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New Beta Version - April 29th (4-29)

Discussion in 'Community Patch Project' started by Gazebo, Apr 29, 2021.

  1. jekke

    jekke Warlord

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    foreign core area
    works for me, however, there is a numbers mismatch: when I choose the spy action (initially) it says 300 science, but then I only get like 30 beakers. The latter number seems correct though (playing as England and stealing science in the ancient era).
     
    James Ryle and SwirlSlayer like this.
  2. saamohod

    saamohod King

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    I can no longer see which civs will like or dislike my Luxury Ban proposal. Intended?
     
  3. Recursive

    Recursive Covets Lands That You Currently Own Moderator

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    No, please post a bug report.
     
  4. James Ryle

    James Ryle Chieftain

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    This is the same for me as England. Ancient Era. It says I'll get 200 beakers but I only got 20. Other that this it seems to be working great. In the beginning I had a CTD whenever I clicked on my portrait but that stopped once I met other Civs.

    20 beakers does not seem worth it for the number of turns it takes. I was creating 15 a turn already. Probably it would have been better to use England's early spy to eventually ally a CS for its specific bonus and luxuries etc.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2021
    SwirlSlayer and youngsteve like this.
  5. Cat-du-fromage

    Cat-du-fromage Warlord

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    spy is bugged in multiplayer: i tested with a friend with VP only, start a game at info era and when i choose "poison food", my friend recieve this :

    and the event didn't pop off, worse i couldn't choose an other action preventing me to pass the turn (seems to be the same issue i saw on github : https://github.com/LoneGazebo/Community-Patch-DLL/issues/7796)
     
  6. Stalker0

    Stalker0 Baller Magnus

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    I'm having a dozen tiny bugs in this one. From text screen missing, to I click on a portrait and can't access the diplomacy screen, to now coal is not showing up on my map. I'm wondering if its a mod conflict at this point to some of the UI mods I use.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2021
  7. grmagne

    grmagne Warlord

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2015
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    Location:
    Toronto
    Was there any change to the minimum distance between cities?

    I've always increased the distance from 3 to 4, but in this version the AI is building cities 3 tiles apart everywhere on the map.
    SET MinDistanceCities = '4'
     
    vyyt likes this.
  8. skodkim

    skodkim Deity

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    Still waiting for a quiet period so I can start a new game and just wanted to know how the new version is (with hotfixes). Based on comments and Github one could get the impression that it's a bit wonky but that may be wrong (Don't want to offend anyone either - you doing a great job here!). Still problems with notifications? I'm using the EUI versions of the mod if that matters (get the impression that a lot of players who are having problems are using the non-EUI version).

    So what are you experiences?

    \Skodkim
     
  9. Stalker0

    Stalker0 Baller Magnus

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    Definately feels a little off, various bugs. I personally would wait if your not in a hurry.
     
    skodkim likes this.
  10. skodkim

    skodkim Deity

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    Yeah, I do see a lot of bug reports around :hmm:

    So for the devs: Any plans for an update? :dunno:

    \Skodkim
     
  11. Histomen

    Histomen Chieftain

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    Not sure if a bug or intended.
    Founded a pantheon and my capital failed to get it as the dominant pantheon. Every city i owned got 2 pantheon followers but since the capital was at 5 population, it didnt become active for that specific city.
     
  12. Stalker0

    Stalker0 Baller Magnus

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    So finally got to try out the city defense. And....I guess it worked? Its just so hard to tell anything is happening, I wasn't even sure exactly when the spy mission triggered (I did see the science steal notification so that is working now).

    Probably for these kind of missions, it would be good to have a notification pop up when the mission is 2 turns away or something, because its easy to lose track when you have so many spies running.
     
  13. Stalker0

    Stalker0 Baller Magnus

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    Just confirming which one of these notifications is correct? (my guess is the lower one is just not accounted for Era scale at the moment, and the 60 science is the "true yield").

    Spoiler :

    upload_2021-5-3_12-2-28.png
    upload_2021-5-3_12-2-49.png


    In terms of value, so current techs for me are 2270 science. So that means a tech steal every....lets say 20 turns (I actually think its faster than that initially but lets make a baseline), is worth about 113 SPT.

    If the 60 notification is right, I'm getting 30 SPT. Its better than the last version, but woefully weaker than spies previously. And remember this is England with the White Tower, this is as good as spies get!

