New Beta Version - January 3rd (1/3)

[Gazebo]

Hey all,

And we're back! I've been busy collecting data and trawling the forums for information over the past few weeks. I now present the first new beta. This is a beta, primarily because there are a ton of balance tweaks here. I expect some will come as a surprise, others - based on feedback - shouldn't be such a surprise. Nothing is final, but I do appreciate testing before resisting.

Anyways, here's the changelog teaser, as the compiler isn't finished yet. I'll update this post when the compiler finishes.

Bugfixes

• Merged bugfixes and improvements from Infixo and Ilteroi (thanks!)
• Pushed through github issues list
• Major bugfixes for AI city specialization logic
• Major improvements to unit production AI
• AI should be a bit more aggressive overall, and a little more adaptive to shifts in the battlefield
• Fixed some bugs that caused the AI to DOW then bail out on their attack
• Adjusted some tactical postures
• Adjusted some voting logic for WC
• Tweaks to deal logic re: cities
• AI should be less likely to voluntary submit to vassalage
• Unit Cycler now looks for the nearest unit, instead of jumping around randomly
• Reworked Tech AI logic quite a bit - should be more tailored to strategic play.

UI

• Added ability to sort by XP Level in Military Overview

Balance

• General
  • Randomized Victories - now only randomizes between science, diplo, and culture. Unlocks at Atomic.
  • Difficulty Model
    • Removed Digs and CS TR historic event bonuses
    • Reduced GP bonus to /3 (was /2)
    • Removed local border growth bonus
    • Reduced AI barbarian combat bonus
    • Reduced starting units for Deity AI
  • Adjusted disbanding logic to be more aggressive and to function for AI properly
  • Can no longer indiscriminately gift units to CSs if they're at their unit cap (roughly 5 or so units per city)
• Beliefs
  • Pantheons
    • Earth Mother gives +1 Faith from Iron
    • Springtime gives +2 Gold from Plantations, but no Culture
    • Festivals gives +3 Gold from a Resource
    • Expanse gives 6 Production instead of 15 Food
  • Divine Inheritance and Theocratic rule now 10% for yield buffs (were 15%)
• Buildings
  • Increased maintenance costs for post-renaissance buildings
  • Removed maintenance from Stock Exchange
  • Barracks/Ikanda Science reduced to 1 (was 2)
  • Adjusted purchase cost formula a bit (should be a little cheaper late-game)
  • Bank - changed Caravansary/Mint bonus to local, increased to +3g (from 1)
  • Caravansary - reduced connection bonus to 10% (Was 25%)
  • Dropped Modifiers on CSD Ideology NWs to 5% (were 15%), 10% for Prodction on Hall of Honor
  • Culture Modifier on Opera House now 5%
  • Reduced pop science growth on University (but not Seowon) to 25% (was 33%)
  • Reduced science per citizen on Public School (but not Skola) to 1 per 4 (was 1 per 2)
• Wonders
  • Heroic Epic - +1 Production per 5 citizens in city added.
  • National Epic - added +15 culture when citizen is born in city.
  • Grand Temple - removed Golden Age, but buffed Temple bonuses to +2 (Was +1)
  • East India - now grants an extra trade route
  • Parthenon - gains 10% supply modifier for city
  • Terracotta Army - now flat 3 supply for city in which it is built
  • Himeji - loses free Scientist, now +1 supply per city.
  • Machu Pichu - Reduced gold bonus to 15% (Was 33%)
  • Oracle - free social policy gone - now grants 300 Golden Age Points and Culture instantly
• Civs
  • Huns - UA now 75% chance to capture barb in encampment (was 100%)
• Corporations
  • Reduced modifier for Trader Sid's TRs to 25% Gold (was 50%)
  • Reduced modifier for Firaxite TRs to 50% Science (Was 100%)
  • Giorgio and Firaxite Office bonus reduced by 1 (now +2 culture/science per office, respectively)
• City-States
  • Reworked bully metric, removed tiering (now scales direcly from power) and made the proximity bonus tighter
  • Adjusted production/growth modifiers
  • Have fewer starting units at higher difficulties
• Improvements
  • Pastures: +1 food (fresh water) at Mathematics, +1 gold (no-fresh-water) at civil service
• Units
  • Units purchased with gold now receive half of the potential XP from the city (so if a city has a barracks, you get 7xp, not 15xp)
    • Can be disabled in CBO if desired.
  • Increased Guided Missile Damage (150, from 100), can only attack units (and attacks garrisons alone when hitting cities)
  • Great Merchant WLTKD now 10 (was 20)
  • Great Engineer - reduced potency of hurry base value, but increased production boost from manufactories (20%, from 10%)
  • Naval Ranged units are now all a base 1 range
    • Much like the artillery conundrum on land, the shift to 2 range dramatically changes the naval landscape, too much so.
  • Naval Ranged units now get access to Splash I/II (from Targeting III)
  • Captured military units start at 25 health (was 50) - nerf to Huns, Prize Ships, etc.
  • Moved Nuclear Sub to Robotics

