...but that would mean it also couldn't be captured either. Then again, once it's there, it's there I guess. There wouldn't be a point to capture it nor have it in a city. If it keeps barbarians out, then it wouldn't matter who owns the territoy inside it.
Actually, what would be areally interesting is if you went and razed the civ that built the Great Wall, if noone else colonized the Area then barbarians+their cities might spawn inside it ... unable to get OUT. (not very likely but a funny situation)
It could also be made to act like a River (so -25% to attacking across it if its in enemy territory), for some additional bonus.
It all depends when the great wall comes. If it appears with masonary (unlikely) then it will be very very good. If it comes with construction (more likely) then its pretty pointless as all barbs are dead anyway.
The sad thing is if it comes too early, it will be built while you are still expanding. That could get a little tedius. On the other hand, maybe it wont be so bad because you at least know that that area inside the walls wont ever have barbarians in there, so you could afford to be a little lax on you defenses there. I do hope the Great Wall is not a drain on resources though (computer resources - memory and graphics, that is).
Krikkitone said:
Actually, what would be areally interesting is if you went and razed the civ that built the Great Wall, if noone else colonized the Area then barbarians+their cities might spawn inside it ... unable to get OUT. (not very likely but a funny situation)
That would be good. That would make for some interesting defensive setups. I think it should also allow the units there to have zones of control so that units cannot simply walk right on over the wall and straight pass the defending unit. Maybe also allow the defending unit to attack units without leaving their tile if they win (so they stay in the defensive position if they win the battle). Maybe a combination of these ideas. Or maybe it would be a bit much having them all.
Hello There... The Great Wall seems a bit usless assuming that the tech needed to build it is probably (as it was in civ3) Construction. By the time construction is researched there aren't many barbs around anyway. I agree with the motion that the wall should also work like rivers, giving defenders a defensive bonus behind it or possibly giving units trying to cross it a movement penalty of one or something like that...
Hello There... The Great Wall seems a bit usless assuming that the tech needed to build it is probably (as it was in civ3) Construction. By the time construction is researched there aren't many barbs around anyway. I agree with the motion that the wall should also work like rivers, giving defenders a defensive bonus behind it or possibly giving units trying to cross it a movement penalty of one or something like that...
Could someone clarify how first strike works? If you have one first strike chance, does that mean you get one free attack to cause damage, which may or may not succeed, before you start damaging each other in melee?
An archer with Drill II would then get 2 chances to hit first, and one guaranteed shot that will always hit and do damage? Add 2 XP and Drill 3 and he gets 2 more chances to hit which may or may not succeed. Add 5 XP and Drill 4 and he hits 3 times, then tries to hit 4 times, all before you can take a whack at him?
Unless you are immune to first strikes, of course. In which case I recommend stacking Spearmen and Pikemen with your Archers.
Protective looks interesting, but it loses most of it's effectiveness after Gunpowder is discovered. That being said, a 6 xp Cannon with 3 free shots plus 3 possible free shots plus collateral damage would be...
there are a couple of articles in the strat section of the site. sorry i can not remember the exact or have a link. i read it early last week. good luck.
Well, the whole game doesn't model the Mongols 'correctly' so I doubt they're losing any sleep over that now. It'll probably just be some sort of military building...
Remember that this game is a fantasy. Did England build the pyramids in London in the year 400BC? No, that's not a "correct" history, but again, remember, this game is a FANTASY. The game is about CHANGING history, not repeating it.
As it applies to the Mongols, we play with the Mongols as if they became a civilization that settled cities like so many others. We can give Writing to a civilization that never had it, and take a civ that never made it to the last century to the stars.
The real issue is that we aren't given the option to make ANY civ become nomadic and warlike in the style of Mongols of old. We are allowed to make the Mongols (and others) more "civilized", but we can't make the Spanish into a marauding tribe of nomadic conquerors?
Now THAT would be an interesting choice to make...
The real issue is that we aren't given the option to make ANY civ become nomadic and warlike in the style of Mongols of old. We are allowed to make the Mongols (and others) more "civilized", but we can't make the Spanish into a marauding tribe of nomadic conquerors?
Now THAT would be an interesting choice to make...
Wow, great news and additions that benefit my playstyle .
As always it is far too early to draw conclusions about balance issues, if they leave charismatic this way other traits have to be balanced out accordingly.
