to infinity. The only way to go faster is to make your mass imaginary (i.e. proportional to the square root of -1). Then you can't go slower, though. Having complex mass may help ;)
     
  3. GoodGame

    GoodGame Red, White, & Blue, baby!

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    What part of our mass would you suggest is 'imaginary'?
     
  4. ParadigmShifter

    ParadigmShifter Random Nonsense Generator

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    None of it?
     
  5. Samez

    Samez ION GUNNER

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    I was assuming we have infinite mass and are not approximating it. With infinite mass, space time continuum should be so distorted that the classical definition of speed dx/dt won't make any sense.
    Just a guess, as the mathematics of Lorentzian manifolds (non euclidean) are currently beyond my abilities.
    You are right about guessing not being a good method for solving scientific problems but sometimes you have to start there ;)
     
  6. Terxpahseyton

    Terxpahseyton How much Parmesan to put on your umbrella?

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    So we "simply" need to put a stop the gravitation of an object? Or is that a different force?
     
  7. uppi

    uppi Deity

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    An object with infinite mass would just create an infinitely large black hole. Nothing suggests that black hole physics should not hold any more and black hole physics is described by General Relativity. GR excludes faster than light speeds for objects with real mass, so I do not see a reason why anything should be faster than light there.
     
  8. emzie

    emzie wicked witch of the North

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    My torso.
     
  9. GoodSarmatian

    GoodSarmatian Blackpilled Idealist

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    Mistery solved.
    It was a loose cable.

    Spoiler :

    Not so fast!

    An experiment that appeared to show matter could travel faster than the speed of light - flying in the face of Einstein's theory of relativity - may have been flawed, the journal Science reported.

    In the original experiments, subatomic particles called neutrinos blasted from CERN, the European Organization for Nuclear Research in Geneva, traveled 450 miles to Italy 60 nanoseconds faster than a beam of light.

    But researchers revealed that a fiber-optic cable connecting a GPS receiver and a "master clock" computer may have been loose, Science reports.


    Probably the disappointment of the year for the science world.
    :(
     
  10. GoodGame

    GoodGame Red, White, & Blue, baby!

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    Yeah I posted that a page ago. Are they sure the atom clock timing was off yet?


    http://articles.nydailynews.com/2012-02-24/news/31092982_1_neutrino-experiment-cern
     
  11. bombshoo

    bombshoo Never mind...

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    I seem to recall someone on the forum actually called that as the exact problem back when this story was new. I can't remember who it was for the life of me though.
     
  12. ParadigmShifter

    ParadigmShifter Random Nonsense Generator

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    Probably uppi?
     
  13. uppi

    uppi Deity

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    Yes. But my guess was not exactly right. I suspected a wiring issue in the timekeeping right away and posted that in the thread in the off-topic forum. That guess was a bit lucky, but that is the kind of subtle error that you expect in such a measurement and that are very hard to detect. And that's why we physicists always want to see an independent confirmation for results of this impact before believing anything.

    And although the error is a bit embarrassing, I cannot blame the scientists involved (except maybe for going to the mainstream media to soon, but the media stories were probably inevitable). To get the timing issues exactly right is a huge challenge, especially when there is no way to do cross-checks.
     
  14. PlutonianEmpire

    PlutonianEmpire Socially Awkward Goofball

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    http://lightyears.blogs.cnn.com/201...nstein-was-right-about-light-speed/?hpt=hp_c2

    [pissed] [pissed] [pissed] [pissed] [pissed] [pissed] [pissed]
     
  15. uppi

    uppi Deity

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    Why the angry faces? That was the expected result, especially after OPERA found timing errors in their measurement.
     
  16. Vylinius

    Vylinius College Student

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    I think he's mad about the fact that the speed of light wasn't broken.
     
  17. Disgustipated

    Disgustipated Deity

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    I'm happy it wasn't broken. It would shatter my beliefs about many things. Okay just a couple of things. Namely that space travel between galaxies is impossible.
     
  18. Olleus

    Olleus Deity

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    The lead researcher at Opera said that he had "lost confidence in the original data", which pretty much means he admits he was wrong. Not surprising of course, every single physicist in my university department was deeply sceptical of the results.

    "Never believe an experiment until it's predicted by theory" - Can't remember who said that
     
  19. uppi

    uppi Deity

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    Probably a theorist without a clue.
     

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