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New Civilization -- Texas, California, Deseret, CSA

Discussion in 'Rhye's and Fall - Dawn of Civilization' started by clanky4, Dec 21, 2015.

  1. soul-breathing

    soul-breathing King

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    CSA win in 1936AD, scenerio 1700AD, monarch, epic

    Spoiler :



     
  2. 2015

    2015 Chieftain

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    Strategy? Also try California, I tried it and I just couldn't beat it.

    Also one day when Leoreth can make civil wars, I hope the CSA can actually be a civilization in the mod
     
  3. clanky4

    clanky4 Emperor

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    Updated the file with Leoreth's V1.13.0 Save Game Patch, Buttons for UBs, and Mormon founding pedia info.

    For those who have tried the civs out were they balanced? I found Texas was disproportionately disadvantaged compared to the other civs. Mainly because it was crammed between US and Mexico, and later Deseret/California.
     
  4. duckstab

    duckstab Child of Noble Family

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    My gut reaction is that Texas seems OP - the UHV is too easy.

    Also the CSA UHV seems ahistoric. The Confederacy did not have territorial ambitions northward, but they did aspire to extend slavery to Cuba, Central America, even the Amazon. So I think their UHV should reflect that.
     
  5. Tigranes

    Tigranes Armenian

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    They certainly wanted to defeat Union in some way, if they could only capture Washington and another major "New England" city -- that would give them what they wanted. I suggest to mark the designated territory with a tool tip label, like Leoreth does with labeling of the UHV related tiles.

    Also, it's too bad the main mod does not explore the idea of Permanent Alliances, which this modmod could utilize. In case of RT and CSA such permanent alliance is simply due. Otherwise, from pure gameplay point of view it makes sense for CSA to rival RT even more than Union. Same is true for RT in relation to CSA.
     
  6. 2015

    2015 Chieftain

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    Don't know how much you can change this but can you make the Texas colors a little less like Argentina? Maybe light blue/black would be better :)
     
  7. soul-breathing

    soul-breathing King

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    Use Autocracy and Mercenaries. Initial units are enough to conquer the DC and Indianapolis to get horse and iron. Then buy cannons and cavalries, easy to destroy USA. Then you can attack Mexico to get 4th cotton.

    It's impossible to win as Texas on regent or monarch, for you can not get combustion before 1901. Some AI can, but they also can't get 2 oils before 1901. California also the same, you can not get Mass Media before 1912. Utah is possible to win, but waste of time.
     
  8. clanky4

    clanky4 Emperor

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    I heard about them allegedly trying to destabilize Mexico, and either trying to colonize or fleeing to brazil near the wars end.

    I wanted at least one of the UHV to have something to do with the civil war, it was originally "Never lose a city to the Union before" some random year. But it didn't really work and required no real effort from the player since the US is in such a bad position, and goes right on building buildings here. The AI does not take active wars seriously.

    Yeah, I couldn't find the bit in the pythons. I'll take another peak. I was going to have the CSA flip texas, but since they never seem to die, it would just turn into a two front war.

    Less Buenos Aires Blue more Texas Teal.

    Would 1950 for texan oil(some date from oiligarchy) and 1977 for california Hollywood(Star Wars) give the player enough time? I'll run a passive test to see how quickly I can get combustion and mass media for texas/california.

    I wasn't really sure about the first Deseret UHV. You pretty much automatically get it since no one else has Joseph Smith can found Mormonism.
     
  9. 2015

    2015 Chieftain

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    So I was trying as the Confederates (on marathon) and the war v.s. the Union is really nice!! Only suggestion is that the Sharpshooter gets buffed a little or the sharpshooters that you spawn with get promotions because they, alone, are terrible against the union army. Plus the production of the South is garbage so you're pretty much not able to build units during the war, only buy them or fight with the starting units.

    Even then, with some strategy the war can be won. The real problem is with Texas; they declared war on me as I was about to finish off the Union in Chicago and raced into my territory with Rangers, taking cities with no defenders (I should have had units in my cities but I was running low and I knew once I took Chicago, America's western territories would fall so I didn't think to defend my cities).

    My suggestion is to buff spawn units and maybe give a little more or to just disable Texas' spawn when trying to spawn as the Confederates.
     
  10. soul-breathing

    soul-breathing King

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    1950 and 1977 maybe suitable for both, but I need to try it. You could change the deadline for a try, I think.

    As for Deseret, my idea is give a missionary to AI deseret, then can found Mormonism by missionary.
     
  11. ezzlar

    ezzlar Emperor

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    I think Confederates would be good as a "seljuk" civilization. Unplayable and at war with everyone. They have starting troops but bad production and will so lose in the end.

