new mintemen = super prachinas?

[bonafide11]

They already have two UAs. +1 sight on all land units and half-price tile buying. I still don't see a great deal to recommend America, they're a grab bag of, "That's nice, I guess" abilities that come up for limited periods of time in specific situations. They get good scouts, but that period of the game passes quickly, and the Shoshone can make a playstyle out of that far better than they do.

+1 sight is nice enough in military applications (especially one artillery show up), but you can usually have another unit move up one hex, spot whatever you want to shell, shell it, then move the scouting unit back again. So +1 sight is nice, but not anything that holds a candle to Shaka's cheap promotions, or Germany's cheap army, or a real warmongering unit.

They get a fast musketman who generates golden age points. Not only is the musketman a not-particularly-good unit type in the first place, the "ignores terrain" aspect of him isn't always useful, and golden age points are not that valuable. Compare this to the Pracinha, whose golden age points are much more valuable since they get extra Tourism and Great People out of them. The Minuteman is just a lacklustre unit with a bunch of non-focused bonuses tacked on.

Then you get the B17. It's a bomber that's less likely to get shot down. Firstly, I can't remember a time when I was using bombers that I didn't have air-superiority. Sure, I wouldn't turn down extra evasion, but it's not a huge bonus. Secondly, the game's almost always decided by this point. The fact that you've got bombers at all tends to indicate that you're going to win, not the fact that they're B17s.

America has lots of small bonuses that don't focus them in any particular direction. They have two unique units, which would indicate that they're a warmonger, but they don't really get much in the way of bonuses to help them wage war. They can buy tiles at half-price, but you hardly do that in your average game. They get extra sight, which is good for short bursts of the game and merely convenient for the rest. They get extra golden age points and a slightly upgraded musket dude. They get a good bomber.

None of it has any focus. Sure, you can do well as America, but really you'll be doing well in spite of your civ choice rather than because of it.

I couldn't have said it better. America is just a hodgepodge of random mediocre bonuses that really don't help you in any one particular way. They're probably the worst designed and least imaginative civ in the game. Just a very boring civ to play as.

 

[cinattra]

Holy cow! I just realized from reading everyone's commits is that America is how I play. I will give them a shot as I can't remember the last time I played them.

 

[Splify60]

I will be honest, it's been ages since I played America, mostly because I'm Canadian

But, I am thinking half price tile buys is a VERY nice trait to have. I play on deity, and find myself needing to buy a lot of tiles...

As I said, haven't used them in ages, but maybe it's time to dust them off again...

 

[Matthew.]

Yes, I purchase quite a few tiles myself. I'd say an average game I probably drop about 500 gold on tiles, so save about 250 with America. It isn't game-breaking, but it is better than the Krepost

They are usually underrated, but still a mid-tier Civ either way. Even with the new minuteman changes.

Also don't forget B17's come with city siege 1, which means quicker air repair (can actually get it from start with enough xp buildings). Not a huge deal since it comes quick either way, but still something to consider.

 

[Splify60]

Yes, I purchase quite a few tiles myself. I'd say an average game I probably drop about 500 gold on tiles, so save about 250 with America. It isn't game-breaking, but it is better than the Krepost

Agree, 250 isn't game breaking, but when you save it is quite crucial, since it's generally speaking early game, which makes a huge difference. That money can be spent on a worker, or half way to a water mill or a library for a quicker NC, having an extra 250 early game can be huge. Especially on deity where every little bit helps. Also, to be able to buy that crucial 3 food tile when you have met 1 CS instead of two is also a huge help to early growth.

Don't know my numbers, but I am betting I spend more than 500 on tile buys in a game... Will keep track next time.

 

[Gort]

If 250 gold per game is a big deal to you, let me tell you about a civ called Spain...

 

[Eadigit]

I think they should give all the civs a unique building or improvement, two unique units is very unimaginative and lends less variation in play.

 

[llamapower]

To me, trying to rationalize how the Golden Age bonus fits with America, the only thing I can think of is how America supports, honors, and celebrates their troops. US is a militaristic civ, and has fought wars pretty much for the nation's entire existence. There's a lot of fervor for supporting the troops in pretty much every war. Just think of commercials for the army, posters in WW2 saying to support troops/war effort, memorial day/veterans day, etc.. I'm no historian, but I'm sure there were similar things for earlier wars as well.

So it seems like this Golden Age bonus can fit that behavior, in how American's are very supportive of and celebrate their troops.

I agree with everything you said. BUT it should then have been a UA for the civ and not just the minutemen UU

 

[Splify60]

If 250 gold per game is a big deal to you, let me tell you about a civ called Spain...

Heh heh, yeah, I basically quit if I am the first to find Eldorado with them... I mean, buying 2 settlers, game is basically over...

 

[SirWinston]

i don't think that the Minuteman should have gotten the exact promotion as the Prachina. It makes them less unique.
Either the Minuteman should use a weaker version or it should be lost with upgrade and the Prachinas should get a buff (cheaper in Production/Foreign Land Bonus or something like that)

 

[jasper]

To me, trying to rationalize how the Golden Age bonus fits with America, the only thing I can think of is how America supports, honors, and celebrates their troops. US is a militaristic civ, and has fought wars pretty much for the nation's entire existence. There's a lot of fervor for supporting the troops in pretty much every war. Just think of commercials for the army, posters in WW2 saying to support troops/war effort, memorial day/veterans day, etc.. I'm no historian, but I'm sure there were similar things for earlier wars as well.

So it seems like this Golden Age bonus can fit that behavior, in how American's are very supportive of and celebrate their troops.

minute men were troops that fought during the revolutionary war. minute men fought for "American" independence. winning independence seems like it fits with a golden age.

 

[seancolorado]

Always loved America as a civ. Love em even more with the new bonus. I've heard the arguments against them and I'll just never sympathize with them. At all

 

[HaloCapella]

that ability for minutemen is really not a good idea. They were already great as they should be. It should only be for Prachinas.

they should've fix the UA abit instead.

 

[FeiLing]

I've written this somewhere before: The game would probably much better if rush buying settlers in general was not possible. That would also instantly fix Liberty and put it kinda on pair with Tradition. And then you got room for an awesome UA which could very well go to America: Can rush buy Settlers.

 

[headcase]

I've written this somewhere before: The game would probably much better if rush buying settlers in general was not possible. That would also instantly fix Liberty and put it kinda on pair with Tradition. And then you got room for an awesome UA which could very well go to America: Can rush buy Settlers.

Nice. I think there should be a tech that allows buying settlers, but America would still have an advantage not having to wait for it.