The mobile bases in the Mongolian scenario leave a great tool for mods I guess.
And great generals/ vassal states new militaristic traits ... I as a warmonger will have wet dreams until I get my hands on a copy.
Rant: when will they ever implement the Habsburg empire as civilisation in a civ game? They would *only* be important for Ottoman conquest, Napoleonic conquest and WWI scenarios. I mean Vikings, Gallics and Zulus are so much more worthy civilisations
Rant: when will they ever implement the Habsburg empire as civilisation in a civ game? They would *only* be important for Ottoman conquest, Napoleonic conquest and WWI scenarios. I mean Vikings, Gallics and Zulus are so much more worthy civilisations
Even though the Hapsburg empire was a dynastic thing rather than the basic model for other 'civilizations', I must say, I agree (Ottomans are technically only one group of Turkic tribes). I recently put a post on the WWI scenario thread and I'll say it again here: CIV has always been a bit too nationalistic. In CIVIII the concept of nationality bugged me, because that form of personal loyalty to a 'nation-state' did not exist broadly until the eighteenth century and the French Revolution, and even then it was a European thing. The Hapsburg empire, Russian empire, and numerous multi-'national' states survived and prospered quite well until nationalism made significant inroads.
Maybe (for experienced modders and designers, unlike myself) one of the major effects of discovering the 'Nationalism' tech should be the growth of national identity in citizens. This would make trading cities much easier in the earlier to mid-game, but harder in the later game, and also make war and conquest more difficult against a civ with a developed national consciousness (and of course, it would be more historically accurate). This might also be extended in the new vassal state diplomatic arrangement - those civs with nationalism would produce unhappiness if their government acceded to being a vassal, whereas those without would go along more easily.
Does anyone think that the camp will be the 'unique building' for the Mongols in the epic game? Maybe replacing the Barracks? I don't know what it would produce in the modern age though, it would be hard to imagine a moveable 'camp' spitting out tanks or mechanized infantry...I think it would have a useful 'range' of time like a UU.
And is any civ going to have Industrious and Philosophical or is that just not going to happen ever?
These will be actual units that you keep to the rear. They spawn military units for you once they sit still for a turn or two. On a side note, treat these units like gold. They are defenseless, so you will need escorts to stay with them. As for spitting out tanks and infantry, no worries. This is a time-limit scenario, so you have to move quickly.
Happiness is incredibly important in this game on high levels. Charismatic would literally increase the maximum output of your civ by 50% (4 citizens to 6) in the early game.
A size-6 city doesn't have 1.5x the output of a size-4 city. Typically, in the early game, a city produces (hammers plus food) equal to 3 for the core, plus 1 for each tile worked, plus 2 for each resource tile worked. Take a city with two developed resources (fairly typical)---the production increase from size 4 to size 6 is roughly from 11 to 13, which is +18%, not +50%.
I modded the Industious civic to give Drill 1 and 2 to all archery units. The results were... impressive. Archers with Drill 1-4 are quire powerful, at least against those pesky barbarians.
Still have to try them out against axemen, though. And Drill 4 siege units scare me - haven't modded that yet.
And I think it -25% upgrade cost for Charismatic, not XP for new level.
I modded the Industious civic to give Drill 1 and 2 to all archery units. The results were... impressive. Archers with Drill 1-4 are quire powerful, at least against those pesky barbarians.
Still have to try them out against axemen, though. And Drill 4 siege units scare me - haven't modded that yet.
I am still up in the air about whether it's siege that gets the Drill promotions or whether it is just Artillery itself. Thinking about it, the later would make more sense - otherwise it would be used more aggressively (unless of course the Protective trait represents a preference to look after the units, thus minimising sacrificing strategies). In the later stages, Artillery could be used to defend cities against big stacks.
Ex Mudder said:
And I think it -25% upgrade cost for Charismatic, not XP for new level.
How have you reached this conclusion? All the text I have read says it's -25% cost of promotions. I will admit, my initial reaction was that it was the upgrade cost, but since being corrected, it makes more sense that it is a -25% experience cost for promotions.
It would be great if Firaxis could clarify what "-25% cost of promotions" means and whether "Artillery" includes all seige unit (minus the Machine Gunner) or only Artillery itself, so we can put this topic to rest.
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