• Specialists
  • Specialist food costs increased by 1 (so starts a 3, goes up using old formula in the same linear manner)
  • Removed 1 Engineer from Trainstation
  • Removed Civil Servants from CSD NWs (3 total)
  • Removed 1 Scientist from Military Academy
  • Removed 1 Engineer from Factory
  • Removed 1 Merchant from Stock Exchange
  • Removed 1 Scientist from Seowon
  • Removed 1 Scientist from Monastery
  • Overall: potential specialist slot amounts are roughly equal (not taking into account extra slots from UBs)

• Techs
  • Light adjustments to tech costs in light of balance changes

• Policies
  • Progress
    • Opener- Dropped Science from pop to 20 (Was 30) and retroactive to 15 (was 20)
    • Organzation - moved TR bonus to Fealty (Burgers)
    • Expertise - dropped Production to 10% (was 20%)
    • Equality - Happiness per is now 15 (was 16)
    • Finisher - Now 15 per Citizen (was 20)
  • Fealty
    • Burghers - Trade Routes to Civilizations with more Techs and/or Policies than you generate +2 Science and/or Culture.
  • Tradition
    • Buffed base yields from unique buildings (+5 food/gold, +4 science/production, +3 faith, respective to each building)
  • Industry
    • Opener - now 10 Gold per building (was 15)
    • Reduced production/gold bonus on Division of Labor to 2% per building, but added Forge and Airport (so 10% total, but more spread out)
  • Rationalism
    • Reduced GA Science to 5% from Enlightenment (was 10%)
    • Reduced Science from GWs to 2% (was 4%) on Academics (still caps at 20%)

I'll post the new version once it finishes compiling.

Update: fixed compiler, here's link: https://mega.nz/#!vINRHZYZ!vVTIvV-17qTBOAIqZlBlwzxzZQVDPrbvedk-aZVNoIA

Note that this is not savegame compatible.

Cheers,
G

 

[Gothic_Empire]

• Removed maintenance from Stock Exchange

This ruins the entire game. Might as well destroy all computers.

 

[Gothic_Empire]

Progress got nerfed pretty hard. It was unquestionably the strongest opening AND the strongest late-game option, largely because of specialists.

This will also make Mastery a more appealing religious choice.

Does Zealotry still bypass the exp-from-purchasing-units malus?

 

[Gokudo01]

This ruins the entire game. Might as well destroy all computers.

I dont understand the specialist changes ? !
They will start now at +2 yield and cost 3 food right ?

 

[CrazyG]

Specialists

• Cut Specialist base yields by 1
• Specialist food costs increased by 1 (so starts a 3, goes up using old formula in the same linear manner)

Rest in peace tradition? I know that late game specialists were overperforming, but this primarily hits early game specialists (which were a fine trade-off). Why would I work a 2 gold, -3 food citizen? Those buffs don't compensate.
Also, that is a lot of nerfs to progress. Like a lot

 

[Gothic_Empire]

Specialists

• Cut Specialist base yields by 1
• Specialist food costs increased by 1 (so starts a 3, goes up using old formula in the same linear manner)

Rest in peace tradition? I know that late game specialists were overperforming, but this primarily hits early game specialists (which were a fine trade-off). Why would I work a 2 gold, -3 food citizen? Those buffs don't compensate.

I'm gonna try it out with Arabia or India when the patch goes up. I suspect that the answer to your question is "because great people are meant to be that valuable" but I've never really played with a "rely on great tiles" strat.

 

[Infixo]

Is it 1-2 on github master or you will commit more?
I will test pantheons, I see you fixed all 3 issues, great!

 

[Stalker0]

Specialists

• Cut Specialist base yields by 1
• Specialist food costs increased by 1 (so starts a 3, goes up using old formula in the same linear manner)

Rest in peace tradition?

Overall, I actually like the vast majority of changes. This is probably the patch I have initially agreed with the most in a long while.

But my exception is this. You didn't hit specialists with the nerf bat...you crushed them. I'm all for reducing some of their late game yields, even in favor of removing some of their slots in the late game.

But now, specialists are worthless for a lot of the game. 2 yields for 3 food is not worth it early on. Late game its fine because the cities have grown to a comfortable place. But early game that food still important, and these yields not worth it.