    UPDATE: Actually I forgot its actually worse than that, as there is a turn or two of spy settlement time before they start the mission. So its actually more like 15-20 SPT.
     
  14. AndreyK

    AndreyK Prince

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    I think that now it better, I think techs stealing was just too much before, you have many spies, also science from CS quests. In previous versions spying was much stronger even than your own research. We may try to tune it, but let's not compare it to techs stealing.
     
  15. Stalker0

    Stalker0 Baller Magnus

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    I will respectfully disagree on this statement. Now you may be right that tech stealing was too good before, but that was our baseline, and so we must compare it to decide how strong we want our new spies to be. Should they be....50% as strong...75%....10%? Right now they are about 20% as strong on science as they were before, is that....good or bad?

    I personally don't mind that stealing is weakened, especially if stealing remains more relevant longer in the game. I personally think 20% of what it was previously is too low, probably 50-75% is what I would expect.


    So I will say the new kidnap mechanic is pretty neat, its the most fun "puzzle" of the new system, as you try to time your specialists and timings to get a good yield. For example, I am currently building a wonder, and used kidnap to make my engineers equal to my forge mines...so that allowed me to work engineer specialists but keep maximum pace on my wonder....cool I like that!

    Frankly I actually think we could drop the -X GPP and just keep the specialist boost mechanic. I ultimately think the -X GPP is just going to have bad mouthfeel when a player gets hit by 6 civs, and literally sees all of their GP progress go up in smoke (and based on the current system this will absolutely happen at some point). However, using your spies to set up a cool synergy is fun and interesting.
     
    Last edited: May 3, 2021
  16. AndreyK

    AndreyK Prince

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    How many turns takes your own research? How many spies do you have? I think that all spies dedicated to science steal should give about 50% of your own research if they ahead 2-4 techs, and more, if you many techs away.
     
  17. Stalker0

    Stalker0 Baller Magnus

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    I decided that the only real way to have music, was to kidnap ALL the musicians in the world! :)

    Spoiler :

    upload_2021-5-3_13-24-19.png


    The kidnap actually seems to be the best bang for my buck at this point. Running 6 culture specialists in my capital, that is 120 culture...+30% for my capital bonuses so its actually 156 culture. It takes 1 turn to kidnap, plus 1 turn to travel I think (eh I'll say 2 I need to pay closer attention). So ~+50 CPT, considering I have never had a culture boost option before that's pretty good.

    Update: The surveillance bonus is determined by some nebulous factors. So my total mission time for a security 1 city has ranged from 3 (1 turn travel, 1 turn surveillance, 1 turn mission) to 8 (1 turn travel, 3 turn surveil, 4 turn mission).

    So my CPT ranges from +50 CPT to +19.5 CPT....a full half the effectiveness depending on which security 1 city I happen to choose. Yeah that's too swingy to me.
     
    Last edited: May 3, 2021
  18. Stalker0

    Stalker0 Baller Magnus

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    So I can see that G added in some modifiers for policy and tech differences into the missions:

    Spoiler :

    upload_2021-5-3_13-36-43.png


    Here's the issue though, I have 0 access to this information until after I have planted the spy, and spent the turns establishing survelliance (which I just checked was 1 turn in one city, 3 turns in another....both of them security 1 cities so I have no idea why one is so much longer than the other).

    So all of this modifiers are just "magic", they are a surprise to me when I plant my spy and they have huge impact (changes the mission from 1 turn to 3....both in security 1 cities).

    This was the fiddly stuff I was worried about, it just makes things more and more opaque.
     
    DeAnno likes this.
  19. Gazebo

    Gazebo Lord of the Community Patch Supporter

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    The 'fiddliness' is purely a factor of what the UI is currently telling you. Those things can be tweaked. For example, right now hovering over a city's Security Level only tells the owner details - we can expose some of those details to the spy owner so you'd be able to tell.

    I'm working on some of these quirks for the next version, specifically the minimum speed of quests and the notifications. Also there was something weird going on in the current beta, the changes on my end didn't sync right with github and some WIP files made it in. Hoping to update tonight.

    G
     
    usadefcon1, Hinin, skodkim and 2 others like this.
  20. Stalker0

    Stalker0 Baller Magnus

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    Of course, to be clear my feedback is not "because of XYZ this system is terrible and must be burned by fire". Its simply, these are the things that I'm noticing that are problematic. I am actually going to do a more polished thread here in a moment, I'll take my stream of consciousness from my various post and try to give you a more concise bit of feedback.
     

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