    It is a way to create a united states of America faster since all those south cities (french etc) would flip at once to the Confederates and then get conquered by the north.
     
  12. Pavel Chichikov

    Pavel Chichikov King

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    I like the Seljuk-style idea for main game, but balance-wise it's a bit dubious since American under the AI is extremely weak.


    Do you have any evidence for that? My impression was the Confederacy was quite isolationist, just as the American South mostly is now.
     
  13. Tigranes

    Tigranes Armenian

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    Ever heard about William Walker? He conceived the idea of conquering vast regions of Latin America and creating new slave states to join those already part of the United States. These campaigns were known as filibustering or freebooting.
     
  14. Pavel Chichikov

    Pavel Chichikov King

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    No I had't, I'm pretty hazy on pre-20th century American history. The wiki article doesn't mention anything related to that except for his distinction in the American-Mexican war.
    I'm surprised by the Latin American claims, I always thought The Confederacy only wanted to secede from the union. Also, I assumed Lee had planned to eventually deport the slaves back to africa as Lincoln also planned to do before his assassination.
     
  15. Tigranes

    Tigranes Armenian

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    You should read another article, which has a large quote by Southern partisan George Fitzhugh. Looking down on Mexicans did not start with Trump, you know :lol:
     
  16. Pavel Chichikov

    Pavel Chichikov King

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    'Wars of conquest waged by the strong against the weak, with little or no provocation,' fulfills our idea of filibustering. Alexander the Great was a filibuster, for, without provocation or pretext of injury or offence, he conquered a large part of Asia, and part of Africa and Europe. Yet he was a benefactor of mankind, for he diffused Greek civilization—the highest form of civilization—throughout many countries, whose civilization, always very low grade, was then rapidly decaying. Julius Caesar was also a filibuster, for, for he conquered Gaul pretty much on his own hook, alleging the flimsiest pretexts for his conduct. But he civilized and Latinized Gaul, and the civilization which he planted and engrafted remains to this day....

    Well, he rather summed up the driving principle behind all games like this tbh.
    He's somewhat right about Mexico and Latin America generally... that whole region has always been such a chaotic mess. For a while it seemed like Argentina and Brazil had finally gotten their ish together, but it seems that was temporary. Not that Armenia is any better, though in fairness it's a mountain rump-state surrounded by neighbors from hell.
     
  17. Imp. Knoedel

    Imp. Knoedel Properly Paranoid Proletarian

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    Relevant background music:


    Link to video.

    And of course the influence and meddling of the United States, the world's greatest imperialist, has absolutely nothing to do with that. :rolleyes:

    Even if I conceded there to be such a thing as benevolent imperialism, the Confederate scum would definitely not be among the entities that would conduct such a thing, instead they would bring the opposite of progress and civilization to all it conquered.

    It makes me sick that to this day there is a significant portion of the American populace that seeks to whitewash the crimes of the racist slave-driving regime that launched the most bloody war the US ever experienced on its own soil, but that shouldn't surprise me. The US have a history of being absurdly merciful to those who least deserve it (i.e. the racist redneck rebel scum and Germany) while relentlessly bullying other nations who never did anything to them (e.g. all of Latin America, Vietnam and Korea).

    The only reason I would download this mod (nothing against this mod specifically, I didn't download the Equestria mod either, I just don't like adding more and more civs and imo DoC already has way too many, looking at you, Canada!) is so I could properly wipe the Confederate scum off the face of the Earth as the Union.

    Also I lol'd @ the idea of Lee wanting to send people back to Africa. The whole point of the war was so the rich white plantation owners could keep exploiting slave labor! "But what about MUH STATES' RIGHTS", someone might ask, to which my answer is, "Yes, the states' right to oppress and exploit black people first and foremost, that indeed was the driving force behind the American civil war." (Also normally Americans are absurdly paranoid about the government/state interfering with their affairs, but suddenly it is a-okay when it seeks to literally keep a certain group of people working as actual slaves? What?)

    Sorry about that rant, but I just can't Confederate apologists, which are the closest thing America has to Germany's Neo-Nazis.
     
  18. sebzilla

    sebzilla Warlord

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    Other than American neo-Nazis, of course.
     
  19. Imp. Knoedel

    Imp. Knoedel Properly Paranoid Proletarian

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    Yes, but technically American neo-Nazis seek to emulate the worst parts of another nation's history, not their own.
     
  20. clanky4

    clanky4 Emperor

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    This mod was originally only intended to add in the Mormons and Texans. I thought a late game religion would be neat and Texas is the only civ added by this pack which was a an internationally recognized country. California and the CSA were added because they were also around during that time.

    And I mean come on


    Link to video.

    Even Lincoln liked the song.
     

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