 

[CrazyG]

Overall, I actually like the vast majority of changes. This is probably the patch I have initially agreed with the most in a long while.

But my exception is this. You didn't hit specialists with the nerf bat...you crushed them. I'm all for reducing some of their late game yields, even in favor of removing some of their slots in the late game.

But now, specialists are worthless for a lot of the game. 2 yields for 3 food is not worth it early on. Late game its fine because the cities have grown to a comfortable place. But early game that food still important, and these yields not worth it.

Exactly. This change primarily hurts specialists in the ancient and classical eras (which were not too strong)

 

[Gazebo]

Does Zealotry still bypass the exp-from-purchasing-units malus?

Yes, it does.

I dont understand the specialist changes ? !
They will start now at +2 yield and cost 3 food right ?

No, that's actually a typo. I tinkered with it, but reverted the specialist yields to 3 when I decided to just remove a bunch of slots and increase food. Forgot to remove that log bit.

Specialists

• Cut Specialist base yields by 1
• Specialist food costs increased by 1 (so starts a 3, goes up using old formula in the same linear manner)

Rest in peace tradition? I know that late game specialists were overperforming, but this primarily hits early game specialists (which were a fine trade-off). Why would I work a 2 gold, -3 food citizen? Those buffs don't compensate.
Also, that is a lot of nerfs to progress. Like a lot

Specialist thing was a typo. And Progress needed the nerfs. I've got quantitative data to highlight it.

Overall, I actually like the vast majority of changes. This is probably the patch I have initially agreed with the most in a long while.

But my exception is this. You didn't hit specialists with the nerf bat...you crushed them. I'm all for reducing some of their late game yields, even in favor of removing some of their slots in the late game.

But now, specialists are worthless for a lot of the game. 2 yields for 3 food is not worth it early on. Late game its fine because the cities have grown to a comfortable place. But early game that food still important, and these yields not worth it.

See above.

Exactly. This change primarily hurts specialists in the ancient and classical eras (which were not too strong)

See above!

G

 

[Grabbl]

• Unit Cycler now looks for the nearest unit, instead of jumping around randomly

Hallelujah You just fixed a problem I would never have thought to mention, but I might reenabling auto-cycle finally.

Also, balance changes look really great in general! Can't wait to try it out

 

[Gazebo]

Hallelujah You just fixed a problem I would never have thought to mention, but I might reenabling auto-cycle finally.

Also, balance changes look really great in general! Can't wait to try it out

Send the cheers to @ilteroi, not me!

G

 

[Gazebo]

Using the changes above, I've ran about 10 AI games. Continents, Pangaea, King-Deity difficulties, standard speed, etc. In all games, three or four AIs vied for the top-tier in terms of power and score. Rarely was the tech or policy divide wider than 8 techs or 3 policies. Very diverse and interesting armies, hitting much harder much more often. Late-game yield bloat (esp. gold bloat) is significantly reduced, which is good!

G

 

[Gothic_Empire]

I'm officially intimidated. Will report back.

 

[glider1]

Thanks for the randomized victory changes.
Yeah for the unit cycler,
Thanks for keeping the xp scaling with game-speed,
Thanks for continuing to improve the AI.

 

[kawyua]

all of this looks great!

 

[Rekk]

Using the changes above, I've ran about 10 AI games. Continents, Pangaea, King-Deity difficulties, standard speed, etc. In all games, three or four AIs vied for the top-tier in terms of power and score. Rarely was the tech or policy divide wider than 8 techs or 3 policies. Very diverse and interesting armies, hitting much harder much more often. Late-game yield bloat (esp. gold bloat) is significantly reduced, which is good!

G

How are city states performing with keeping their units upgraded? Are they still trying to defend their borders with units 2-3 eras behind their neighbours?

 

[pineappledan]

A lot to keep on top of for our mod! we'll have to roll with the punches.

• Removed 1 Engineer from Trainstation
• Removed Civil Servants from CSD NWs (3 total)
• Removed 1 Scientist from Military Academy
• Removed 1 Engineer from Factory
• Removed 1 Merchant from Stock Exchange
• Removed 1 Scientist from Seowon
• Removed 1 Scientist from Monastery
• Overall: potential specialist slot amounts are roughly equal (not taking into account extra slots from UBs)

Am I missing something here or is that last bullet point a typo? How is the number of specialist slots equal when you dropped them from 9 buildings?

 

[Gazebo]

A lot to keep on top of for our mod! we'll have to roll with the punches.

Am I missing something here or is that last bullet point a typo? How is the number of specialist slots equal when you dropped them from 9 buildings?

Equal across types.

 

[pineappledan]

Ahh... I thought you meant the total number had been left unchanged