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New Firaxis BE blog "Systematic Destiny"

Discussion in 'CivBE - General Discussions' started by SupremacyKing2, Apr 16, 2015.

  1. iki

    iki Warlord

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    Oh you're the scientist that was on the live stream the other day? First thank you for explaining about Hubble and how you can tell about exoplanets. I really wish my mathematics was good enough to do more than look at pictures or through a telescope.

    Do you think there's any class 3 Civilisations out there? I'm using the Kardashev scale ( so using one galaxy's resources to power another )

    Please write more fiction or and this is slightly presumptuous of me more YouTube about astronomy it would be fascinating.

    Thanks again
     
  2. groorg1

    groorg1 Chieftain

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    The fun part of astronomy is that you don't need mathematics to get the concepts. It's really great to puzzle out the stories behind the crazy objects we see in the night sky.

    I don't know if there are any Kardashev 3 civilizations. There's definitely no evidence for them and some small amount *against*, but it's not certain by any stretch. And if there aren't, maybe we'll be the first!
     
  3. SupremacyKing2

    SupremacyKing2 Deity

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    I almost went into astronomy but went for a masters in physics instead. But astronomy and the kardashev scale in particular have always fascinated me. Personally, I think reaching each level is much harder than we think which is why we don't see any evidence for them despite the Milky Way being so huge.
     
  4. twilson1972

    twilson1972 Warlord

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    The thing is firaxis wants to make money.

    Now the majority of people who buy civ games are ultra casual and certainly dont post on forums about the games etc, they probably play on prince (or the equivalent in BE) and enjoy bashing the AI etc

    And there is nothing wrong with that! but it means things that frustrate me (and i suspect others) such as incompetent AI and shallow diplomacy probably dont hurt their sales much at all.

    From what ive read here, the AI is no more intelligent in BE than civ 5- and for me the ai in civ 5 is more dumb than in BTS...

    So i think we will see a move to civ iterations that look better and better initially and may have 'wide' features, but are more shallow than previous games. In other words, emphasis on grabbing ultra casuals and their cash
     
  5. Minor Annoyance

    Minor Annoyance Deity

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  6. twilson1972

    twilson1972 Warlord

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    Of course, i wasnt criticizing their desire to make money :)
     
  7. joncnunn

    joncnunn Senior Java Wizard Moderator

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    Moderator Action: Let's get back to the topic of this thread: Discussion of the BE blog "Systematic Destiny"
     
  8. groorg1

    groorg1 Chieftain

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    I agree with this completely -- the Kardashev scale has only 3 levels, which sounds innocent enough, but each level represents an advance in power production of a factor of 10 billion! That's 10 orders of magnitude. For those who don't know, the scale was a conjecture in the 1960s about the tech level of a civilization in terms of the amount of power it could generate:

    Level 1 - uses most power reaching Earth. Equivalent to the amount of energy the Sun radiates on the Earth. It would be like if we had nearly 100% efficient solar panels covering every square inch of the earth.

    Level 2 - uses the full power of a star like the Sun. Equivalent to building a sphere of power panels around the Sun and collecting the full energy.

    Level 3 - puts these spheres around every star in the entire galaxy, after drifting around on spacecraft and settling everything.

    Level 3 is pretty crazy to imagine, and that's what I was arguing that in the video we have a small amount of evidence *against*. But that's a pretty modest statement.
     
  9. iki

    iki Warlord

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    As I remember there's a modified scale that has 1-5.

    But now as I'm not an expert I did see one galaxy consuming another but I'm unsure how common this is.

    I'm not sure I read it but this article claimed it was kind of proof of a galaxy spanning Civilization using the resources of one galaxy to feed another or it could be viewed as something completely different maybe a hyper black hole. Probably all bunkum though about the galaxy eating civilization.
     
  10. MasterEcabob

    MasterEcabob Warlord

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    Loved the story, it really is amazing how close we are to discovering habitable worlds, even if we'll never actually be able to reach them.

    I found it interesting that the story ended with the beginning of the Supremacy ending. In AC lore, we know that the Transcendence victory was made to be the canon ending, but with BE it is more ambiguous. Perhaps all three victories (or four, if you count contact) happen, and we only saw the Supremacy side of things? Very interesting either way.
     
  11. iki

    iki Warlord

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    Technology can come a long way in 20-30 years, when I was 12 tablet pc's were only on star trek now most households probably know someone or have one, or have seen /used one within the west. A driverless car was a thing of fantasy now within a few years I can see them becoming the majority. Heck if I can ill definitely get one I think Nvidia are working on some new one with a car company.

    I think we are on the cusp of a new Technological Revolution who's to say cryogenics won't advance to a point to sustain human life within 20-30 years I can't. There will be a pill within 10 ish that would have saved my mother's life from cancer.

    I can only hope that Joel writes more fiction. It would be interesting to get some sort of narrative from one of the new sponsors.

    There's a Russian scientist who believes he can record who you are and save it into a hologram soon so immortality might not be so far fetched via cloning
     
  12. Doviello

    Doviello Warlord

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    I just finished reading Asimov' Foundation series, all 7 books. Good times. The stuff going on in the last two books makes the transcedence victory seem of little ambition.

    But it's funny that they depend almost exclusively on nuclear power, and later on, from gravity; they don't harvest power directly from a star; at least, i can't remember any example. So, even with 30 million colonized planets across the galaxy, they aren't even a lvl 1 civilization, technically. Otoh, these books are from the fifties, and solar power wasn't a thing back then.
     
  13. Lord Tirian

    Lord Tirian Erratic Poster

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    The Kardashev scale is more about the energy a civilisation can harness not really the source of the energy. Planets and stars are just good benchmarks of how much energy they receive/emit, so a level 1 civ harnesses about about a hundred petawatt, a level 2 civ a few hundred yottawatts and a level 3 civ a few hundred million hellawatts (all sustained, of course).
     
  14. SupremacyKing2

    SupremacyKing2 Deity

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    That is just an anachronism due to when the books were written. The Empire in the Foundation series would still be a level 3 civilization since it has colonized the entire galaxy.
     
  15. Doviello

    Doviello Warlord

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    I see, so it's more about total output, makes sense. Still, going a bit off-topic, i thought the fact that the books are so old and most of the tech described in the story was kinda, how can i say, outdated-but-super-efficient, quite charming. Everyone reads paper-newspaper, and there was a paragraph were Asimov described an automatic door with a little bit more details than necessary :cool: I couldn't stop imagining the starships with the interior of old german submarines, filled with levers, dials, periscopes and colored buttons, with zero computer screens, except it's in space.

    The starships of Sid Meyer Starships, supposedly the future of BE, are more Star Trek'ish, with the crew standing up and looking at a huge screen.
     
  16. groorg1

    groorg1 Chieftain

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    It took almost a year but I can announce more YouTube astronomy!

    The Great Photon Escape:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tSO8evHlafA
     
  17. KrikkitTwo

    KrikkitTwo Immortal

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    colonizing a galaxy=/= harnessing all its energy

    If we developed a cheap means of rapid interstellar travel and discovered habitable worlds around all stars, then we could colonize the galaxy and only reach about type 1.

    Just because you colonize a planet doesn't mean you are getting as much energy as its star puts out.

    Chances are a civilization won't reach type 2 without colonizing the galaxy.
     
  18. Acken

    Acken Deity

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    Took me a while to see that thread was from 2015 :X
     

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